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 Post subject: Re: Gotta say i love FITASC over regular sporting.
PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2020 11:58 am 
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Location: Western Colorado
lt0026 wrote:
Sporting clay's doesn't revolve around registered shooting. Ask any club owner.

You’re right about that, and I have talked to club owners in my area. They all say that if they had to provide trappers they would not offer NSCA shoots. However, they do not usually cite cost as the main reason. Most say it’s the hassle of rounding up people, training them (minimally), and, since many of them are kids, making sure they have snacks, water, sunscreen, transportation, etc. After all that, they still have problems. Owners told me that they have hardly ever had a complaint about cheating at SYO events, but when they have tried in the past to provide trappers they’ve been showered with complaints about poor performance. It’s a Catch-22 for them, and it’s a real factor in sparsely populated areas. That’s just the way it is here and many other parts of the country. The owners make it work as best they can, and at least here I’ve never heard mention of “credibility” issues. Other areas may be different.

lt0026 wrote:
Skip the food. I can bring my own or go out and eat what I want elsewhere. I don't go shooting for a lunch.

I agree.

lt0026 wrote:
Just as many people stay away from SYO as those that go because of the price.

You have no way of knowing that. In my part of the world SYO is all there is most of the time, and registered shooting has been growing rapidly (at least before Covid), both in terms of participants and number of shoots offered.



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 Post subject: Re: Gotta say i love FITASC over regular sporting.
PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2020 12:12 pm 
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lt0026 wrote:
Sporting clay's doesn't revolve around registered shooting. Ask any club owner. I would rather costs are cut elsewhere like crappy food and used to pay trappers. Give me good targets and trappers. Skip the food. I can bring my own or go out and eat what I want elsewhere. I don't go shooting for a lunch. Who is "we"? Just as many people stay away from SYO as those that go because of the price. No NSCA fees,no state fees,no lunch, no trophy, no BTC and no scoring fees and I bet the price would still be the same. The clubs are a tax collector for the associations. $15.00 per shoot is a smallest expense you have.


Can't skip the food for most clubs here - these places want you to shoot 100 in the AM and a different 100 in the PM; most are fairly far from anywhere to eat, and they know if you leave the odds are better you're not coming back for the PM shoot.
Around here, most offer a nice sausage type breakfast to go with lunches. Some clubs are getting smarter by taking prepaid lunch orders and then providing for those who want it.
And you'd still have to feed the trappers and the other help. It can be a major expense and if turnout is low the club goes from making some money to losing money.
Massive catered all you can eat is going away; being replaced by prepaid or smaller offerings to help save the club some money.

Clubs here LOVE the charity-types of shoots. The organizers handle all the costs, food, prizes and whatever. The club gets one check to cash (and not having to deal with 50+ 3% credit card fee losses), gets to set some easy fun targets that no one will complain about, and makes more money on cart rentals, gun rentals, ammo sales, etc.
And they can hold one everyday of the week.
Why as many clubs still bother with the hassle of monthly shoots amazes me.

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 Post subject: Re: Gotta say i love FITASC over regular sporting.
PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2020 12:28 pm 
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Seems like clubs should be looking to make $$ on the side stuff. Long bird stations, accessory sales, ammo sales, cart girls with snacks/drinks to buy, warm up 5 stands, gun sales and rentals and all manner of side games.

SYO is a non starter for me.


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 Post subject: Re: Gotta say i love FITASC over regular sporting.
PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2020 12:55 pm 
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Location: Western Colorado
birdhunter39 wrote:
Seems like clubs should be looking to make $$ on the side stuff. Long bird stations, accessory sales, ammo sales, cart girls with snacks/drinks to buy, warm up 5 stands, gun sales and rentals and all manner of side games.

Even our state shoot doesn't have much of that stuff. A carnival atmosphere might sound good, but most of those things have front-end costs of their own, and for most club owners in my area the numbers don't justify the risk.

birdhunter39 wrote:
SYO is a non starter for me.

Fine, then don't do it. I'm glad that you have options. I and many others don't.

