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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 4:49 pm 
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What makes a shotgun worth $4,000, when for less than $2,000 there are excellent Beretta 686 and Browning Citori target offerings to be bought without any trouble?

Does the gun that costs twice the price last any longer, give any better service, shoot any better, or somehow function after than the cheaper one?

Not at all.

But why do men value beauty in a woman?

The same can easily be said that a pretty woman functions exactly the same as a plain woman.

The only reason for a $4,000 shotgun is the user is likely to be more proud of it than a $2,000 shotgun.

About ten years ago I set out to find a true, luxury shotgun for sporting clays. I shot lower end Kreighoffs, the more expensive Beretta D-10, the Blaser, and before I could try out any more guns I feel head over heels in love with the 34" Caesar Guerini Summit Limited that was a demo gun, and took her home with me.

A CG is truly a luxury shotgun. Every metal part has an extra high polish and finish. Every one has a real, oil finish, on highly figured and beautifully fine checkered Turkish walnut. There's not a single cheap part inside or out on the gun, the action type has been proven for over a half century, and CG has by far the best lifetime warranty in the shotgun business, which includes three free "pit stop" services as part of the deal.

But you might like another luxury brand better.

The thing to remember is that whichever luxury gun you buy, it should be like that girl you married.

At first sight, she needs to be the prettiest thing you ever saw.

An homely woman and an homely gun last a lifetime, and age does not improve them.:)



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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 5:14 pm 
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C G for me!


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:09 pm 
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Joel Etchen 687 Silver Pigeon III, 32" barrels. I have the 30" barrel version and it is great. I had Giacomo Sporting put a high gloss finish on it and install an ISIS unit. These guns use the Optima barrels from the 682 series. You won't wear out the 686/687 action.

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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:15 pm 
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Location: New Jersey
That's a beautiful shotgun sernv99


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 6:22 pm 
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Brodyrodweller wrote:
That's a beautiful shotgun sernv99


Thanks....if you can, you should take a drive out to Joel Etchen in Central-Western PA. He has a good amount of inventory of his 687 guns. The come with the matte oil finish so I think putting the high gloss finish does the wood some well deserved justice. He will be at the PA State Trap shoot in the summer as well (sometime in June). If you can wait, I would also recommend visiting the PA State Trap shoot as there will be alot of vendors with guns...mostly sporting and trap guns. Not sure if any of them allow to demo the guns. HiGrade Shooters Supply is probably the bigger dealer that attends that trap shoot event and he brings almost all of his inventory.

I have shot and owned Krieghoff K80, Zoli Z, Blaser F3, Beretta DT10, and Perazzi MX8/12/MXS. Still have the MXS as I love fixed choke guns but I love this 687 gun. I am a casual sporting clays shooter but burn through as much ammo as a serious competitor does.


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:28 pm 
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+3 on the Joel Etchen all around guns....best value for the $. Get one with an adjustable comb installed.
http://joeletchenguns.com/sp3_rh32_aag. ... HV72nkizIU


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 7:30 pm 
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That's probably best looking 687 I have ever seen. Nicely done, sernv99!

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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 8:09 pm 
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buy this one before I do.....
http://joeletchenguns.com/3395aa.JPG


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:46 am 
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mortum wrote:
I haven't shot Blaser F16 but... 6.8 lb for a sporting clays gun?
That must have been the field verson. I agree the F16 sport is relatively light at 8lbs or slightly less, but there is a weight/balance tweaking system for it.

Lighter sporters seem to be in vogue though. The standard models of the 725, 692 and 690 are all about the same as the F16 and a friend has a new MX2000S at below 8lbs.

(The low rib CGs and Zolis are around 8lb 3oz and the raised rib + adjustable stock models several ounces heavier).

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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 11:59 am 
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Trickster wrote:
mortum wrote:
I haven't shot Blaser F16 but... 6.8 lb for a sporting clays gun?
That must have been the field verson. I agree the F16 sport is relatively light at 8lbs or slightly less, but there is a weight/balance tweaking system for it.

Lighter sporters seem to be in vogue though. The standard models of the 725, 692 and 690 are all about the same as the F16 and a friend has a new MX2000S at below 8lbs.

(The low rib CGs and Zolis are around 8lb 3oz and the raised rib + adjustable stock models several ounces heavier).

I stand corrected - Sporting version specs show 7lb 14oz. As I said, I have no experience with F16 but I have shot F3 and to me, that was the most recoil-heavy gun I tried to date. I really wanted to like it since it was well priced and fit me great right out of the box but... recoil was unbearable. Others may have different experience of course.

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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 12:16 pm 
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Location: Phila PA
the Big seafood blast is at M&M April 21 to 23 should be some vendors there. You can call a couple of the locale shotgun vendor they may have demo guns.

Guerini and Zoli Ready Aim Fire in Bristol PA http://www.rafire.com/
Blaser Clay target sports in Princeton http://www.claytargetsports.com/
Beretta Esquire firearms Mullica hill NJ http://www.claytargetsports.com/
Griffin and Howe http://griffinhowe.com/


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:00 pm 
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Brody: I shoot a Kolar which starts at $10k.

