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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 4:47 pm 
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remdog1187 wrote:
BobFM wrote:
I'm a 66 year old Respirarory Therpait working in NYC, so I am very much on the front lines - along with the RN's MD's, NP's and other health care workers. I can assure you this is no hoax it is very, very real.
China is not a leftist country, nor is Iran, Russia or in fact most of the world, out to promote a leftists agenda in the hopes of defeating Donald Trump. Yes, I agree there are those on the left, who will accept (secretly) of course, that this virus and its repercussions on the economy are worth the price to pay for getting Trump out of office. I also suppose if a Democratic President were in the White House today, instead of Donald Trump, the same scenario would be played out by the right. Unfortunately, such is the world we live in.[/b][/i]


The countries you mentioned certainly don’t have our best interests in mind.
Dictatorships with a Communist or Fascist history are appropriate. Would you like it better if they were labeled progressive’s? The old soft sell?

Your supposition is ridiculous. What party has shown a propensity for weaponizing any crisis including this one? The radical left Democratic Party.

I wish you luck on the front lines. Try to keep it in perspective.


My purpose in mentioning those other countries was that they took the needed measures - lockdowns and quarantines that they found necessary. They were not doing it to hurt Trump or make a political statement.

My initial post was written last week, now the rest of Europe is doing what they know must be done to help stem this pandemic, prevent their health care systems from being totally overwhelmed and save their citizens' lives. Lockdowns and quarantines - very unsettling and inconvenient to say the least, but effective in trying to "flatten the curve." We are doing the same thing. But what's making matters even worse is that there are not enough test kits yet available as well as proper masks (N-95) for we health care workers to safely treat these patients.

As I predicted, my initial reservations about enjoining a thread that I knew was gonna get political proved true; much smoke, little light and I'm pretty sure name calling will soon ensue. Hence I will not be posting any further responses here.

Trust me - or not I guess, I/we are getting daily updates and warning from our respective hospitals and right now one thing's for sure, it will get worse before it gets better. This virus will not discriminate between those that think its real and those that don't. I know these restrictions kind of fly in the face our independent, I'll go where I want to go, don't tell me what to do attitude which normally serves us well, but we also have a very strong, we are in it together, we will win attitude, that in this instance will serve all of us much better. It's serious and its not a hoax. But we will get through this.

To the OP, Rev, sorry this thread so devolved, but thanks for posting and all of you out there stay safe.




Last edited by BobFM on Tue Mar 17, 2020 7:47 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 5:09 pm 
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Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2009 2:23 pm
Posts: 90
Location: Phoenix AZ
I am 100% in tune with Vette Jockey 2 and Jeff Colorado as I am in that same age group. We just had our State Championship Shoot this past weekend and the overwhelming majority of the shooters I talked to feel the same--this is media driven madness and as mentioned I am allegedly in the age group that this effects badly? I am not changing my lifestyle and the things I do and moreover, this coronavirus IMHO is doing more harm to the country economically than the disease ever will. You have to take any virus or outbreak serious BUT not in full panic mode as many are.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 5:17 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:08 am
Posts: 2422
Location: Central NH
Without doubt, doomsday sayers, ignorists, and conspiracy theorists, are reveling in this situation.

Stay safe Bob. I'm a 69 year old with a touch of COPD. I'm staying home.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:16 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2003 5:26 pm
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Location: So Cal USA
sportclay100 wrote:
I. We just had our State Championship Shoot this past weekend and the overwhelming majority of the shooters I talked to feel the same--this is media driven madness...


The "overwhelming majority of the shooters I talked to feel the same"? Hey that's better than a medical degree any day.

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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 16, 2020 6:32 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2016 11:45 am
Posts: 2072
This is not “media driven madness”. Germany and Italy care not one wit about our media. If the healthcare professionals are able to do what they need to do, flatten out the curve as they say, this may indeed be seen as much ado about nothing. There’s a danger in that also, for the next time.

They need to err on the side of caution. They don’t want to be in a position a year from now saying they should have taken it more seriously.

I had an ER visit this weekend, gallbladder acting up. I asked the attending if they had taken any special precautions. He looked at me and said he hoped they don’t get what it sounds like they could. Words to that effect, he had me on some pretty good stuff.

