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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Sun Apr 10, 2016 9:58 pm 
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I'm sending out some 7/8oz promo loads to be tested to see what the pressures really are with modern components...I loaded gun club hulls, .890oz of shot, rem rxp20 wads, ched 209, and 11.7gn promo ...my 3/4oz loads are the same but with 12.0-12.2gn of promo and cb1075-20 wad so I backed the powder off a bit and used the rxp wad which generally requires more powder than the aa20 to achieve the same velocities and pressure so in this case it should give a better chance of getting a 7/8oz promo load I'm 20ga with a close to safe pressure level ...I'm not going to use this load and don't encourage anyone to try it ...stick to 3/4oz max! This is just for testing to see how high a simple 1/8oz of shot can spike pressure messing with 12ga powder in 20ga



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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Sat Oct 01, 2016 5:21 pm 
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Just had to bring this excellent thread back to the top. I've been studying it for a month and just got done shooting some loads I put together.2 3/4"Federal Hull and wad,Winchester 209 primer,13.8 grains of Green Dot (2 pinto beans underneath the shot :mrgreen: ) with 11/16th of a oz. of Magnum 7 1/2 lead shot. Very low recoil out of my Red Label and Ithaca 37 although it is a bit dirty. It does a very good job of breaking clays to 35 yds with the modified and 40 or a little better with full. I'm very pleased with performance, and this will be a cheap practice load. Probably could shoot 16 yard trap if you got on em quick.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 2:57 pm 
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hehe, - The ¾ ounce "thread of justice", - I love it.

Also, don't forget the Vectan powders for these ¾ oz 20-gauge loads.

If you're Ok with 1200 fps, Vectan's A1 (loosely similar to Green dot) works :

Image

For 1250-1325 fps, Vectan's A0 is the better choice :

Image


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 4:14 pm 
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Repub - Thanks for the above post. I am going to try loading a few flats with A0 and see how things compare to 20/28. 20/28 availability has improved lately, but nothing like having alternatives. {hs#

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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 6:25 pm 
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Nice! Not many folks had shot the vectan in 20ga when I was writing this, glad to finally see some good info!


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 9:22 pm 
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Dave in AZ wrote:
Nice! Not many folks had shot the vectan in 20ga when I was writing this, glad to finally see some good info!
I thought you had got this thread stickied.

I petition that it should be.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2016 11:18 pm 
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Well, it got stickied, but then someone came through and undid all the stickies and just put a link to them in a single thread called "TOP THREADS Incl. Tips and Tricks for all major reloaders".

There's a link there in the first post I think ;)

I'm working on 3/4oz STEEL SHOT loads right now, I like that you can make a nice decoy 20ga load that fits well in a 2.75" hull.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 6:15 am 
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Dave in AZ wrote:
Well, it got stickied, but then someone came through and undid all the stickies and just put a link to them in a single thread called "TOP THREADS Incl. Tips and Tricks for all major reloaders".

There's a link there in the first post I think ;)

I'm working on 3/4oz STEEL SHOT loads right now, I like that you can make a nice decoy 20ga load that fits well in a 2.75" hull.
Yea, I decided this year the Mossberg 20ga will be the "paddling around in the yak gun". It's just the right size to fit in the rod holder and light and fast enough for jump shooting teal.

Let's talk about your load. I've been using one built on the CSD-20 and Alliant STEEL, 3/4oz of #4 steel in Rio hulls

I'm considering ITX for the 20ga but haven't made up my mind yet.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Mon Oct 03, 2016 7:22 pm 
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That'll be a separate thread. I've sent 10 loads in for testing in the last month all seven eights and 400 grain loads in a CSD 20 wad so little if any filler is needed. Three 1 ounce load using the Sam one wad in a 3 inch hull also. Was hoping for 7/8 oz in 2.75" going >1450 but that's still overpressure so far w csd.

Just did bpi invincible load in 20ga this weekend. 7/8 hw13#6 at 1640 or so. Worked well on ducks.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2017 8:28 am 
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Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:37 pm
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My favorite 3/4 ounce load is 14.5 gr Alliant 20/28 with a CB-1075-20 wad in a Remington STS hull. It shoots soft and it will run my Beretta 391 Sport.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:29 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 22, 2013 2:28 am
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I have Win AA CF old style hulls,win AA20 wads.I can use Fed 209 or Win 209 primers.
I would like to load 3/4 oz loads.I have Herco powder.How many grains of Herco should
I use and which primer?


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 9:12 am 
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Contact Alliant
http://www.alliantpowder.com/questions/default.aspx

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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2017 12:42 am 
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From various Alliant books. This one is 1995.
20ga 2.75" Win-Western AA type shells (Win AA CF)
7/8oz shot, win209 primer, WAA20 wad, 16.5gr Herco, 9600psi, 1200fps.

Same with CCI209 primer, 10,200psi.
CCI209M primer, 17.5gr Herco, 10,000psi... THIS one totally doesn't make sense to me as the magnum primer should boost pressure and its another grain of powder, but less pressure... I wouldn't trust that datapoint, but it's there.

