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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Fri Mar 06, 2015 9:41 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Sat Oct 08, 2011 6:21 pm
Posts: 263
Location: Long Island NY
Rollin,
Bought and read your Bible, great information. I did make some adjustments on my fully adjustable CG, now I need it to stop snowing and get a little warmer to try it out. I am so sick of this winter!
Ron




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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Tue Mar 10, 2015 2:01 pm 
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Location: Brillion, WI
Azraz wrote:
Rollin,
Bought and read your Bible, great information. I did make some adjustments on my fully adjustable CG, now I need it to stop snowing and get a little warmer to try it out. I am so sick of this winter!
Ron


I'm glad you like the book, Ron.

Eventually, the east coast will get the weather we have in Wisconsin today - mid 50s, and it is expected to be "warm" all week. It appears that spring may have sprung.

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Rollin

Author of "Stock Fitter's Bible, Second Edition" explains the interrelationships between shooting form, stock dimensions and a shooter's size and shape http://www.amazon.com/Stock-Fitters-Bib ... 1451570384


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:26 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2015 5:14 pm
Posts: 1
hi, im very new to firearms of any type. im going to purchase a shotgun for home defense. i have no intention of hunting or target shooting. i know how to size the shotgun etc from reading much of the info here. what im trying to get are recomendations for the brand of shotgun and the correct munitions for home defense. we live in new york state where the criminals have rights and the victims have none. i have every intention of taking an NRA class to insure i know how to handle and respect the shotgun i buy.


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Sun Mar 15, 2015 6:55 pm 
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Location: Brillion, WI
David,

You would probably get more information if you opened a new thread in the "Tactical/HD Shotguns" forum farther down the index list.

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Rollin

Author of "Stock Fitter's Bible, Second Edition" explains the interrelationships between shooting form, stock dimensions and a shooter's size and shape http://www.amazon.com/Stock-Fitters-Bib ... 1451570384


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Thu Apr 09, 2015 6:28 pm 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:38 pm
Posts: 584
The funny thing about shotgun fit is that most guns feel just fine to me when I first hold them and then put them up to my shoulder. "This fits fine". I'll say. I'll never buy a gun that feels awkward, so all of my guns should be fine, right? Wrong.

Guns vary a little here and there. One is a tad longer, one might have some cast, one a thicker stock and another a higher comb, but I have a few guns that out shoot all of the others and not by a little bit. So fit matters. However, what actually makes a good fitting gun is still a bit of a mystery to me.


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 10:25 am 
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Maybe this will help: A gun that fits allows the shooter to use the shooting form (stance, gun mount, weight distribution & head/neck posture) which. allows shooting to his or her full potential.

Fit can affect the consistency of the gun mount (very important) and the likelihood that the eye will remain in the same place relative to the rib during swings so the POI does not change from shot to shot.

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Rollin

Author of "Stock Fitter's Bible, Second Edition" explains the interrelationships between shooting form, stock dimensions and a shooter's size and shape http://www.amazon.com/Stock-Fitters-Bib ... 1451570384


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Sat Apr 11, 2015 12:19 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2010 2:24 pm
Posts: 7174
Location: Upstate SC
I'm with Rollin but will take it a step further.

No need to get too "tactical" a look at what most LEO's use.

Get a Remington Police pump, good used Wingmaster, Ithaca M37 Defense, Mossberg 500, or Browning BPS with an 18.5" to 21" barrel. I use a BPS with a 26" barrel which works fine for me.

I prefer standard wood field stocks. Some guys like them slightly shorter. You certainly don't need bayonet mounts, heat shields or collapsible stocks.

Personally I think the M37 Defense is the best new home defense shotgun available.


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Tue Apr 28, 2015 10:41 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Mon Apr 07, 2014 8:28 pm
Posts: 153
Location: Southern Ontario
Hey Rollin, I'm looking forward to reading your book as soon as it arrives...

In the meanwhile, I've got a question.
I've had an adjustable comb installed, and I can finally cast off at comb.
I can also adjust the butt pad to give me a small cast off at heel.

However, I've got a little gap between mid bead and end bead, that's (as I suspect), making me shoot a bit high.
Would you suggest dropping my comb, or dropping my butt pad (therefore raising my drop at heal, to adjust for height?

Either way, I'm wanting to fine tune, but don't know which one to adjust. I suspect that neither will dramatically change my positioning or comfort..

Thanks.

Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Wed Apr 29, 2015 8:52 pm 
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Pijetro wrote:
Hey Rollin, I'm looking forward to reading your book as soon as it arrives...

In the meanwhile, I've got a question.
I've had an adjustable comb installed, and I can finally cast off at comb.
I can also adjust the butt pad to give me a small cast off at heel.

However, I've got a little gap between mid bead and end bead, that's (as I suspect), making me shoot a bit high. You are correct.

