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 Post subject: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:45 am 
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I've heard some Benelli shotguns are chromed lined, what is the purpose, benfefits, and problems with chrome lined barrels?




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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:16 am 
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[quote="870 Magnum"]I've heard some Benelli shotguns are chromed lined, what is the purpose, benfefits, and problems with chrome lined barrels?[/quote]
Many, many companies use chrome lined barrels these days, the biggest reason I suspect is for wear against steel shot.
Even when enclosed in a shot cup the stuff us terrible on old barrels.
About the only disadvantage I can think of for chrome lined barrels is re-choking - apparently the lining will wash out because the the scrubbing action is the shot column where the reamer cuts through the lining.
Davide

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:38 am 
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Chrome Lining has no protection against steel shot, It protects against corrosion and makes cleaning easier.

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 8:58 am 
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[quote="grousehunter49"]Chrome Lining has no protection against steel shot, It protects against corrosion and makes cleaning easier.[/quote]
This is contrary to what I have b read about chrome lined barrels, but yes it does also protect against corrosion.
Davide

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 1:31 pm 
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Grousehunter is right, steel shot has nothing to do with it. Chromed bores are for corrosion prevention and ease of cleaning. It does no harm to get the forcing cone or choke area modified in a chromed bore, it cuts through the chrome but does not lead to peeling of the remaining chrome.

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 6:57 pm 
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Chrome line bores came out well before steel shot. Winchester had them on the 101's in the 60's. I think the reason was to compete with the Browning Superposed that had a chamber rusting problem with plastic shells. Winchester went them one better by making their barrels much more corrosion resistant. It is my understanding that, at least at that time, the chrome was a hard chrome that penetrated the steel and did not result in a seperate layer of chrome on the surface. They also did, and still do, use it on rifle barrels, so there is not much build. The new, imported, cheap shotguns with chrome may or may not be the same thing.


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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Thu Apr 15, 2010 7:47 pm 
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Beretta had chrome barrels in the 50s as an option. IMO, it still aids in prevention of bore scratch in case of a faulty steel wad. Chrome is harder than steel.

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2010 12:43 am 
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Chrome barrels simply reduce manufacturing cost in mass produced mid-price point shotguns. Internal polishing of steel barrels is more expensive. Chrome barrels do offer "side benefits" regarding cleaning ease and rust protection.

Consider chrome barrels as a similar to the ill-fated X-tra Wood Beretta experiment. It was a manufacturing cost-saving device with side benefits: water resistance.

Sometimes when things are cheapened, there are some unintended side benefits which the marketing departments spin to sell the product.


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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2010 4:40 am 
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The most straightforward discussion of the matter is in the Febrary, 1956 American Rifleman.

Hard chrome lining of barrels reduces wear and corrosion. It is not a cost-saving process at all, nor was it ever. Though not particularly expensive in mass-production, it is not EPA friendly and is avoided for that reason in some cases.

Many upscale shotguns have chrome-lined barrels. It has been standard practice with Beretta, Benelli, and most quality Italian O/U manufacturers including Caesar Guerini. Hard-chrome lining is considered desireable in general, and is spec'ed in by the U.S. Military, etc., etc., for many applications. Browning sometimes plates the chambers, but not the barrels: "All current Citori, Cynergy, Maxus and Silver shotguns as well as the BAR centerfire rifle have chrome-lined chambers." A BPS does not have a chrome-lined chamber or barrel.

Chrome-lined barrels are a benefit, with no negatives to the shotgunner. They last longer in rifles, due to less throat erosion-- not normally a significant factor in shotgun barrels. Hard chrome lining offers a very low coefficient of friction, picks up less jacket material in rifling, meaning it does not foul as quickly and it is also easier to clean.

Due to toxicity and EPA mandates to eliminate chromium, low-temperature chemical vapor deposition applied rhenium coatings are among the replacements that are being considered as more "earth-friendly."

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2010 5:41 am 
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Randy nailed it.

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2010 1:50 pm 
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Nice post, Randy. Interesting to note, the Military picked up on it early, and the large-bored military "rifles" (the guns on many navy ships, and artillery) were equipped with chrome plated barrels. I saw an installation for plating battleship guns at a Naval Gunfire Factory in the mid-50s.

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2010 2:14 pm 
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Most P guns don't have chrome lined bores. They do have chrome lined chambers. FYI


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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Fri Apr 16, 2010 6:15 pm 
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Do remington chrome line the chamber and or barrel on the shotguns they produce?


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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2010 12:47 am 
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Not that I'm aware of.