Just drop down the shot charge to 3/4oz, it will be safe and give more speed and less pressure. Herco is a bit slow for 3/4oz, they usually use Unique and Green Dot for those loads in the old manuals.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Wed May 10, 2017 8:16 pm 
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Loaded some 20 ga 3/4 oz with Green Dot and first box I tried was 25 straight. Pretty pleased with that. The load:
Remington GC hull, 3/4 Rio #9, CB1075-20 wad, Cheddite primer, 13.6 Green Dot.

It even cycled my Standard 1100 20 ga.

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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 2:52 am 
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I've been running the same thing almost on my MEC9000 with perfect crimps:
Rem GC, Win209, 13.8gr GreenDot (#24 bushing for me), CB 1075-20, 3/4oz #9 shot. Actually 338 gr, my bar throws #9 shot slightly heavy.
Based off the various Alliant loads of the same except they use Ch209 or Rem209P primer and max at 14.2gr.

Today I went to try the new Rem ACF hulls with the same recipe on the MEC9000. Strangely it was crimping too deeply for them! I was getting 0.075-0.085" deep crimps instead of .055" I get on the GC hulls. Had to back the center plunger on the crimp off several turns, then good crimps. Didn't expect that with the ACF, thought they were the very same... unfortunately I had reloaded all my GC hulls so couldn't measure OAL to compare.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Sun Aug 20, 2017 3:42 pm 
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Just another Remington ACF (American Clay and Field) vs. GunClub note...
In 12ga, I just loaded about 1000 of each sort. Some were 7/8oz using the CB 0178-12 wad, some were 3/4oz using the CB-0175-12 wad.

In all cases, the ACF crimps were averaging a little shallower. The GC, for which my MEC9000 was set, was exactly 0.055" depth, measured over 20 shells or so. But the ACF in 12ga actually gave about 0.035-0.040" depth. This is the opposite of what I found in 20ga. I had to turn my final crimp center punch down about 1 turn to get 0.055" crimps. This used up a bit of plastic that had been in the fold, resulting in a wee center hole on some, too small for a #9 shot to get out. So I then also increased my pre-crimp by about 1 turn to get rid of the center hole.

I'm mostly shooting 3/4oz #9 shot loads in 12ga now, or 3/4oz 20ga, for skeet. Finding the Rem ACF as good as the GC, which are my favorite hull so far. Haven't loaded a small batch that many times yet to see longevity, as I'm churning through 1250 hulls each time.


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2017 7:40 pm 
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Is there a 7/8 load for STS hulls and Green Dot? None are listed in Alliant's reloaded guide, but I have 16# of the stuff. I am using it for 3/4 loads.

GF


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:06 pm 
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Galaxy Flyer wrote:
Is there a 7/8 load for STS hulls and Green Dot? None are listed in Alliant's reloaded guide, but I have 16# of the stuff. I am using it for 3/4 loads.
GF

Galaxy, Alliant has removed GreenDot for all 7/8oz loads except in the large Federal hull. There were a lot of reports of 20ga tubes (inserts for target 12ga guns) that were cracked from GD loads. Basically a 20ga tube insert is the thinnest weakest insert you can put in a 12ga, and they weren't hacking the published pressures. Alliant decided to pull the data, whether it met SAAMI or not, for the Rem and Win hulls. It was all around 10500-11500 psi to start with.

SO... if you shoot 20ga tubes, the answer is for sure no. But...
IF you shoot a regular 20ga and accept that GD loads are at the higher end of saami pressures (I like that, clean!), THEN you could make the personal choice to use the old data published by Alliant and Hercules for 7/8oz GreenDot loads, before folks started using 20ga tube inserts. Not the "maximum conservative only use most recent published" answer, but one I am OK with making for myself alone.

Green Dot is my favorite powder for 20ga (I've got 16# too lol!), and like you I'm using it for 3/4oz loads. If you find the old Alliant books (google them), say 1995 or 96, you can find some recipes... but they're still pretty sparse and with Rem209p (weak) primers, hulls aren't quite the same, etc. If I had to do it, I'd load a light 7/8oz say 370gr, and I'd load 0.5 gr less than listed and go chrono them to see if I was OK with the speed. There's a recipe published for CCI109, Rem RXP hull, WAA20 wad, GD, 1155fps 10700psi. So none of the original Rem recipes were for fast loads anyways.

Or you could just load up 3/4oz of #9 shot for 430 pellets vs. 7/8oz #8 shot 353 pellets, if you're shooting skeet. If you're doing sporting you could use #8.5 for 360 pellets in 3/4oz, and use a 1250fps recipe, getting the same pellet energy approximately as the #8 pellets at 1100 fps you'd probably end up with trying a 7/8oz recipe. That would be a better solution probably ;)


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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 10:15 am 
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..


Last edited by 16'er on Thu Nov 02, 2017 4:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: The 20 gauge 3/4 oz Thread of Justice
PostPosted: Thu Nov 02, 2017 2:55 pm 
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woodward wrote:
Win. AA hull, CB 20ga. 3/4 oz. (green) wad, 14.0 Green Dot, W 209. Perfect crimp with PW press.

Hi, numerouz posts earlier in the thread with your answers, lots of comments on win aa hs fit if you read.back... here's one.




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