Just got a great idea. Drive-in theater should open up. We have one locally, two screens. Watch from your car, bring whatever you want.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 7:03 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2016 7:24 am
Posts: 62
BobFM wrote:
I will repost this (edited) from a post I replied to on another forum last week.


This pandemic originated in China and rapidly spread around the world. However, China imposed major lockdowns and quarantines and has slowed their infection rate considerably. Italy was not prepared, did not impose travel and quarantine restrictions early enough and risks their health care system running out of resources - ICU beds, ventilators, masks, gowns, medical staff, etc. as the numbers of infected patients increase. Spain and Europe are trying not to replicate Italy's mistakes.
Of course the "regular, common yearly" flus have been terribly fatal and have not caused this type of reaction, but consider that this virus has no cure/vaccine in the near horizon, is more fatal - especially among patients with cancer, the elderly and/or those with preexisting comorbidities, probably more contagious and currently we do not have yet available enough test kits (thankfully kits will soon be available in the necessary amounts).

Yes, cancelling concerts, sport events, school classes and most any and all large gatherings is inconvenient and extremely costly - thinking of the losses the airlines, hotels, restaurants, tourism are going to sustain is staggering. I certainly can't speak to the individual gun/trap clubs shutting down or postponing tournaments; that's their call. And we as freedom loving Americans are simply not used to and are fearful of the government placing such restrictions on us. But as China learned, Europe, the USA and the rest of the world are all understanding, these restrictions/quarantines are absolutely necessary in helping to contain this virus and limiting the ensuing loss of life.


Since then more precautions are being mandated. Let's keep this non-political and yes sir, Rev, this is very real. Thank you for posting and hope all is well with you, your wife and friends. The next month or so may be rough and tough and scary, but we will get through this one.


Thank you for a well-thought out response.

I have seen too many articles and posts downplaying this and comparing it to flu or H1N1.

Being related to a few healthcare workers, and friends with dozens more (ER, ICU, RNs, MDs, Paramedics, etc) I believe this is not like H1N1. 

Is it overblown by the media?

Yes.

Is the potential for a large part of the population to be severely infected?

Yes.

Are healthcare workers and systems doing everything they can do prepare for the worst?

Yes.

One of our local systems just closed their smallest facility (less than 100 beds) to sanitize it and convert the rooms into makeshift isolation facilities for critically infected patients, if the need materializes. 

Good prep on the part of our community.

ER & Critical care MDs & RNs and Respiratory Therapists are all being taught proper PPE and procedural "donning & doffing" of said PPE to limit exposure to themselves and their colleagues.  They are discussing innovative ways to provide supportive care and limit aerosolization from respiratory distressed patients.

They are working through how to best reduce fomite transmission ( https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fomite ) because that is a major unknown. 

Critically ill patients will be staffed at 2:1 nurse to patient ratios.  One nurse to care for the patient.  One nurse to act as the spotter for potential issues related to isolation protocol and to limit exposure to caregivers.

Most ER personnel, first responders, and community health workers believe they either already have been or will be exposed to the virus.  We simply did not get out in front of this soon enough.

My brother is an ER nurse and expects to catch hell when he returns to his next shift.

My son is quarantined pending test results from one of his healthcare worker friends.  The soonest he may be able to return to work is Thursday.  Test results are not always quick . . .

Numerous industries have already been affected and the reach is greater than many people realize.

My company has already seen "Stop Work" orders on a couple of large projects and multiple delays on others.  We build durable goods used in manufacturing and maintenance of large industries that support the infrastructure of our country. 

Schools are closed and many of the people with whom I work, worship and fellowship will be forced to stay home with their children, reducing the resources available to an enormous amount of businesses which will have significant impact over the next couple of weeks.

We will see innovative business opportunities created from this crisis.  The American people always respond to business opportunities with creativity to meet needs and put food on the table.

All of that to say that this is unprecedented in our country and we have a responsibility to care for those around us in ways we have probably never considered.  This has the potential to recreate community in ways that our culture has forgotten or abandoned.

Buy LOCAL!!!  Local, especially small businesses will suffer the most.

Check on the elderly and infirm and those without dependable transportation.  Go shopping for them or bring them something home cooked.

Be merciful to those who have fewer resources than you.  The poor are going to be harder hit than most of us realize. 

Many more people will end up poor as a result of this. 

