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 Post subject: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:01 pm 
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I went rabbit hunting today. I live in Michigan. Wind chill was in the negatives all day. Had a high of around 9 degrees. 6 hours in the rabbit thicket and I mean thick.

The box of reloads I grabbed was -
Winchester Universal hulls, yeah yeah Shame on me, I use them often for 1 and done reloads.
Win 209 primer
22 grains Unique
WT 12 wad (CB0118-12)
1-1/8 ounce #6 lead

Approx. PSI is between 9000 - 9500
Approx. FPS is between 1200 - 1250, both of these are based on Alliant recipes.

I shot this load for trap once and liked it. It performed well. This was also in the summer. They worked today but were extremely dirty, lots of powder in the barrel, and seemed to be a little light.

Anyone else have this experience with Unique? I normally use red dot for a load like this. I was just playing with Unique awhile back. I’m thinking the cold temps was the problem here.




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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 10:19 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 15, 2008 4:26 pm
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Location: Rainier , Wa.
I would try the 1200 fps recipe with the CCI 209M Primer.
Pls note that the supposed Pressure for the 1300 fps load with the CCI 209M primer does not make sense. (to me)
It shows Lower Pressure than the 1200 fps recipe with the same Wads.
Regards , Pete


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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2017 11:38 pm 
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Location: Eastern Nebraska
I woud suggest that you cut a couple loads open and weigh powder and shot. I have never tried this load in Universals, but I have in AAHS and AACF. It is a real tight fit in AAHS and tends to produce bulgy crimos. If it fit okay that might mean you are a little light on shot. Take a load that is supposed to run 9000 PSI, load it a bit light with a shallow bulgy crimp and shoot it in cold weather and you might be down around 8000 psi or beliw. That will not burn real clean, especially on a powder that has never been called clean burning. Even on a modern clean burning piwder like American Select, pressure matters. Around 9000-10000 psi it is good but leaves a little residue. Run it at 11,000+ and almost spotless.


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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 12:10 am 
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Running such loads using medium slow burning powder, (Unique), is simply a recipe for very poor performance when used in those temperature conditions. Kick that up to say Red Dot, in a load approaching 11,000 PSI and performance will be normal.

Simply the wrong powder/load, for the conditions it was used.

DLM

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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 6:53 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 31, 2006 10:06 am
Posts: 3176
Location: UK, England, Britain
I know there are published loads in 1,1/8oz and unique. But red dot is better. With unique use or find 1,1/4oz load data. It will work better.


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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:11 am 
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WT12 wads do not work well at low temperatures.


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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:21 am 
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Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2017 11:18 am
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Ambient temperatures significantly effects powder performance. In really cold weather try to keep your ammo warm, don't leave it in the truck over night. Don't use light loads in cold weather, you will get poor performance,


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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 8:38 am 
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Not matching the powder to the job is the issue.

As cookooff said, Unique wouldn’t have done that with 1 1/4 oz of shot.

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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:11 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:01 am
Posts: 2951
Location: Newton Kansas
D L Marcum wrote:
Running such loads using medium slow burning powder, (Unique), is simply a recipe for very poor performance when used in those temperature conditions. Kick that up to say Red Dot, in a load approaching 11,000 PSI and performance will be normal.

Simply the wrong powder/load, for the conditions it was used.

DLM

Right there above.

It's too low a load pressure wise for the cold conditions (and a borderline one for warm conditions).

I've burned up many a pound or Unique, in danged cold, but I've done it under 1 1/4 ounces of payload and I've done it above 10kpsi, and they run fine.

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I don't always venture out into the sub-freezing darkness, but when I do, it is hunting season, and I carry a Browning. Stay hungry my friends.


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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 9:37 am 
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Posts: 172
Thanks everyone for your input. I cut one open to check and make sure I wasn’t light on powder and shot and I wasn’t.
I’ve never experienced the effect of cold temps on a load. Probably should have grabbed a different box. I don’t normally use anything more then 1-1/8oz loads for hunting small game. So I just grabbed from my massive pile of target loads. I know most guys reload just enough to shoot. I’m different I shoot to burn through my stock pile of reloads lol.


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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 10:00 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:09 pm
Posts: 6227
Location: Eastern Nebraska
How do you make Unique burn real clean? Run it at 30,000+ PSI in 357mag. We (me included) tend to forget that a lot of what we think of as shotgun powders are also pistol powders. They run at lots higher pressure and are pretty clean. If a powder is clean at 30,000 and dirty at 9000 does that mean it is a dirty powder?


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 Post subject: Re: Unique bad burn?
PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2017 11:28 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:01 am
Posts: 2951
Location: Newton Kansas
I suppose it depends on your demand for the definition of "clean".

Of course 25gr of Unique isn't as "clean" under that 1.25oz as 18gr of Red Dot is under 1.125oz under similar pressures (11,000psi), but then again it's nowhere near as "dirty" as 35gr of Blue Dot is under 1 .375oz at similar pressures.

I suppose when it comes right down to it I get "cleaner" burn out of 50gr of WW748BR than I do 25gr of Unique (or possibly that 18gr of Red Dot), but I burn THAT at 60,000psi or a shade higher.

I was running around 10gr Blue Dot in a .45 Auto loading at one time in a Thompson, so "dirty" that every case threw hot powder bits across my forehead as it left, that was 20kpsi-ish.
Changed to Power Pistol, about 8gr, no more facial spraying.



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I don't always venture out into the sub-freezing darkness, but when I do, it is hunting season, and I carry a Browning. Stay hungry my friends.


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