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2010 3:40 am 
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Beg to disagree, Randy.......Purdey....Holland and Holland....Boss......no chrome lining in those barrels.......Perazzi.......Krieghoff.......

Although some ultra expensive SOs can be special ordered with chrome lined barrels most of the exquisite guns do not have chrome lined barrels....

Chrome lined barrels were a selling point for low to mid price point guns as a money saving (no polishing) vehicle.....

Again, I agree to disagree........Higher end guns have POLISHED BARRELS ....do a survey of the top shotguns in the world and you will see what I mean.......


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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2010 5:23 am 
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Bangalore wrote:
Chrome lined barrels were a selling point for low to mid price point guns as a money saving (no polishing) vehicle.....

Again, I agree to disagree........Higher end guns have POLISHED BARRELS ....
I used to believe that old story, and in fact I have been guilty of quoting it myself. However, I now have enough experience with chrome plating to realize it is not true. The chrome layer is so thin it does not cover up any imperfections. If you want the chrome bore to be smooth, you have to polish it to perfect smoothness before chroming.

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Sat Apr 17, 2010 7:51 am 
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Forget the "no polishing" remarks on chrome plated barrels - to do a good job plating, good metal preparation (polishing, etc.) beforehand is required. Otherwise the plating will enhance any defects/surface roughness that are there (and look like junk!)

I know - 50+ years of metal finishing, plating, vacuum metallizing, diffusion processes, etc.

BobK

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 12:50 am 
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Again....do the best of the very best shotguns have chrome lined barrels?

We are talking about the$10,000 to $250,000 price range.....Do they?

Armi Perugini-Visini; Boss; Bosis; Fabbri; Perazzi; Purdey; Piotti; etc.

I think not. Most have polished steel barrels.

As mentioned, chrome lined barrels are more rust resistant and some say, easier to clean. But, would you really order your Purdey with chrome lined barrels?

Bobk,

There is polishing and then, there is POLISHING............let me define terms: mid-price point barrel "half-assed polishing" before plating is not the same as "POLISHING" of say, a Purdey.........


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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 7:03 am 
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Bangalore wrote:
Again....do the best of the very best shotguns have chrome lined barrels?

We are talking about the$10,000 to $250,000 price range.....Do they?

Armi Perugini-Visini; Boss; Bosis; Fabbri; Perazzi; Purdey; Piotti; etc.


I think it's more of a Ferrari vs. Stock-car debate.

Anyone that is going to buy the guns above (except maybe Perazzi) is not likely to run down to the trap range and put 10,000 rounds through the gun. You are buying "tradition or traditional design" along with the quality and name, and an "investment that can also be played with".
I can guarantee that anyone that owns a Boss, Fabbri or Purdey has something else "chrome-lined" sitting next to in in the gun safe, that they shoot the heck out of down at the clays range.

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 Post subject: Re: chrome lined barrels?
PostPosted: Sun Apr 18, 2010 9:04 am 
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Beretta competition shotguns, Merkels, Arriettas, the finest Battista Rizzini and Caesar Guerini competition shotguns all have used hard-chromed lined barrels. It isn't because they don't know how to ream a chamber or hone a bore, it is because hard chrome is easier to clean, resists corrosion and erosion, and lasts longer. As for the guns that cost as much as new cars or as much as some houses, it is the handwork that costs the money, not just honing a shotgun bore. The stock blanks alone cost more than most shotguns, and when you get into hand-checkering, extensive hand engraving and gold inlays, that's where you'll find a lot of the money. They are luxury pieces, not coming in their $3000 reptilian motor cases to the goose pit near you anytime soon.

A standard Westley Richards sidelock runs 29,500 pounds. Want a single selective trigger? Add another 3,250 pounds. Don't care for the standard 2250 pound "motor case"? No worries, just get the oak and leather case for 3,750 pounds. In US dollars, that gun case is $5,786.82.

The cleaning kit for your Westley Richards shotgun is 695 pounds ... over a thousand dollars. Are you starting to get the picture? All of this has nothing at all to do with hard chrome features and benefits.

The basic process for hard chroming a barrel is this, courtesy DoD:

Image

It is nothing most folks are going to do in their basements and with all the EPA heat on eliminating the process, it isn't going to be a common thing for domestic manufacturers to use. The military wants to get away from it, but hasn't found anything better yet that is cost-effective.

Hard chrome plating has absolutely nothing to do with the machining of the original barrel or the precision and care with which it is done. It is mandatory that the barrel is made properly for hard-chrome plating to be applied properly. It is as far away from a quick "cover-up" coating as can be imagined.



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