I am a firm believer than people will rise to the level we expect them to.  Our culture has very low expectations and we call all fix that with some deliberate changes.

Do good for others. Speak to people with hopefulness and in such a way that you raise the expectation of them to be kind.

Work.  If your company allows, go to work.  If they don't, be productive.  Maybe on your home, vehicle, neighbor's home or vehicle, or any number of other creative ways.

Take a kid fishing or shooting or hiking.

Take an older person fishing or shooting or hiking.

Do justice, love mercy, walk humbly.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 7:48 am 
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Joined: Thu Dec 05, 2013 7:11 am
Posts: 4419
Location: Western Tampa, FL
OP: check for PM just sent.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:15 am 
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Joined: Mon Aug 03, 2009 2:29 pm
Posts: 601
Day 7 and no symptoms which is a good thing. Our county medical dept. has contacted us and gave us this information.
If you have been exposed but have no symptoms you will be asked to quarantine for 14 days from when the exposure took place.
Since my wife was the person exposed she is the only one who has to stay in quarantine. I am free to go about my business. This leads me to believe that my chances of spreading this last weekend were near 0%.
This information is different from what we were originally told by our doctors. The information we got last Sunday evening was that we were both potentially able to spread the virus even though no symptoms were present.
This miss information that is spread by both health care providers and the media is what makes this whole mess dangerous. I would never have posted this if I had been given the proper info.
That said please continue to take this virus seriously and if you are ill stay home. I will probably restrict my shooting for the next two weeks and see what happens. I am fortunate that I can go out to my club and shoot all by myself and get some head clearing target breaking time.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:09 pm 
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Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2018 6:01 pm
Posts: 9
This thread and the resulting posts has displayed one major thing to me: there are one hell of a lot of very sane and very intelligent people on this site. A very knowledgeable and polite discussion on a very important matter. Differing opinions as usual but, all helpful I believe.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 2:11 pm 
Shooting Instructor
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Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:16 am
Posts: 2386
Rem,

Everyone to his or her own opinion. That is what America is about. Like you, I at first thought this pandemic was a farst. I like you thought is was another Liberal ploy to remove President Trump from office. They couldn't do with ALL of the other things they have tried.

I personally believe that the President, in the beginning, was trying to calm the country and keep the stock market level for as long as he could. Well, That didn't last long. I believe his advisors and people in the real know briefed him to the real facts of this problem. He instantly acted in the beginning but after the information got worse, he jumped in and made drastic and unheard of decisions to protect us.

I am 67 years old and have a long history with lung disease. I am a type 2 diabetic (15 years) and I also have a blood clotting disorder. And to top that off I have liver disease. My wife Kathy had a liver transplant 11 years ago and takes anti rejection drugs as well as many others. She is also a school teacher. (Retired) Now she is a Permanent Sub and of course my job requires lots of travel. For me, I will no longer be teaching or setting targets. Our schools are close like most schools around the country so Kathy will be at home too. We are self quarintening ourselves!!!! we will not be going to town. Our daughter and son - n law will be shopping for us. The live a 100 yards from us. We have a freezer loaded with all kinds of wild game so we won't need to buy meat for several months if we need to.

Mike McAlpine
The Clay Target Academy

Buy the way, all we are doing is taking our Presidents advice. He is in the position to know the real facts.

Also, My daughter has now change her mind on this virus. She seems to be more worried especially for her mom and me. I told you she is an Oncology and surgery nurse.

I would encourage ALL Clubs to close down for a time. There is no reason to put your clients in danger. You will need them when this thing is over with. I believe when this thing is over, all business like restaurants, bars, clay target ranges and others will see a boom in business. People will want to get out of the house and do the things they have missed. They will eat more and drink more than they would normally do and you can bet you last dollar, shooters will be going to the ranges a lot more often.

If I still owned a range, I would be thinking about a three day shoot right after we get back to normal. The tournament shooters will want to catch up on target counts and the social shooters will want to get back in the gruve beating their buddies. The stock market will go back up. Maybe not to the 30,000 high but it needed to correct for a long time. Jobs will come back and the economy will return to a steady climb. This may take a few months or so but things will get better.

I will be praying for all of you. Many of you are my friend and and I wish all of you and your families and friends the best in health. Keep the faith in your hearts!


