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 Post subject: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Fri Mar 02, 2007 9:11 pm 
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Location: MT. Braddock Pa.
Finally got around to building a rifled 410 slug gun. I started out with a Brno 222 single shot. I had a preimun Douglas 405 Winchester bbl. laying around ,so i said 411 groove, why not?. I got it ready to shoot today, hope to get to the range tommorrow and try it out. Will start testing loads next week. I leaning towards 210 gr 41 mag bullet. Will try some factory loads tommorrow. I have a 4x12 Bushnell laying around i am going to try on it. Will keep you posted. Rich[img][img]http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g211/rshow/sendoutpic1461.jpg[/img]
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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 9:57 am 
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Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 6:35 pm
Posts: 40
Location: Ohio
AMEN I SAY !! FANTASTIC !! Now were're talkin' :D

Man,,, I haven't been this excited since I went
out-on-my-first-DATE !! I can smell a mass production line???
PLEASE KEEP US POSTED WITH THE OUTCOME,,,


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Sat Mar 03, 2007 4:48 pm 
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Location: Hudson River...NY/NJ
Very cool project...What you have is a shotgun version of a similar Smokeless Muzzleloader that many of my friends are working with. In their case, they have gotten rid of the pesky sabot (and all it's inherrent difficulties) and went directly to a Sabotless Smokeless Muzzleloader in .45 caliber!


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 9:47 am 
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Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 4:03 pm
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Location: Ohio
rshow, is this going to be a standard pressure .410 (.410 from heck), or .410 from hell?


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 Post subject: Re: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:29 am 
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razdog wrote:
rshow, is this going to be a standard pressure .410 (.410 from heck), or .410 from hell?

Raz i just got it barreled up yesterday. Being single shot i can exreriment with different loads. Will be trying for hotest safe load in plastic and brass cases. Waiting on some cases, want winchester cases as they are one piece. Will be trying pistol bullets as well as 405 win. slugs. Its on a very strong action. It weighs 5.8 lb with out scope. I will use this gun to exreriment with loads then most likely sell it if it works out then build a double. The reamed i have has a very short forcing cone, have never believed a forcing to be much of a problem in a slug gun. You can get tight groops at fifty yds. so why not 100, the problem lies with sabos, non precision slugs, and to short of slug per length (bc ). Look at revolvers they not only have forcing cones but a gap between bbl. and chamber, they work ok. Will be trying out some loads next week , will keep you posted. Rich


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 12:19 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 4:03 pm
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Location: Ohio
Awesome. A while back I started a thread about the .410 FH.

Since they are leagal in Ohio, it would seem to be the perfect ticket. In the woods is your longest shot even going to be 30 yards. Amped up a bit it would certainly reach and without out any potential sabot issues. How about being able to use plain cast bullets too.


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 10:35 am 
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Location: Ohio
Be sure to shoot a few factory foster slugs though it just to see if riflings make them more accurate. Very cool project!

mcb

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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:36 am 
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That just might work!! GREAT PROJECT!! :D You might look into using Megtech Brass .410 shells to avoid pressure problems. Let us know how it shoots!! :D

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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Mon Mar 05, 2007 11:56 am 
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Location: MT. Braddock Pa.
I am ordering ammo now, am going to blow out some 9.3x74 cases, might have to put a band around the first 1/2 in of the case mouth and fire form to make it heavyer . First i am going to play with plastic cases(ww 1 piece body.) to see what they will take. The gun i am using was a rifle . small firing pin, 3/4 in. under lug, its a good strong action. Rich


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 Post subject: Re: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 11:06 am 
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rshow wrote:
I am ordering ammo now, am going to blow out some 9.3x74 cases, might have to put a band around the first 1/2 in of the case mouth and fire form to make it heavyer . First i am going to play with plastic cases(ww 1 piece body.) to see what they will take. The gun i am using was a rifle . small firing pin, 3/4 in. under lug, its a good strong action. Rich


Sounds good, Rich! Are you going to use jacketed bullets or lead? I also think you could also use .30-40 Kraig cases as well but not sure on this. Keep us posted, Please! :D

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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 11:30 am 
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Location: MT. Braddock Pa.
Hoosier , The 30-40 cases would be to short, would be ok in 2 1/2 in chamber then you can use 444 brass. I am going to try 41 mag pistol bullets in plastic and brass case. If every thing works out i might try some 300 grain 405 win. bullets and maybe some 300 gr Barnes x shortened to 250 gr, lots of possabalitys. Rich


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 2:25 pm 
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Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 4:03 pm
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Location: Ohio
Don't forget that .303 British cases can be made into .410 shells.

If you chambered it for a shorter case, wouldn't it be easier to work up loads since you wouldn't have to fill up all the space with wads etc...?

Moreover, most commercially loaded shells are the shorter version anyway.


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 2:55 pm 
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Question: If your using a rifled barrel and brass cases, 444Marlin, 303 British, whatever and jacketed bullets do you really still have a shotgun? Or just a wildcat 41 caliber rifle?

Not a big deal but I would hate to be hunting deer here in Ohio with it where the 410 is legal for deer but rifles are not and try to convince a game warden that I am hunting with a 410 slug gun. Never mind that all my ammo sure looks like 444Marlin loads and my gun has conventionally rifled rifle barrel. I don't think and Ohio game warden would buy it.

