Shotgunworld.com

What do you think the chances are, that there would be enough of a revival in 16 ga, that someone somewhere would actually start crafting 16 ga guns with 3" chanbers, with ammo to take advantage of it coming thereafter?

It would seem that the gun and ammo manufacturers would think, given how well the limited number of 16 ga guns they offer sell, that if they offered some 16 ga 3" choices - such that the 16 ga could compete head to head in the steel/hardshot categories such as waterfowling - in the end they'd sell even more 16 ga guns and ammo - and the more they sell, the lower their unit cost is with resultant higher profit.

Mitchell -

I'm sorry, but I just don't think your idea has any merit what-so-ever.

I believe you are missing the whole point of a quality 16 ga., built on a true 16 ga frame. The feel of that sort of gun is what makes the 16 ga. so popular today. But we are a very small niche in the shooting sports market.

If you want to shoot magnum guns, go to a 12 or 20 ga.

If you really want to increase the popularity of the 16 ga., get some official sanctioning authority to bless 16 ga. competions.

Bruce

While the 16 gauge purists are absolutely abhorred by the idea, a 3" 16 gauge would be a useful all around gun. One could very effectively hunt everything from quail, doves and woodcock to ducks and turkey with it. The 2 3/4" shell is a little light for the latter two.

loss-
I'm not a 16 ga. purist at all. That's my point. I shoot the appropriate gun for the task at hand. Right now I probably shoot more 12 ga. than anything else, but I do enjoy shooting my 2 9/16" chambered M12 field gun.

I just don't see a need or even a practical application for a 16 ga. 3" chambered gun that is not already being filled by either existing 12 or 20 ga. loads. For that reason I don't believe you will ever get any interest from either the gun or ammo manufacturers.

Good luck, Bruce

It's a fabulous idea, one that should have been looked at many years ago.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/16_gauge_wakeman.htm

bprater, while I agree that a 3" 16 gauge gun is not likely to happen, I still think it's an idea with merit, especially for the one gun man. Sure the 12 gauge eclipses it, but in a heavier and bulkier gun, and the 20 gauge is not very suitable for duck hunting with steel shot. A 3" 16 could probably hold enough steel to be effective on ducks and would be good on everything else with lead.

By the way, I don't own a 16 either, just 12s and a 20, but I do hope to acquire a nice Sweet Sixteen one day.

Regards.

Mitchell- I believe that a 16 that was stout enough to make 3" shells enjoyable to shoot would lose the "sweet" character that good 16 gauge shotguns seem to possess. Kind of like the 16 gauge 870 remingtons made these days which are as heavy as 12 gauge guns (even though they are now just in standard length chambers this type of gun would likely be representative of a shootable 3" chambered 16). So a 16 gauge for magnum strength loads would not be much different than a 12 gauge, and why not just go with a 12. I do think that my 16 gauge guns have a better feel and balance than my 12 gauge guns.

There doesn't seem to be much interest from shotgun shell makers in producing 16 gauge shells in 2 and 3/4 shells as it is. The market for 3'' shells would be much, much smaller which would drive the price up and that is a problem for 16 gauge owners now.

If a 1 oz. load in a 16 gauge is a "square" load and anything over that is left in the shot string (I've been told) then what would a 3" shell have to offer over a 2 and 3/4" ?

The 3" 16 thing is older than most of us realize. This load (although not a magnum load) predates 1900 as the Brits were producing the load and gun, as well as some U S Manufacturers. I own an L C Smith with 3" chambers dated 1907, and know of another Smith dated 1914 with 3" chambers, and also have 3 domestically-produced 3" shells. In addition, Winchester made some 3" 21's when production started, but dropped them from the line.
My speculation?--- The gun manufacturers and ammo manufacturers weren't in sync and the combo never took off in the States, hence the advent of the 20 ga. 3" mag.
JMHO

Thanks, I learned something. I had never heard of a 3'' 16 gauge shell.
What in your opinion would be the advantage of the 3" shell?

Mike,
Following the lead of the 3-1/2" 12-----payload (FWIW).

I don't think it would sell. What I like about the 16 ga is that a good one is on a 20 ga size frame. As the old boys said, "Carries like a 20, hits like a 12". They also most often pattern better than a 20 ga. The South Dakota Roosters really didn't like my Winchester Model 12 16 ga. this fall!