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 Post subject: Re: Gotta say i love FITASC over regular sporting.
PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2020 2:30 pm 
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Quote:
Fine, then don't do it. I'm glad that you have options. I and many others don't.


Exactly right for me as well.
If I want to shoot registered it is SYO or nothing until the big blasts in January and February.

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 Post subject: Re: Gotta say i love FITASC over regular sporting.
PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2020 3:15 pm 
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jwgworld wrote:
lt0026 wrote:
Sporting clay's doesn't revolve around registered shooting. Ask any club owner.

You’re right about that, and I have talked to club owners in my area. They all say that if they had to provide trappers they would not offer NSCA shoots. However, they do not usually cite cost as the main reason. Most say it’s the hassle of rounding up people, training them (minimally), and, since many of them are kids, making sure they have snacks, water, sunscreen, transportation, etc. After all that, they still have problems. Owners told me that they have hardly ever had a complaint about cheating at SYO events, but when they have tried in the past to provide trappers they’ve been showered with complaints about poor performance. It’s a Catch-22 for them, and it’s a real factor in sparsely populated areas. That’s just the way it is here and many other parts of the country. The owners make it work as best they can, and at least here I’ve never heard mention of “credibility” issues. Other areas may be different.

lt0026 wrote:
Skip the food. I can bring my own or go out and eat what I want elsewhere. I don't go shooting for a lunch.

I agree.

lt0026 wrote:
Just as many people stay away from SYO as those that go because of the price.

You have no way of knowing that. In my part of the world SYO is all there is most of the time, and registered shooting has been growing rapidly (at least before Covid), both in terms of participants and number of shoots offered.


Other than the lunch part, I agree with you. Lunch is expected around here.

My comments about money were based on FITASC refs and paying trappers a higher wage. You are spot on about finding, training and keeping them. $3.00 an hour more won't solve that.


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 Post subject: Re: Gotta say i love FITASC over regular sporting.
PostPosted: Fri Jul 24, 2020 5:56 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 20, 2019 9:53 am
Posts: 1025
the last event i shot had one very nice lady at a station. i don't believe she had ever seen clays shot before. they were advertising for help for quite a while before the shoot. agree it's not likely money but rather finding people to work.

strange considering we're all supposed to be suffering financially right now.


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 Post subject: Re: Gotta say i love FITASC over regular sporting.
PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2020 8:58 am 
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Joined: Mon Jun 15, 2009 8:18 pm
Posts: 508
Everyone has their own reasons to attend a shoot. Some is for the targets, some to be around shooters and old friends, some is for shooting and eating. Succesful ranges accommodate all that they can.

I understand the cost involved with hosting fitasc shoots. One though can differentiate hosting a fitasc shoot between a local-monthly gig and a higher level event. Yea, higher level is gonna pay a ref a acceptable wage....and it isn't 8 bucks an hour. But local ranges can get their local shooters trained, certified, and paid in other ways other then cash. Heck, one can receive targets at the range that equates to different totals in the receivers sum vs the club outage.

IMO, local ranges not hosting fitasc shoots is more a factor of space, machines, work, and the knowledge of setting them up properly. Refs, is a factor that can be overcome succesfully. A poor fitasc layout, not so much.

We are fortunate enough to have a local range throw 50 fitasc targets at the monthly shoot. Refs are the same two, and do a nice job at this level. Local fitasc shoots, IMO, should not be ref'd at the level of high end shoots. Yea, rules need to be followed and they are. But if you get a inexperienced C class guy that creeps a tad the world doesn't have to come to an end. This local event should focus on giving these shooters the experience that is hard to come by unless you attend higher end shoots.

This month, the main ran .84 a target while the fitasc .90 with discounted pricing for juniors. Its great to see juniors getting at it, and the event fills. Due to the amount of machines currently on property, the range does not offer the main on Sunday....moving machines from the main Saturday eve and setting the fitasc for Sunday. Yea, work....but they do it. And when more machines are acquired, the fitasc will run both Saturday and Sunday like in 2019. Space a key component which they have.

So, just my thoughts from a guy that enjoys fitasc, experience laying one out, and a certified ref that has ref'd in state and regional shoots.




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