Just curious
mcb

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The 410 slug gets no respect! My web site will teach you the TRUTH! Click Here and be enlightened!


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 Post subject: Re: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:07 pm 
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mcbirch wrote:
Question: If your using a rifled barrel and brass cases, 444Marlin, 303 British, whatever and jacketed bullets do you really still have a shotgun? Or just a wildcat 41 caliber rifle?

Not a big deal but I would hate to be hunting deer here in Ohio with it where the 410 is legal for deer but rifles are not and try to convince a game warden that I am hunting with a 410 slug gun. Never mind that all my ammo sure looks like 444Marlin loads and my gun has conventionally rifled rifle barrel. I don't think and Ohio game warden would buy it.

Just curious
mcb



The gun is chambered with a 410 reamer and will be marked (410 3 in slug) If it chamberes a 410 and is marded a 410 its a 410. They also make 410 brass shotgun shells. You can take a 12 gauge and load brass shells on plastic shells with a sabo and 50 cal. bullet but its still a shotgun. Yes it could be considered a 41 wildcat, you can load 41 pistol bullets in plastic 410 case but they won't shoot in a smooth bore. This is a rifled 410 use what ever case you want, More power, more range, confusing yes thats the whole idea. Rich


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 Post subject: Re: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:39 pm 
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rshow wrote:
mcbirch wrote:
Question: If your using a rifled barrel and brass cases, 444Marlin, 303 British, whatever and jacketed bullets do you really still have a shotgun? Or just a wildcat 41 caliber rifle?

Not a big deal but I would hate to be hunting deer here in Ohio with it where the 410 is legal for deer but rifles are not and try to convince a game warden that I am hunting with a 410 slug gun. Never mind that all my ammo sure looks like 444Marlin loads and my gun has conventionally rifled rifle barrel. I don't think and Ohio game warden would buy it.

Just curious
mcb



The gun is chambered with a 410 reamer and will be marked (410 3 in slug) If it chamberes a 410 and is marded a 410 its a 410. They also make 410 brass shotgun shells. You can take a 12 gauge and load brass shells on plastic shells with a sabo and 50 cal. bullet but its still a shotgun. Yes it could be considered a 41 wildcat, you can load 41 pistol bullets in plastic 410 case but they won't shoot in a smooth bore. This is a rifled 410 use what ever case you want, More power, more range, confusing yes thats the whole idea. Rich


I would use BIG BOLD letter when you stamp 410 slug gun on that barrel. :lol: This has always been of interest to me as there is very little to distinguish a rifled shotgun from a rifle. As you have already pointed out all brass shotgun shell have existed for a long time. And recently you can get rifle ammunition that is constructed more like a modern shotgun shell. Brass base with a polymer case similar to a shotshell but its actually a 5.56X45 cartridge. The line between rifle and shotgun is fuzzy at best if we allow rifled shotguns into the mix.

Rambling
mcb

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The 410 slug gets no respect! My web site will teach you the TRUTH! Click Here and be enlightened!


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 3:49 pm 
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The whole idea is to make the 410 god enough to be used as a deer rifle and to increase the accuracy and to extend the range to 150 or 200 yds with out trying to guess where the slug will hit. the 410 as is makes for a poor deer gun. notice i said gun not the R word. Don't want to stir up the Game Warden. Rich


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 Post subject: Re: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 4:07 pm 
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rshow wrote:
The whole idea is to make the 410 god enough to be used as a deer rifle and to increase the accuracy and to extend the range to 150 or 200 yds with out trying to guess where the slug will hit. the 410 as is makes for a poor deer gun. notice i said gun not the R word. Don't want to stir up the Game Warden. Rich


I believe it would be legal especially if the bullet is not seated outside the case like a rifle round. Might also try using a smaller diameter bullet like a .357" to .400" in a sabot. Anyway your project sounds very interesting! <Good> :D

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 Post subject: Re: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 7:17 pm 
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HOOSIER_5 wrote:
rshow wrote:
The whole idea is to make the 410 god enough to be used as a deer rifle and to increase the accuracy and to extend the range to 150 or 200 yds with out trying to guess where the slug will hit. the 410 as is makes for a poor deer gun. notice i said gun not the R word. Don't want to stir up the Game Warden. Rich


I believe it would be legal especially if the bullet is not seated outside the case like a rifle round. Might also try using a smaller diameter bullet like a .357" to .400" in a sabot. Anyway your project sounds very interesting! <Good> :D



I think you are getting the idea,thats why the long case, the case acts like the throat or free bore of the bbl. I would not crimp, if so only enough to make feeding possable through a pump or bolt. I have to work out the crimp and bullet pull after i do some loading. Rich


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2007 7:48 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 26, 2006 6:35 pm
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YAAHOOOOOO !!! OFF TO THE RANGE WE GO !!! :D


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 Post subject: re: 410 Rifled Slug Gun Project
PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2007 11:06 am 
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Location: Ohio
The fuzziness ends where the gun can chamber and safely fire a shotgun shell.

A member in the ASSA forum also recently indicated the other test of whether it is a shotgun or rifle is if it uses shotgun or rifle primers. I have not checked into it further.

But, it would only matter if it was over .50 as it could be construed as a destructive device. With the .410 case it does not.


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