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 Post subject: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Mon Dec 28, 2009 9:51 pm 
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I have been looking for a single barrel 12 ga for a little while and have settled for the pardner/topper. I have a .410 and a 20 ga topper already. So I started looking at them first. the question I have is...The gun I am looking at is the pardner 12ga turkey 3 1/2" chamber (I already have ammo but sold the gun that the 3.5" shells went to). with the interchangeable choke tubes. I guess I am wanting to know what you guys think about this particular gun. such as how bad is the recoil,how does it do. I am wanting the gun for scouting and just walking around..If I see a squirrel I can load a #6 in it and tak, or if i see a deer I can load a 3" or 3.5" and take the deer. I guess in a nut shell a review of the pardner turkey w/ tubes.




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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 5:10 am 
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Location: Poulsbo, Washington
Make sure you get it with a nice big FAT comfy shoulder pad, because a 3.5" 12 ga. its gonna kick like the perverbial mule!
The 3.5" 12 ga. load was designed to give 10 ga. performance, with the 12 ga. shell (although, that begs the question, why not just get a 10 ga.?!)
Otherwise, it sounds like a handy little gun to have around.

What I would be interested in seeing, is if that 20 ga. barrel doesn't fit the receiver of the gun you're considering buying.
If it was a standard ol' Topper, all those different gauges will interchange with one receiver, but I have yet to see whether a pre-bankrupcy barrel will fit on a post-banrupcy receiver.

...hmmmm.
Please, keep me informed.




Dean


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 10:21 am 
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I agree that the 3 1/2 or heavy 12ga shells will give exponentionally more recoil unless you also increase the weight of the shotgun to counter act the recoil.
The 20ga will kill deer just as dead as a 12ga when using slugs. Shotgun shells are for themost part, loaded to the same velocity and pressures so the effective range for both gauges is essentially the same. You just have the advantage of more shot or a heavier slug in 12 ga and more variety of loads.
If you want to lessen the felt recoil then you will need to lengthen the forcing cone, port the barrel and change the recoil pad or use a PAST shoulder pad.


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2010 10:24 am 
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yeah the other toppers I have are pre...If I get some free time I will try it out. I wound up buying a topper 3.5 with the real tree stock and no choke tube. Might get it threaded later..see how it patterns first.


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 1:36 am 
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stevenrace wrote:
yeah the other toppers I have are pre...If I get some free time I will try it out.

Cool, yeah, please let me know how that pre/post fit up works (don't mean for you to actually fire it, just wondering how it fits).

You asked about patterning of a cylinder bore.
I've got a copy of Layne Simpson's "Shotguns & Shotgunning" on loan from the library right now, and in one of the chapters he has a chart showing how patterns relate to choke at various distances.
According to that chart, a cylinder bore actually patterns, effectively (interpret that as you may), in a 32" circle @ 20 yards.
The clincher here is that of all the times I've taken a shot at a bird, and stood a "for real" chance of actually bagging it, the average distance was about 50 feet.
That's about 17.5 yards and all the guns I've hunted with are choked either full or modified.
So Simpson's chart shows much better performance from that (non) choke than I've been led to believe all these years (i.e., Cyl. bore being ineffective for hunting past about 10-12 yards).
Thusly, you may not have to have the barrel threaded.
I would, however, suggest you use a "baby magnum" type load when bird hunting, in order to retain as dense a pattern as possible, and keep the maximum distance at 25 yards (75 feet).
At that distance it should spread an effective pattern inside a 38" circle (calculated by me, based on 32" circle @ 20 yards and 44" circle @ 30 yards).


Dean


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 2:00 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2005 8:21 pm
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Location: S. Texas Brush Country
If you don't like the recoil of the 3 1/2" shells, move down to 3" or to 2 3/4". Remember, velocity remains approx. the same with all three lenghts...but they normally carry increasingly more shot. The 2 3/4" 12 gauge shell is still by far the most popular and will handle most any game appropriate for a shotgun, but you have the option of heavier shot loads with the other two lengths if/when you feel you need that advantage...for waterfowl perhaps, or maybe something potentially dangerous like big hogs or black bear. The 3 1/2" chamber gives you the versatility of handling any 12 gauge load...so use it.


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 6:59 pm 
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that is why I went with the 3.5 chamber...the versitality(sp) of the chamber...and I already have 3.5 buckshot...the h&r is a lot lighter than the 835 and to me that makes a difference when your walking a good distance in one day. I mostly squirrel hunt but like I said if a deer jumps and gives me a shot I am going to take it.
as to the seeing about the pre vs. post haven't been to where they are located but as soon as I go over their I will see if they will interchange.


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2010 7:31 pm 
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Again, more info gleaned from Layne Simpson's shotgun book.
He mentions that sometimes it might be better to go with the shorter cartridge in the larger guage, such as in this case, going to with a 10, instead of an extra long 12.
He's found that whenever he tried to take advantage of an extra long case, pellet count-wise, the pattern always comes out less uniform.
He says he's noticed time and again, better patterning results from the more traditional loadings.
Be that as it may, steve does make a good point about the versatility of the chambering.
I'm sure he'll never be left wanting, with that gun.


