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 Post subject: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2020 8:59 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 5:58 pm
Posts: 1418
Location: Oklahoma
I recently quit reloading lead target loads and started purchasing low-cost shells for clay target shooting. I’ve been shooting the Estate Super Sport Competition Target loads, so I thought I would open and inspect their internal components and shoot a few patterns with them to see how they perform. I elected to pattern them with my modified choke at 40 yards to give me an idea of their performance against other similar target loads I have patterned.

I’m just the messenger, so you can be the judge!

12ga 2 ¾" Estate Super Sport Competition Target load
1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (395 pellets) @ 1145 fps

Pattern results from a 12-gauge Browning Citori with 28" Invector-plus barrels (ID / .741") using Briley flush chokes (patterns average of ten, 30" post-shot scribed circle, yardage taped muzzle to target, in-shell pellet count average of five, and choke constriction from bore gauge).

PELLETS/SHELL (1 1/8 ounce = 492.2 gr)
Pellet count / weight (grains)
412 / 494.5
396 / 494.4
390 / 488.9
390 / 485.7
386 / 484.3
Mean 394.8 / 489.56

PELLET SIZE (25 random samples, 5 pellets/shell opened, #7.5 pellet diameter = .095” +/- .005”)
.099”, .099”, .098”, .097”, .096”, .096”, .096”, .096”, .095”, .095”, .095”, .094”, .094”, .094”, .094”, .094”, .094”, .093”, .093”, .092”, .092”, .091”, .091”, .091”, .088” / Mean diameter .09428”

POWDER/SHELL
16.7 gr
16.6 gr
16.5 gr
16.4 gr
16.3 gr
Mean 16.5 gr

40 YARD PATTERNS (Mod. choke / .021” constriction, 10 samples)
30” pattern total (%)
Mean pattern 268.7 (68.05%)

Here are some of my pattern numbers from other similar lead target loads.

40 YARDS (5-shot mean pattern totals w/ same gun/Mod. choke as above)
Win AA Heavy 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (377 pellets) / pattern 285 (76%)
Rem Gun Club 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (375 pellets) / pattern 236 (63%)
Rem Premier STS 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (408 pellets) / pattern 293 (72%)
Rem Premier Nitro 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (420 pellets) / pattern 302 (72%)
Reload (STS, Green Dot, CB) 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (402 pellets) / pattern 257 (64%)

The Estate loads may not be the best performers, but I think they'll take care of any target I can put the pattern on. Good luck!




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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 2:29 am 
Limited Edition

Joined: Fri Aug 16, 2019 4:29 am
Posts: 417
Location: Port St Lucie FL
Thanks for doing the work and posting results, definitely will consider these when I see them at a good price.


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 6:20 am 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 5:22 pm
Posts: 11084
Location: Athens,TX.
I have shot a lot of the 1oz of 7.5's @1235 and they did WELL on my gun/choke combo(not to the extent you did but did pattern them) but now very hard to find in my area so have switched to the Fiocchi SD's 1oz @1200 of 7.5's.

Have you done any tests of the Shooting Dynamics line from Fiocchi?

_________________
Jerry

TSRA LIFE MEMBER
NSCA #610xxx

Rose City Clays - Tyler TX
5H Shooting Sports Frankston TX ( Formally the Chicken Ranch)
Caney Creek- Teague TX


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 8:00 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2013 7:11 am
Posts: 4433
Location: Western Tampa, FL
Joe Hunter once again does thorough, and for me the tedious work, to give us fact based information. Can't thank you enough for all of that, Joe.

I agree. It looks like the Estates are reasonably good ammo with pretty consistent shot sizes, and results that are almost a full step tighter than the choke's designation. Good to know. Thanks again!


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 8:06 am 
Crown Grade
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:20 pm
Posts: 23000
Great info! Thanks for taking the time to do all of this!

_________________
The bitterness of poor quality is remembered long after the sweetness of low price has faded from memory, Aldo Gucci

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience, George Carlin


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 8:28 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 01, 2019 10:17 pm
Posts: 289
Location: Trinidad, CO
Joe Hunter,

You are now my newest Hero. If I ever grow up, I want to be just like you ;^)

I sort of stumbled on the Estate load since it sells for $5.48 a box at some of the Walmarts around Colorado. I like both the 1 1/8 @ 1145 and the [email protected] 1290. I have shot nearly 20,000 rounds of the 2 loads over the past 2+ years. The one negative is the harder primers. I primarily shoot a F3 and I have the occasional FTF with the Estates. It has always been less than .05% but how much less would require I pay more attention.

I save the unfired but dimpled shells and then attempt to fire them in some my other 12 ga. They won't fire in my other newer F3, my 725's, my CZ SxS, my BSS, but they will always fire in my BPS. I need to try them in my 1301 and Maxus

One thing for sure, they shoot better than I do.

s/f Steve


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:32 am 
Presentation Grade
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jan 08, 2012 8:24 pm
Posts: 850
Location: Western Colorado
hopper810 wrote:
Have you done any tests of the Shooting Dynamics line from Fiocchi?

I'd also be curious to hear of about any testing of the Fiocchi Shooting Dynamics shells. I currently shoot the Estate SS (1 oz. 8 @1235) and like them, but due to some shifts in local suppliers the Fiocchi shells are now more available and at a better price.

_________________
"I always miss if I get a chance to take careful aim" (Pea Eye, in the movie Lonesome Dove)


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 9:54 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Wed May 14, 2008 11:18 am
Posts: 272
Re: Shooting Dynamics, from Trapshooters Forum:

https://www.trapshooters.com/threads/pe ... hi.855363/


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 11:36 am 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*

Joined: Sat Feb 19, 2005 7:25 pm
Posts: 9311
Location: Louisiana
Thanks, Joe. I shoot the 1 1/8 oz. @ 1200 fps Estate Super Sport Competition Target Load, which the local Academy has for $5.99 per box. I've found them to be good quality shells and do about as well with them as I do with anything else including AAs.


