Shotgunworld.com

I've been noticing lately, that this has become a place where new shooters are not free to come to ask questions and get advise any longer. Because if they do, they are ridiculed or not answered at all. As an example, I dont' think Naval_Aviator is coming back and I don't blame him. Several told him if he didn't like it to leave, and so he did. And same for UWYOshooter... He came as a new guy wanting to learn, got ridiculed and very little help.

No one even bothered to comment or offer condolences on the passing of Herve Laliberte, an ambassador for skeet. Is this how you would like others to rememer you when it's your time?

So my questions is, why has this forum gone this direction? Could this be Obama's fault, or perhaps GWB's fault?

Is the skeet forum still relevant if it does not serve new shooters, but only serves for a place for long time shooters to argue over skeet pouches and foot faults.

Jim

Some good points there, Jim.

While it is prudent to be mindful of possible troll (noun) activity, the benefit of the doubt might be the better course for some of the new posters. With regards to asking for or giving advice, Eiderz has found that neither experience nor results exempt one from ridicule, it is apparent that when logging onto the net, everyone suddenly is imbued with the knowledge gained during a good night's sleep at a Holiday Inn Express.

eiderz And DrJim,
I spend a fair amount of time on this forum and on another well known forum. I very seldom post for the very reasons you point out. It seems that gentlemanly behavior is severely lacking in out present society, both face to face and on the net. I glean a lot of useful info from folks on here but the rude talk does turn me off. I'll continue to "lurk here" and continue to PM if I need to communicate. Thanks for your input.
Gary

I agree. I limit my posts for these reasons. I PM for answers to my questions.

Jim, I could not disagree with you more. I think you saw a distorted view of the situation in the previous post and are doing it again. You said "I am ashamed of a bunch of you. This man came here to learn about skeet, to share fellowship with other skeet shooters, and when he told you about the problems he had on his first shoot, what was your response? That's the way the game is played, if you don't like it get out."

The bunch of them was one person, stackman, and he comes off like a fart in a diving helmet and I personally do not think we should tolerate his behavior on this forum. For some reason he does not feel he can post on here without attacking someone. Other than him, NO ONE told him to leave. They did inform him of what the real world was in competition skeet shooting and they did it in a civil manner. The biggest discussion was between Stephen and Magoo on whether it was a rule or a recommendation which it obviously is. I think you need to go back and reread that whole thread. Unless you use a jaundiced eye, you will not find anyone else that did anything other than tell him how it is. If you feel like we all need to be sympathetic to his issue we will be doing him a disservice.

I had a similar issue and discussed it on here when I "restarted" shooting skeet a few years ago. I had a lot of trouble with people when I was practicing talking when I was on the pad about to shoot. I had quite a few people tell me to "get over it" and in not too kind a manner. Eiderz told me to get over it but he also added that I needed to use it to my advantage to be able to shut it out of my mind and that when i conquered this problem on the practice field it would be a good help for me in competition.

We are generally all adults here and hopefully we have learned to ignore the stackman types. They are few and far between here and that is one of the beauties of this site. I hope that naval aviator stays and learns from the people on here like I have over the last years. I don't think there is another place on the net that comes close to this one. That's my 2 bits worth and I say this in no disrepect for you Jim. I get the feeling you are a very nice man and someone worth knowing. I feel that way about the vast majority of the people on here.

This is the way internet forums operate good bad indifferent that is how it is.
It also ebbs and flows with new comers old comers and others.

If you think this is bad try a NFL forum or car site holy moly...
It seems that folks get extra brave when they're hidden behind a keyboard.

Ours here is relativity civil there are a few that like to insult or play know it all but other than that...

Everyone here is human and we all make mistakes or behave badly at times so I like to chalk it up to that.

I think everyone posting here should reread the entire thread being discussed. Dr. Jim is absolutely wrong in his placement of blame. The OP (original poster) bragged about juvenile behavior and threats to leave the sport for ridiculous reasons. Stackman listened to several posts from the OP that indicated that he needed a bit of counselling before he posted. His post addressed quite clearly the deficiencies in Naval Aviator's behavior and attitude. I agree with Stackman's points, suspect that Magoo does not have an NSSA number, and think that Naval Aviator brought any criticism on himself. I also think that Naval Aviator does not want to be a participant and made that clear in his posts. He is a whiner and no one should have to apologize for "making it hard for new shooters" on the thread being discussed. He got a wealth of good advice from almost all posters, including Stackman. 88831

Nice! Big party this Friday right on the ocean, got some new ammo there. Eiderz is shooting the big gun again, and ready for some action!

By the way, congratulations to eiderz for remaining under the radar once again. However, if this thread continues, I will make it clear what I really think. I think I was rather diplomatic in my post, not pinning the "whiner" label on anyone but the original poster, Naval Aviator. I had another name in mind to add. Naval Aviator and Magoo should attend a few shoots to see how it is done. Maybe just one shoot would be sufficient.