Dean


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 1:34 pm 
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Your first investment will be a large recoil pad,lol,I've got a H&R 12 ga. that shoots 3",and it will beat you to death with out one,But even with that,the options of loads in 3" and 2 3/4" are so many that you shouldn't have any trouble finding a load you like for your purposes.I generaly shoot #6's for small game,and feel confident taking shots up too 80 or so yrds,for larger game,#4's,coyotes I like "T" shot from dead coyote(Cant use buckshot to hunt with in ky)and of course slugs for anything larger that that.

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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 3:40 pm 
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I had a Pardner years back in 12-Gauge (2¾ & 3") and was generally pleased with it. It was a solidly built scattergun and never failed to go bang when it was supposed to.

The recoil was pretty harsh, particularly with 3" loads, so it indeed kicked like an angry mule. A good recoil pad is a necessity. This predated the 3½" chambering, so I can't comment on that part.

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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2012 8:06 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:43 pm
Posts: 30
DATX wrote:
If you don't like the recoil of the 3 1/2" shells


I must be a wuz. I don't like the recoil of the 2 3/4 inch shells and shoot only 1 oz and 1 1/8 oz ow brass in my 12 Ga Partner. Mine only weighs 5 Lbs 5 oz after cutting my stock to a straight style. I look at that 3 inch chamber and just say; yeah right!


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 09, 2012 1:45 pm 
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I am planning to buy a new H&R Pardner 12gauge single shot,with modified choke.I like it,beacause of its simplicity,well-build design and cost effectivenes.
From the posts above i get a picture of how it's going to perfom.
I am planning to hunt small ''game'' and i am thinking about warthogs;any advice for the large game?

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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 5:51 pm 
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Joined: Sat Feb 11, 2012 5:37 pm
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I have had the 3.5 turkey special for several years. The recoil is tough and the muzzle flip is pretty bad. I bought a grind to fit Limbsaver and intentionally left the rear of the pad wider than the front where I taper fit it. The wider footprint helps to ease the recoil. Mine came with a round iron bar in the buttstock to help with the recoil. I took it out because it just made the gun heavier to carry. I rarely shoot more than once on a turkey hunt, so no problem. My gun patterns 3 inch shells just about as well as 3.5, so I shoot the 3 inch.


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Sat Feb 11, 2012 7:45 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:43 pm
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DeanMk wrote:
He's found that whenever he tried to take advantage of an extra long case, pellet count-wise, the pattern always comes out less uniform.
He says he's noticed time and again, better patterning results from the more traditional loadings.Dean


I'm going to ditto DeanMk here. I have noticed that my 1 oz 20 Ga loads (heavy load) were not as uniform as my 1 oz 12 Ga loads (light load) were. Found that that was an excepted point with shotguns. A shorter shot load (bigger bore) of the same amount of shot would usually give a better pattern then a long shot load (smaller bore). May mean that a 12 makes a very good 20 Ga. In repeating shotguns the 20 is usually lighter and easier to carry but with Partners the 12 can be as light as the 20 and sometimes more so. It's disadvantage is that you can't put as many 12 Ga shells in your pocket as 20 Ga.

I've always wanted to try even lighter loads in the 12 (and 20) but didn't reload shotguns (yet). Bought a copy of the recent G&A last week because of the article on light 12 and 20 Ga loads. This guy was loading 1/2, 5/8, 3/4 and 7/8 oz shot in 12 Ga. He said the patterns were great and the recoil was very light. I'm going to look for a simple hand loader in 12 Ga and make some of these. It would be great to be shooting 28 Ga loads out of my 12 Ga Partner.


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 14, 2012 10:47 pm 
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Further clarification on heavy loads in small gauges.
Simpson mentions that the reasoning is due to less pellet deformation in the larger gauges, since fewer pellets are pushed against the barrel (or rather, the sleeve that rides on the barrel).


Dean


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Wed Feb 15, 2012 8:16 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 12, 2012 12:43 pm
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gr17nik wrote:
I am planning to buy a new H&R Pardner 12gauge single shot,with modified choke.I like it,beacause of its simplicity,well-build design and cost effectivenes.
From the posts above i get a picture of how it's going to perfom.
I am planning to hunt small ''game'' and i am thinking about warthogs;any advice for the large game?


The Partner would be great for what you're talking about. Don't bother with the 3 1/2" chamber but get the standard 3 inch one. A standard 2 3/4" shell with a standard shotcup full of shot going past 3/4 inches of wide chamber before being slammed back into the normal barrel diameter cannot be good for that shot. Either large buckshot (OOO or OO) for shots under 40 yards or slugs for as far as you can hit them will handle any warthog too.


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 Post subject: Re: 12ga H&R/NEF?
PostPosted: Thu Feb 23, 2012 8:29 am 
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Joined: Thu Jan 05, 2012 12:17 pm
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Location: Greece
actually,i was thinking to use slugs and 9 pellets 00buckshots for the warthog.
thank you(all),for the advices,found them very helpful



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