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 Post subject: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 9:13 pm 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Tue Mar 24, 2009 6:53 pm
Posts: 905
Sooo often I chat with people and ask about fitasc tournaments and I will get a reply welllll....."the judges are not serious about the rules." My thoughts if a club is going to have a legit tourney there is nothing wrong with sticking to the rules. No different than any other sport. Being consistent and true will only help grow the sport.

By the way if you are on the fence about trying the game give it a shot!! I love it, actually even more than traditional clays. It took me a while after I switched to shooting left handed to learn this mount.....once you try it you will love it!!

In fact there is a tournament this Sunday at Eagles Nest Near Columbus, come on out and see what Dan Bailey and his team are up to!! You wont regret it.



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Bill Elliott
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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:56 pm 
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I love to shoot FITASC but I hate it. :lol:

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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:35 am 
Field Grade

Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2016 8:25 pm
Posts: 25
As a sporting clays shooter, take my comments with a grain of salt. I personally prefer when the judges are jovial and interact with the squad. It makes a stuck-up game much less uncomfortable and more enjoyable. When I get a referee who is overbearing and feels the need to point out rules that haven’t been broken, they can’t help but to come off as rude and arrogant. Turns this sporting clays shooter off big time. For example, at Nationals this year some squad mates of mine were in the parking lot unpacking their guns, putting them together and mounting them to make sure everything was in place. A FITASC judge came flying over to inform the junior shooter that they were not allowed to mount their weapon and simulate an attempt. The shooter and his father politely informed the referee to return to their station 75yds away because they were actually there to shoot five stand, which shares a parking lot!!


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 7:44 am 
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Tidewater, I agree with you 100%. If the judge is all about the rules it is not good.

It can really hurt my scores because I just get mad which don't help anything.

For what they are charging for FITASC these days I want it to be fun.

If the judge wants to be fun I can be fun. If he wants to be pissy I can be pissy to. I also know the rules.

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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 8:22 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:20 pm
Posts: 18463
As a FITASC ref, I always start each squad with an introduction, and ask if anyone is new - if so - I'll remind them of the few faults commonly made, like pre-mounting, etc.
That said, if the squad is one of the top tier shooters, I just introduce myself, keep it quietly civil because they already know everything and act more like a well-tuned trap squad.
With new shooters, if they start to raise their gun prematurely, I give a polite HRUMPH as a reminder, smile, and remind them......
I think some shooters expect the ref to be nothing more than a stoic statute, others think they'll be dealing with Attila the Hun; I just try to treat folks like I would want to be treated. That said, some shooters seem to forget, especially when the weather is bad, that the ref has been standing outside in it all day; and when it's raining like it did one day last year at the Open, everyone is a little testy.

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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 9:31 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 2:49 pm
Posts: 2602
Location: Thiensville Wisconsin
almost every Fitasc ref I have encountered has been great to deal with. Sure there are some fitasc refs that really hone in on things and run a tight ship, and for me that's fine too. I think guys are just intimidated by fitasc and think it's really complicated, when once you get through your first peg, it's pretty straight forward.

Talk about getting broken in, my first Fitasc event was north brook, as my father says, if your gonna go big........go huge. I've been hooked ever since, and alot of the guys that were on my squad are guys that I shoot with now today.

Fitasc is a brother hood, and if you have a poor gun mount, it's going to make for a lousy day, that is also what I believe drives guys away.

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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:18 am 
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I agree with oneounce -- our combined goal should be to welcome newer shooters to our sport. When I introduce somebody to FITASC, I always tell the ref they're new. To my mind, that means gently reminding newer shooters about arcane rules, as opposed to immediately penalizing them. Agree it's a fine line, but I've seen most FITASC refs handle it extremely well. A few seem to get drunk on the power, but they're a minority -- fortunately.

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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 10:51 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:20 pm
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I prefer to get drunk on a good Cab. With newbies, the main thing is the premount, for which I remind without penalty - once. The other times I see it a lot - from experienced shooters - are the days when they have shot regular before lunch and come to FITASC after. One or two polite "let's not do that again, please", they smile sheepishly, thank me for the reminder, and it's then GTG.

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The bitterness of poor quality is remembered long after the sweetness of low price has faded from memory, Aldo Gucci

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience, George Carlin


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 11:19 am 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Sun Nov 09, 2008 9:33 am
Posts: 897
Location: idaho
Every FITASC ref I have encountered loves the sport and wants to encourage more shooters. They have been generally pretty liberal with new shooters struggling with the differences from sporting clays. Most sporting clays where I shoot are score your own events, and I have seen a few new FITASC shooters become upset when they learn that whether they hit a bird is not something they can put to a majority vote of their squad! FITASC where I have shot it has a tradition of being a more formal and focused event that sporting clays, and some shooters are put off by that. I have never encountered a FITASC ref who was not polite but I am sure there are a few out there.


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 12:49 pm 
Field Grade
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Joined: Mon May 30, 2016 9:26 am
Posts: 89
It's not offered enough in South Ga, but I'm going to shoot FITASC at the FL Challenge and Seminole. I know them Bradford Boy's going have something special.