In the price range you are looking at , definitely try the guns.

Too little weight will be more of a problem than too much. Modern SC's guns should be

1. greater than 8 lbs (to soak up recoil)
2. unless you are very tiny , 32 inch bbls. My wife is tiny and shoots a 32 inch bbl O/U.
3. unless you are mostly disabled (and some of us old folks are partly) , do not get a sub-8 lb O/U gun.

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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 9:05 pm 
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Not an O/U but have you tried an A400 Excel?


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 9:34 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 09, 2017 4:12 pm
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Location: New Jersey
Thanks everyone for the replies. I want to stay with the over unders. I have a Benelli legacy sport and love it. But don't like throwing empty hulls all over the place. The place I shoot has some stations setup around a old quarry pit and the shells get thrown down the hill where they aren't accessible. Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:20 pm 
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SuperXOne wrote:
What makes a shotgun worth $4,000, when for less than $2,000 there are excellent Beretta 686 and Browning Citori target offerings to be bought without any trouble?
Have you owned or even trialled some of those shotguns that cost $4000+. At least the ones (Zoli, Blaser, Kolar) I've tried are remarkably better in dynamics than the Beretta 686 that I own.

There is a lot more to this than reliability and aesthetics.


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 10:55 pm 
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Sobrepuesta wrote:
SuperXOne wrote:
What makes a shotgun worth $4,000, when for less than $2,000 there are excellent Beretta 686 and Browning Citori target offerings to be bought without any trouble?
Have you owned or even trialled some of those shotguns that cost $4000+. At least the ones (Zoli, Blaser, Kolar) I've tried are remarkably better in dynamics than the Beretta 686 that I own.

There is a lot more to this than reliability and aesthetics.


Also.....What makes a shotgun worth $8000, when for less than $4000 there are excellent Zoli, Blasers, Berettas ? What makes a shotgun worth $16,000, when for less than $8000 there are excellent Perazzis, Krieghoffs, Kolars ? What makes a shotgun worth $32,000................well, I hope SuperX gets my drift. Everything is "relevant".................

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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 5:49 am 
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Joined: Mon Jan 26, 2015 5:54 am
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There was a recommendation to visit Joel Etchen in earlier posts. If you have the chance I second that recommendation, fine selection of shotguns and very nice people. You would have the opportunity to mount a number of shotguns however, there isn't a range so shooting them is not likely. If you do visit Etchen, continue on to Hi Grade, about 30 miles west, about 1.5 miles north of the New Stanton exit of the PA Turnpike (use a GPS, the Turnpike/PA 119 interchange is a "which lane chicane" proposition). Again, fine selection of shotguns and nice people but without a range. If you want to see Zoli and Kolar, Elite is an hour west of Hi Grade.

Not affiliated with any of the shops but have had excellent service when visiting/purchasing.
Yes, Western PA has an embarrassment of riches with regard to fine shotgun establishments.

http://joeletchenguns.com/
http://www.higradeshooters.com/
http://elite-shotguns.com/


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 11:16 am 
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mortum wrote:
Trickster wrote:
mortum wrote:
I haven't shot Blaser F16 but... 6.8 lb for a sporting clays gun?
That must have been the field verson. I agree the F16 sport is relatively light at 8lbs or slightly less, but there is a weight/balance tweaking system for it.

Lighter sporters seem to be in vogue though. The standard models of the 725, 692 and 690 are all about the same as the F16 and a friend has a new MX2000S at below 8lbs.

(The low rib CGs and Zolis are around 8lb 3oz and the raised rib + adjustable stock models several ounces heavier).

I stand corrected - Sporting version specs show 7lb 14oz. As I said, I have no experience with F16 but I have shot F3 and to me, that was the most recoil-heavy gun I tried to date. I really wanted to like it since it was well priced and fit me great right out of the box but... recoil was unbearable. Others may have different experience of course.


Poor thing! I am sorry the recoil was so rough on you. I'll have to tell all the teenage girls that shoot an F3 to stop because it has too much recoil. If a 115 lbs., 12 year old girl can shoot one in competition, you should be able to handle it. Obviously the gun didn't fit you as well as you thought.


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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:00 pm 
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draw: The early F 3's were recoil beasts. I had one and will never spend another $ on a Blaser.

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 Post subject: Re: New sporting clays shotgun for around $4000
PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2017 12:13 pm 
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sera wrote:
draw: The early F 3's were recoil beasts. I had one and will never spend another $ on a Blaser.

I have had my F3 for a year and couldn't ask for a nicer shooting gun. There really is no way to substantiate the idea that two over/unders of the same caliber and weight would have different recoil other than poor fitting. I am amazed how many people buy a really expensive shotgun and then refuse to spend the relatively small amount of extra money it takes to have it fitted. My wife's CG Summit Sporting is not particularly comfortable for me to shoot, but it is fitted for her and is too short and the comb drop is too much for me. It has nothing to do with the gun itself.




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