Would you suggest dropping my comb, or dropping my butt pad (therefore raising my drop at heal, to adjust for height? Lowering your comb would cause your gun to shoot lower. (If you would like to know the exact relationship between comb movement and POI (point of impact - where the center of the pattern will impact), email me at rollin@stockfitting.com and in the subject line, put "POI calculator."

I will reply to the message with a calculator attached. However, you need Microsoft's Excel software on your computer to use it. If you don't have Excel, let me know and I will direct you to another shooting website that features the calculator and has a link to download Excel.

Moving the recoil pad horizontally helps align your eye horizontally and can reduce the need to lean or turn your head toward the stock. It helps compensate for wide shoulders and/or, a stance that faces targets very directly. If you lower the recoil pad with the adjuster, it can allow a more naturally erect head and neck posture.


Either way, I'm wanting to fine tune, but don't know which one to adjust. I suspect that neither will dramatically change my positioning or comfort. Depending on your height, weight and shooting form that you use, there may be a significant improvement in both your positioning and shooting comfort as well as a rise in your scores. (It's all covered in the book.)

Thanks.

Thanks.
You are welcome.

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Rollin

Author of "Stock Fitter's Bible, Second Edition" explains the interrelationships between shooting form, stock dimensions and a shooter's size and shape http://www.amazon.com/Stock-Fitters-Bib ... 1451570384


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:55 am 
Utility Grade

Joined: Wed Jul 15, 2015 8:15 am
Posts: 2
Great post Rollin! Thank you.
I think, form sometimes takes on an interesting dimension if your are wild bird hunting over a pointing dog where-by the target(s) is not exiting from an accurately predictable source and flying in a predictable or linear trajectory. I'm not alluding to the actual mounting procedure as much as I am shoulders & feet.
I have one heck of a time getting upland hunters to "square up". Because they don't know where a bird or covey will fly, they need to increase their odds by squaring up their shoulders/feet somewhat, which allows a more natural swing-through whether left or right. That said, squaring up can actually shorten the effective LOP, etc. Some bird hunters have horrible "rifle-shooting" form which is a significant handicap for the wild bird hunting I do. This cant is also restrictive. If you are right handed and get a right-to-left bird, you often end up cork-screwing yourself which more-often-than-not translates into a miss behind the bird.


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Tue Sep 08, 2015 9:13 am 
Utility Grade

Joined: Fri May 29, 2015 12:08 pm
Posts: 7
I found "an insight into sports" for $20 as opposed to $46 on Amazon (third party). Go to the website Optometric Extension Program Foundation. Www.oepf.org. There's $10 shipping but it's still cheaper.


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2015 8:42 am 
Field Grade

Joined: Fri Jan 02, 2004 9:41 am
Posts: 44
Location: Maryland
This entire thread is a great read and very informative.

I am very much a novice at sporting clays and admit that I only became interested after my son bought a Beretta OU and got me to go with him. I have been using my 1981 Remington 1100 with a 28" modified choke barrel. I have now decided to purchase an OU for me and am enjoying the hunt for a new shotgun.

As an avid golfer, who knows a thing or two about fitting golf clubs, I have often wondered why there isn't a static measurement system for shotgun fit similar to what Ping Golf developed years ago (and somewhat duplicated by other golf OEMs). Would certain static physical measurements get you close to a "fitted" shotgun or at least eliminate some models?

Obviously a dynamic fitting where you actually shoot the shotgun at a target, or get to pattern it, would be best. With golf clubs you typically do a static fitting and then a dynamic fitting with a lie board test, launch monitor, and then hit balls on a range whenever possible. The problem is I can hit and test nearly any golf club with a variety of shafts, lie angles, grips, etc. However, I haven't been able to shoot every shotgun I'd like to try.


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 Post subject: Re: WHY SHOTGUNS "FIT" OR DO NOT FIT DIFFERENT SIZE SHOOTERS
PostPosted: Thu Sep 10, 2015 3:44 pm 
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Terp,

The problem with a static test is that to make it useful, a shooter must know the best shooting form to use. Shooting form consists of the gun mount, stance, weight distribution, as well as the head, neck and body posture used by a shooter.

To complicate matters further, shooters vary widely in their size and shape.

That makes a total of three variables, stock dimensions, shooting form and shooter conformation; a change in or the poor fit of one or more elements of each can affect one or more elements of the other two.

Golf isn't too much different. Golfers vary in size and golf swings vary as well. A set of clubs for a golfer using a conventional swing will not fit one who uses a single plane swing.

One set of clubs, like one set of stock dimensions do not fit everyone.

The 1100 has a set of stock dimensions that fit more shooters than any other gun I am aware of except the Remington 870 Wingmaster, which uses the same stocks.

There is a significant chance that the over & under that you get will not fit and therefore shoot as well as your 1100, assuming that it fits you well and allows you to use a good shooting form.



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Rollin

Author of "Stock Fitter's Bible, Second Edition" explains the interrelationships between shooting form, stock dimensions and a shooter's size and shape http://www.amazon.com/Stock-Fitters-Bib ... 1451570384


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