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:11 pm 
Shooting Instructor
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Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:16 am
Posts: 1862
eye,

I think a good FITASC judge can follow the rules and be friendly too. I have no problem with the rules being enforced. In fact, I demand it. I do the same in sporting and playing a nickel game of poker. Rules level the playing field for all shooters. I do not like a judge who thinks the are the King. I have never had many problems with any reff that is truly knowledgeable of the rules and will listen to a question.

At Nationals several years ago I was kicked off a peg because I questioned a reff about his warning about not throwing all empty hulls into a trashcan. He told me that it wasn't his job to pick up my hulls. The funny thing was I always throw my hulls into a box but on one pair they hit the edge and bounced out. I let the matter slide until this guy jumped on a young shooter for not putting his empties in the box and he wasn't friendly to either one of us. There is a lot more to this story but this was one of the few times that I had a problem. Most FITASC judges are great. (maybe a little firm)

Mike McAlpine


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:26 pm 
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Joined: Mon Dec 02, 2013 3:02 am
Posts: 1070
KRIEGHOFFK80 wrote:
I love to shoot FITASC but I hate it. :lol:

That's not a real exclusive club Terry.
:lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 1:28 pm 
Crown Grade
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Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:20 pm
Posts: 18463
Actually, it has always been my responsibility to make sure my peg or parcour is policed of hulls. Semis are one thing, but if someone is shooting and O/u and having a bad day and throwing hulls wildly (especially true of the immature Jr level M class kids), I remind them that that attitude is not welcome, take a breath, and when you're done, pick up your empties. I did that to one kid who was shooting with his family; his dad was nice enough to back me up.
Polite, respectful, but firm works; as does having a smile, thanking folks for shooting and wishing them good luck with the rest of the shoot.

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The bitterness of poor quality is remembered long after the sweetness of low price has faded from memory, Aldo Gucci

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience, George Carlin


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:24 pm 
Shooting Instructor
Shooting Instructor

Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:16 am
Posts: 1862
one,

I totally agree with your comment but there is no rule that says a shooter can't drop their hulls on the ground. I really understand the extra work that this causes and that is why I always make an effort to put my empties in the trash can. I am an old time trap shooter who opens the gun and slaps the empties into the can. Very seldom do I not make the can. This is really what happened when I got kicked off the peg. I politely took this up with the reff when the peg was over not wanting to create a scene while my squad mates were waiting to shoot.

Steve Fisher, and old time shooter backed me up as well as did other members of our squad. I talked to the range manager about this reff and even went as far as to file a written protest against this reff. I later found out that this guy was not a certified reff. This guy stopped me in the middle of my call to scold me. He picked up each hull one at a time and dropped them into the box. He did this while staring me right in the eye. This was a deliberate try to cause me to miss. I didn't even say a word until he did this to a young shooter from Venezuela. This young man had been a perfect gentleman throughout the FITASC event. I do believe in putting empties in the trash can BUT I WILL NOT PUT UP With a JERK REFF.

Mike McAlpine


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:30 pm 
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I wouldn't have put up with his 'tude either Mike

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The bitterness of poor quality is remembered long after the sweetness of low price has faded from memory, Aldo Gucci

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience, George Carlin


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 6:37 pm 
Shooting Instructor
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Joined: Mon Dec 24, 2007 12:16 am
Posts: 1862
one,

It is a lot easier to be nice than it is to be a jerk. Good manners are cheap, they don't cost a thing and will always make shooting more fun. Plus this will get more people to try our sport, especially FITASC which is my favorite game. I LOVE IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mike McAlpine


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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 1:39 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2014 1:53 pm
Posts: 45
Location: South Carolina
Welcoming shooters to my peg or Parcours with a smile and a friendly word is something I do without fail. I believe that you can be an exceptional referee, while enforcing the myriad rules that are FITASC in a friendly, polite, professional, and efficient manner. I’ve found that the young and new shooters that I’ve guided through their first attempts at FITASC thank me for my help and greet me with a smile when we see each other again.

You can be firm and enforce the rules without being insulting, or worse, condescending. This is an expensive game we participate in and a referee that takes him/herself too seriously can leave a bad taste for the game and the hosting club - never a good thing.

In general, we referees have the privilege of associating with some of the finest folks anywhere. There will always be shooters and refs with a permanent chip on their shoulders, and everyone has an occasional bad day, but by and large most of the shooters and fellow referees I encounter are genuinely good folks who enjoy this game and want those around them to enjoy it as well.

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Andy Harrell

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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 1:47 pm 
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Well said and well done. Keep up the good work. {hs#

Shooters spend a lot of money and enjoy a good time.

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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:16 pm 
Crown Grade
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Joined: Fri May 06, 2005 7:55 pm
Posts: 3631
Location: Erie, PA
FITASC

zzzzzzzzzzZZZZZZZZZzzzzzzzzzz

Boring. Takes way too long to shoot, not that I am in a hurry but 'cmon.....

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FORUMS are for ENTERTAINMENT ONLY. They don't teach shooting!

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 Post subject: Re: Fitasc stuff
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 4:22 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 08, 2008 6:20 pm
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All depends on your squad and how fast they shoot



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The bitterness of poor quality is remembered long after the sweetness of low price has faded from memory, Aldo Gucci

Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience, George Carlin


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