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 Post subject: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:54 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 10:09 pm
Posts: 34
Location: Grand Island, Nebr.
I just reloaded 1,000 new AA hulls; 500 with windjammer wads and 500 with downrange wads. In both cases, about 10% of the wads would rise to the point that once the lead shot was inserted it would be within 1/8" of the top of the hull. I would then push it all down with a wooden rod until it was at the correct level and touching the powder like normal. In many of the the powder and shot would slowly rise back up. On these hulls I would have to re-push it back down 2 or 3 more times before the wad and shot would stay where is should be. I took some of these reloads back apart thinking that I would see that the wad was being caught on the plastic base insert that is now being used on these new hulls; this was not the case. Everything looked good. The base insert looked to be fully seated. What is the problem? Am I trapping air under the wad and it is pushing everything back up? I am using a single stage MEC Sizemaster 12ga reloader. I have reloaded about 20,000 shotgun hulls and have never had this happen to me before. I have also never read about this issue before.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,
shouldbecamping
Grand Island, NE


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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:12 pm 
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I see that happening also, yes it is the air being trapped by the wad. I say this, because if you distort the shell a bit prior to loading, the wad will not push up. It is not an issue as long as the shot does not run over when the precrimp is formed. The crimper will jam it back down. The Downrange xl-1 wads will do it also.

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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:18 pm 
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There is a lot of experence here and I am sure this group can help. First off it would be helpful to know the details of the load you are using. Just because they are listed in the book dosn't always mean they fit well in the hull. How's the wad pressure on your machine? Win AAHS's like a good bit of wad pressure with some types of wads.

I like the Windjammer and Down Range wads and have not had problems with either, but I prefer Remington hulls.

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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:31 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 10:09 pm
Posts: 34
Location: Grand Island, Nebr.
Hulls: Win. AA (Dark Gray)
Primer: Cheddite 209 (500 loads) Winchester 209 (500 loads)
Wad: Windjammer (500 loads) Downrange XL-1 1/8 blue (500)
Shot: 1-1/8 oz. #8 shot
Powder: 16.8gr. 700x

Wad pressure: Tried 10psi to 65psi
(The lighter the wad pressure, the better it seemed to work)


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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 10:51 pm 
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Gentlemen,

I've written this before, but once more I'll say it.

When loading the AA HS cases, I have found the Downrange DRA series wads to work better than any other wad.

These are clones of the Winchester OEM wads, but sit a tad lower in the cases and crimps are no problem at all. There is never a hint of crimp bulging, (poping), when using these wads. I never have seen the wads ever creep back up after seating either.

These wads come in 3 sizes. The DRA-12 Pink for 1 oz. loads, The DRA-12 White for 1-1/8 ox. loads, and the DRA-12 Yellow for 1-1/4 oz. loads.

For the AA HS cases, these wads simply cannot be beat.

DLM

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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Fri Jan 04, 2008 11:25 pm 
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DL is absolutely correct again. I've loaded a ton of AAHSs with most every wad commonly available in the free world. Very rarely have I experienced our campers problem. I'd be curious which Downrange wad you are using? They make a bunch of them! I'm suspecting you have Windjammers you got from Darlo's? He used to stock both Claybusters and Downrange. Claybuster made a slight change to their more or less standard 1-1/8 oz wad a couple years back. It is a light blue color and other than the lips on the overpowder cup are slightly rounded on the lip allowing it to fit into the base wad easier, they are the same. I'd be curious what the wad and hull looks like held up to a very bright light on the ones you have had problems with compared to those that do not give grief? You can get a very good perspective of their relationship of the wad in the hull that way, almost like an X-ray. There should be about 1/4" of difference somewhere. Either the wad IS hanging up, or the cushion section is not crushing and staying put, or heaven forbid, you got a double dose of powder. I like the Downrange XL-1 wads, the bright neon green ones. Darlo has them, go get a bag of them and load yourself up some 1 ozers with those wads and see what you think. That's all I use in 12 ga any more. Used a couple bags of Versalites 1-1/8 oz and both the Claybuster and Downrange version of the Windjammers too, never a problem for me, but I like the fit of the XL and the crimps and performance I get with them. DR also makes that same wad in a 1-1/8 oz version, I think it is dark blue. Are you positive your wad is not sticking on the ram and following it out of the hull on rare occasions?

BP

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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 2:41 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 1:58 pm
Posts: 406
Location: Hastings, Nebraska
I know, I know. :!: (Sorry, it's late and I'm still at the plant)

You added to much wad pressure and the wad sprang back up out of the slick base cup. The fix, back off the wad pressure and set the shot 3/8 of and inch from the top of the hull.

Note: The base cup in the new AAHS hull is very slick and stays this way after firing. Most other hulls get rough or pitted from the powder burning. Not this one.

Heck if you have a problem this week end call me. 402-463-3415

Kevin

Oh, don't forget there are 3 different base cups for the HS hull.


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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 8:18 am 
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I have been using the yellow Windjammer 1 oz with Clays powder in both the old and HS style 12 gauge hull...no problems with this recipe. I did notice that the yellow Windjammer has changed in design, the compression collumn is different, I need to chronograph when it warms up and the snow melts a bit..


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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 11:03 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 16, 2007 10:09 pm
Posts: 34
Location: Grand Island, Nebr.
Kevin, I agree with you. I also noticed that the base insert is very slick and I also noticed that the higher the wad pressure was, the more the problem showed up. 700x powder is a more dense powder that needs a smaller bushing compared to Clays or the like. This allowed me to push the wad farther into the hull to reach the powder.

I guess this leaves me two options. 1) When using 700x, leave a slight air gap between the powder and wad or 2) Switch back to Clays or Clay Dot powder. :)


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 Post subject: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 11:15 pm 
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How does the Downrange 7/8oz wad work in the AAHS hulls? When I run out of the wads I am using now, I was thinking of trying the 7/8oz downrange wads.Will be using clays powder.12gauge


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 Post subject: Re: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Sat Jan 05, 2008 11:24 pm 
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Location: Knoxville, Tn area Nyuck, Nyuck
mstap wrote:
How does the Downrange 7/8oz wad work in the AAHS hulls? When I run out of the wads I am using now, I was thinking of trying the 7/8oz downrange wads.Will be using clays powder.12gauge

The XXL-1 pink wads are great, and work fine for 3/4oz too! Oh, yeah, in the aaHS 12 gauge hulls

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 Post subject: Re: re: Wad problem in new AA hulls
PostPosted: Sun Jan 06, 2008 12:36 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2007 3:42 am
Posts: 268
Location: Edmonton, Alberta
Down Range Manufacturing wrote:

Oh, don't forget there are 3 different base cups for the HS hull.


1. How are these three different base cups distributed through the 12 gauge HS product line?

2. I have seen AAHS red cups and silver/white cups, are they different?

3. Are the AAHS cups different from the 'Super Target' and other 'Universal' cups?

Thank-you.

:)


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