American Gunner,
I agree that it probably wouldn't sell. I believe the educated shooter has had a bellyfull of new caliber/new gun hype and wouldn't accept it unless someone of unquestionable reputation could furnish data that clearly shows an advantage over other chamberings, and the ammo manufacturers would get behind it.
If I had access to more 3" 16 ga. shells I'd try them in my Elsie myself !

laxcoach hit it on the nail head, the 3" 16 has allready been done and did not survive. We are lucky to have the 16 period in the 2 3/4".With the way mass marketing works these days and the nitwits who make the decisions based completely on numbers,yeah we are still in there and it is a miracle of sorts. A couple of points 1. the 16 is a niche gun and that is upland. 2. If a 16 isn't on a 16 ga frame what have you gained?
I am new to this forum , I live and work in South Dakota as well as hunt every chance I get. 16's yup, been using them for years. So far this fall all my upland has went down to a 1958 vintage Browning Sweet 16 27.5" VR mod choke A-5. Usually there is another behind the seat in the pickup, same gun in a 61 year model with a matted barrel or a vintage M37R with full choke in 16. I also enjoy using other guns, but these are my choices for pheasants ,sharptail grouse, prairie chicken and occ huns. 1 1/8 oz of 6,5,or 4 shot depents on the conditions. Fiocchi Golden Pheasant 1 1/8 oz with plated shot and the new Federal Ultra Pheasant loads are the 3" loads you guys want, all in the standard hull. I've got the #4 and #2 steel loads in WW and Fed and they work on ducks out of my japanese Sweet 16 with the mod tube, you just pass on 40+ yd shots. In the next 3 weeks their will be more than a few mallards that find that out.Ballistic Products of Corcoran Minnesota offers enough components for the 16 to satisfy anyone and that is how you can make your 16 as versatile as you need it. #5's have allways been my go to load on roosters day in and day out. Fiocchi and the new Feds are the only ones offered though. Load your own or buy them by the flat and keep well stocked ,they don't spoil. I'll be in and out of the thread and allways glad to read of others experiences. bob16ga

Case capacity.

The three inch 16 gauge has never been done in a practical or mainstream sense. People have their own ideas about what a 16 gauge was, but frame size was never it. There is no such thing as a 16 ga. "frame size," nor is there a 12 ga. "frame size"-- or 20 / 28 / .410. Stock dimensions and gun weights have always been all over the map; they still are today.

Frames are as big as they need to be and some times bigger than they have to be. For example the first 3.5" BPS 12 ga was on the same frame as the 10 ga.. A lot bigger than it had to be and handled like a club so Browning redid it to a smaller a lighter format. Never seen a AYA 12 ga on the same frame as my AYA 10 either but then I haven't seen them all. How about my Browning Sweet 16's not even close to an A-5 in 12 ga for size . Same model's 2 different frame sizes. The reproduction M12 in 28 was put in the same frame as the 20 it ended up a clunk, didn't even begin to function as smooth as the 20 in the same frame. Same with the 16 ga M870, put in the 12 ga frame and not a smooth operator at all, got rid of it. When the action is scaled for the gauge it is using it makes for a better total package. Everybody has the right to his own opinions you see it anyway you like. I'll trust in my experience and my dial caliper for actual measurement. bob16ga

I have a dozen or so 16s and love them. A 3" holds absulutely no interest to me. Have light weight 12s 2.75"ers that will do everything a 3" 16 will only more efficently.

I can understand the novelty of a 3" case but I don't understand why the necessity of it. A 2 3/4" case will hold up to 1 1/4 ozs. of shot( which I wouldn't use anyway). Now I might go along with 16 bore guns with 3"CHAMBERING, because it might improve patterning and/or lessen perceived recoil.

I think that most of us have forgotten that shotgunning is a SHORT RANGE pursuit- whether for game or targets. I wouldn't want to have a heavier gun to soak up increased recoil with a heavier payload, nor would I lend my cheek to increased slap in a lightweight 16 bore with a load greater than 1 1/8 oz.

As for frame specific size per guage, weight, square load, and all the other terms we bandy about with impunity, it all boils down to this-everything having to do with shotgunning is subjective. There are very few hard and fast rules, but there are a few.
Producing a 3" 16 bore shotshell and gun chambered for it is not out of the relm of reality, but it is not economically viable.

Don't see the logic or use.