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 12:07 pm 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 15, 2008 5:22 pm
Posts: 11084
Location: Athens,TX.
jwgworld wrote:
hopper810 wrote:
Have you done any tests of the Shooting Dynamics line from Fiocchi?

I'd also be curious to hear of about any testing of the Fiocchi Shooting Dynamics shells. I currently shoot the Estate SS (1 oz. 8 @1235) and like them, but due to some shifts in local suppliers the Fiocchi shells are now more available and at a better price.


That's one reason I had to switch as none to be found(Estate SS) and even Academy's web site none available. And since they raised the prices and no longer offer free shipping on Ammo I can get the SD's from my local Club for the same price the Estates used to be and they have plenty in stock at all times :)

_________________
Jerry

TSRA LIFE MEMBER
NSCA #610xxx

Rose City Clays - Tyler TX
5H Shooting Sports Frankston TX ( Formally the Chicken Ranch)
Caney Creek- Teague TX


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 1:37 pm 
Tournament Grade
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 25, 2017 4:04 pm
Posts: 251
I thought I was crazy; I do the same thing and have a huge spreadsheet of caliper measurements and pellet standard deviations going back years.

The Estates I cut apart from Walmart were “ok” sphericity and consistency. Slightly worse numbers than the Winchester Super Speeds i purchased and tested at the same time and for the same price, but the pattern board really didn’t show a big difference between the two. Those tests were in 2017 so YMMV. Both were way better than the Top Guns that I tested in January which had large percentages of everything from 9 to 6 shot in the same shells.

Best of all is how Estates smell. Don’t know why they have such a distinctive odor when they’re fired, but I love that smell and it reminds me of my youth when all my fired shells seemed to smell like that.


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 6:01 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:32 pm
Posts: 84
Joe, thanks for the work you did on this and posting it for our viewing.

I like Estate shells a lot. I get them mostly at Wal-Mart for $5.48 per box. They seem to sell very well at all the local WM superstores. I like them better than the budget Winchester or Federal 4-packs as I've had too many crushed or wrinkled shell bases with those. Apparently there is no visual quality check, although in the actual shooting they are good.

Thank again.


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 Post subject: Re: Estate Super Sport dissection and patterns, part 2
PostPosted: Sun Aug 02, 2020 5:43 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2008 5:58 pm
Posts: 1418
Location: Oklahoma
Some were asking for full choke pattern numbers, so I went back and shot 10 more patterns, from the same box of shells, with my full choke. Hope this helps!

12ga 2 ¾" Estate Super Sport Competition Target load
1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (395 pellets) @ 1145 fps

Pattern results from a 12-gauge Browning Citori with 28" Invector-plus barrels using Briley flush chokes (patterns average of ten, 30" post-shot scribed circle, yardage taped muzzle to target, in-shell pellet count average of five, and choke constriction from bore gauge).

PELLETS/SHELL (1 1/8 ounce = 492.2 gr)
Count / weight (grains)
412 / 494.5 gr
396 / 494.4 gr
390 / 488.9 gr
390 / 485.7 gr
386 / 484.3 gr
Means / 394.8 / 489.56 gr

PELLET SIZE (25 random samples, 5 pellets/shell opened, #7.5 pellet diameter = .095” +/- .005”)
.099”, .099”, .098”, .097”, .096”, .096”, .096”, .096”, .095”, .095”, .095”, .094”, .094”, .094”, .094”, .094”, .094”, .093”, .093”, .092”, .092”, .091”, .091”, .091”, .088” / Mean pellet diameter .09428”

POWDER/SHELL
16.7 gr
16.6 gr
16.5 gr
16.4 gr
16.3 gr
Mean / 16.5 gr

40 YARD PATTERNS
Mod. choke / .021” constriction / 30” pattern totals (%)
297
282
277
275
275
274
265
255
252
235
Mean / 268.7 (68.05%)

40 YARD PATTERNS
Full choke / .036” constriction / 30” pattern totals (%)
306
296
295
286
280
279
277
277
267
266
Mean / 282.9 (71.65%)

Here are some of my pattern numbers from other 12-gauge 1 1/8-ounce #7 ½ lead target loads for comparison.

40 YARDS / MODIFIED CHOKE PATTERNS
5-shot mean and 30” pattern totals w/ same gun and Mod. choke as above
Win AA Heavy 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (377 pellets) / pattern 285 (76%)
Rem Gun Club 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (375 pellets) / pattern 236 (63%)
Rem Premier STS 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (408 pellets) / pattern 293 (72%)
Rem Premier Nitro 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (420 pellets) / pattern 302 (72%)
Reload (STS, Green Dot, CB) 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (402 pellets) / pattern 257 (64%)

40 YARDS / FULL CHOKE PATTERNS
5-shot mean and 30” pattern totals w/ same gun and Full choke as above
Win AA Heavy 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (377 pellets) / pattern 299 (79%)
Rem Gun Club 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (375 pellets) / pattern 272 (73%)
Rem Premier STS 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (408 pellets) / pattern 321 (79%)
Rem Premier Nitro 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (420 pellets) / pattern 321 (76%)
Reload (STS, Green Dot, CB) 2 ¾” 1 1/8 oz #7 ½ lead (402 pellets) / pattern 294 (73%)

I’m just the messenger, so you can be the judge, good luck!




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