Thanks Chic.

I too stand by both my words in the other thread and the tenor of my writing. I personally do not feel that I owe anyone an amends nor do I believe that I should modify the tone of my discourse. I do not feel that my posts are, in any reasonable way, cause for a shooter to leave the BBS or skeet.

So, my friend Baron 23 agrees with me that Dr. Jim is a bit off topic in criticizing all posters on the Skeet forum for being unkind to trolls. Dr. Jim, in my opinion, we treat all trolls fairly and equally.

lowgun, please understand I did not criticize all posters on this forum, and judging by some responses both public and private, I am not that far off with my comments. I am not going to single out anyone, it would just be the kettle calling the pot black.

It would seem to me, what makes this forum valuable is that it is a place for new and experienced alike to come and exchange ideas. Many do not feel safe to post as they feel they will be attacked for asking a question or writing a post.

If this is to remain a place open to all shooters, it would seem to me we could go an extra step, much as eiderz has done with ''Shoot With the Stars," and be generous with new shooters and new posters. When I was fortunate enough to shoot with eiderz in the prototype Stars shoot, he and Bobby D. not only shot with us, but they drank with us, ate with us, and introduced us to their friends.

The alternative is, this forum will get smaller and smaller, as fewer and fewer people feel safe enough to post. We need to grow skeet, grow reg shooting, and this forum plays a role in that process, believe it or not.

If y'all want to bit$$ at me, well we've known each other long enough, and I sure have made my share of mistakes, but it seems to me, we could do a more to make this place somewhere new posters and new shooters feel comfortable to post.

Jim

Dr. Jim, it is very difficult for people like Baron 23 and several others to change their ways, due to their severe personality disorder. Besides the endless repetition, OCD is characterized by people, who like to put themselves and others in the pecking order, expect others to think and act as they do, and they become critical, judgmental, demeaning of those who do not think and act as they do.

They will continue to act that way, and have acted that way their entire lives. Changes will not occur without the intervention of substantial amounts of therapy. It is just the way it is. You have to remember that the OCD is an essential component of their personality, and they are not likely to change any time soon:)

Some of you guys crack me up.

Relevant? To Skeet shooting? Well, let’s see. At the current moment, the most viewed topics in the last ten days have been” I Finally Got MY Al Ange Pouch - WOW!!” (853 hits), “When a Ref Ruins Your Game” (989), "Andy Griffith’s skeet gun" (1734), and “Skeet Pouches” (1983). My squad of real shooters couldn’t care less about pouches and they don’t whine about referees. They might be interested in reading something relevant from Stu Fairfank, but they’ve given up waiting for that to happen. They don’t consider it relevant that if you get a shiver up your leg thinking and writing about your pouch, you might get a couple thousand hits here.

On the other hand, a recent post from Ross817 says “First 25!!!!!!!!!!” and gets a measly 230 hits. The first response on that one, by the way, was a congratulatory message from Stackman. Nothing was heard from DrJim or Eiderz or Customstox.

Speaking of the local guru and “star”, why does he continue to speak of himself in the royal third person while habitually laying low when his input might carry some weight? Lowgun wasn’t afraid to offer an opinion counter to the mass hysteria of the kool-aid drinking sheep, why not the “star”?

Stackman is bemused, and amused.

Im new to the forum and have not had a negative experience at all. I think in a forum (any forum) some replies will be constructive some will not and just ignore the crappier ones :-)

Sometimes you have to put on the waders to wander on the internet!

Considering the source of this post, this is the best laugh I have had in quite some time. Wow, ROTFLMAO

Ya......... I got a pretty good laugh out of it as well. Always consider the source.


Bruce

Good points all. My thought in starting this thread was, this forum is getting smaller and smaller, and looking at some responses, public and private, there is a growing segment who will come here read what is available but never post because they don't want the confrontation that can happen. If fewer topics are interesting or educational to these readers, they too won't come back.

If our wish is to grow skeet, then we need to add people to accomplish that aim. If new posters are not welcome here, I don't think they will feel like they will be welcomed at reg shoots either. If people are not free to express ideas here, without ridicule, I don't think they will fee like they can join the reg community without ridicule either.

Like it or not, it seems to me, reg skeet is judged by the posters on this forum many, many times.

Jim

I have no idea who Remington11 is, but he is way off base with his assessment of Baron23, as a couple of other posters have mentioned. Thank you stackman for your comments, but I disagree about your negatives on the pouch thread and the Andy Griffith thread, both of which were quite entertaining and enlightening. I may display my pouch collection at the next big shoot I attend, just to emphasize my interest. These guys who work so hard at their trade should be recognized. This forum is not irrelevant in any way. It is of interest to new shooters as well as old ones. No new shooter is turned off by what he reads here, unless he is a whiner. I have challenged Magoo to post his NSSA number. Now I challenge Naval Aviator to post his military credentials. I have no doubt that he can. (sarcasm, if you were wondering)