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 6:02 pm 
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One thing I'd like to know, at least around here all the gun clubs have had too close due to restrictions put on them by the state, yet golf clubs are totally unaffected. I don't see how there is a difference between the two except for one being generally socially acceptable and one not.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 7:38 pm 
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Joined: Mon Jan 20, 2020 12:18 pm
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Coronavirus is an awesome tool for figuring out who is switched on and who is an imbecile. Theres no point in saying which side I think is which, as people generally aren't persuadable. That having been said, I find it an awesome personal tool for coming to my own private conclusions.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 7:58 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:34 pm
Posts: 5986
donoshei wrote:
Coronavirus is an awesome tool for figuring out who is switched on and who is an imbecile. Theres no point in saying which side I think is which, as people generally aren't persuadable. That having been said, I find it an awesome personal tool for coming to my own private conclusions.


How very entertaining for you.:-)


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:04 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 20, 2019 9:53 am
Posts: 1356
I'm going shooting at a clays course Friday if the weather holds. Won't be lingering in the clubhouse and will use a glove to work the trap buttons. I won't go to the trap club though. Too many old guys there and i don't want to add a risk factor for those guys.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:09 pm 
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Joined: Sun Aug 03, 2014 11:58 am
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Location: Washington State
ShowMe wrote:
gdub41 wrote:
https://www.wect.com/2020/03/16/interactive-map-track-all-reported-coronavirus-cases-world/

the survival rate is actually quite high people who are succumbing to it, have other underlining medical issues that aren't being reported on.


So it is within your rights to spread the virus to those in the high risk groups?


The same can be said about people electing not to get the flu vaccine. Do you believe everyone should be forced to take the flu (or any other) vaccine despite being against their will?

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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 8:23 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 28, 2012 12:11 pm
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News from Coyote Springs, and the B&P FITASC event.

https://www.facebook.com/48200004184000 ... 10967/?d=n

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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 17, 2020 9:54 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2016 4:20 pm
Posts: 532
Location: Mississippi
Raymond 525 sums it up well. Good perspective. I applaud the facility that is preparing a 100-bed center as a possible critical care area. The reports about vent shortages in Italy is hard to fathom. He gets a vent, but no, not him.

This will exceed 1,000 deaths a day whether you’re bent on it being a conspiracy theory or not. It was nearly that today at well over 800 deaths and approx. 16,000 new cases. It’s incredibly contagious. It will resolve but it strikes me as imperative to limit or eliminate exposure to the vulnerable, immediately. The term, “flattening the curve” gets tossed around but it is the logical, best attempt to be sure adequate resources are available.

. . . and I work in health care and the number of meetings I’m having to attend on this matter is as ridiculous as the toilet paper hoarding.


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 6:17 am 
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Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2015 6:51 am
Posts: 76
Since I get my information from the MEDIA, I have realized that corona is saving lives.... There have been zero reports of shootings in Chicago. Three weeks ago or so, the MEDIA was reporting anywhere from two - nine shootings and deaths every day. Now, the Media has not reported a single one... Sounds like we have unfortunately lost one person here in IL to corona (had severe asthma), but we have possibly save 100 thanks to corona...OR, does the media only report whatever gives them the biggest bang for their buck.... Carry on.....


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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 7:27 am 
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Quote:
. . . and I work in health care and the number of meetings I’m having to attend on this matter is as ridiculous as the toilet paper hoarding.


Just curious...isn't that exactly what the medical community is telling the non-medical community not to do?

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 Post subject: Re: Coronavirus is for real!!!
PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2020 8:11 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 09, 2009 11:53 am
Posts: 1090
Location: Dallas, Texas
Dallas is pretty much locked down. Fortunately I'm a reader who also has Netflix, Hulu, Acorn, Amazon Prime, and I have access to 80+ fenced acres at my gun club to walk the dog, so I'm not going stir crazy and can work the puppy's energy off. I was puzzled by all the phone and text messages I was getting from neighbors asking if I was alright and if I needed anything. After the second such, I realized that I'm considered "elderly and fragile" under the current guidelines (69.5 years old). While I admit to being somewhat amused, as I'm likely in better shape than some of the people who checked up on me, I am touched by their concern. I have good neighbors. MAJ



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Last edited by MAJENKINS on Wed Mar 18, 2020 9:17 am, edited 1 time in total.

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