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 Post subject: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 2:38 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 10:33 pm
Posts: 30
I was just looking through the 2010 Fiocchi catalogue and noticed that they will offer a 3 inch 28 gauge load with 7/8 ounce of 9.5 g/cc tungsten shot in 4-5-6 shot sizes.

Has anyone seen any of these shells and who will be manufacturing 28 gauge guns with 3 inch chambers?

Maybe they will introduce a 3 inch 16 gauge too!




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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Mon Jun 14, 2010 3:59 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:34 pm
Posts: 2222
Location: Nova Scotia,Canada
I have seen some 28 gauge shotguns chambered for 28 gauge 3 inch shells but this is the first I have heard of a 28 gauge 3 inch shell.The longest 28 gauge shells that I have seen have been 2 7/8 inch.

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 8:15 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 4:51 pm
Posts: 6854
Location: E. Rochester NY
Who wants or needs it? A 3" 28? That's like a 3" 16 gauge - WHAT FOR??

As it stands now, you can get 3/4, 7/8 oz. and 1 ounce loads for a 28. That's fine for these lightweight little guns, and in my 28s, they work well. There's also Bismuth and Nice Shot for nontoxic hunting loads.

It seems to me that this is "an answer to a question that was never asked"!

BobK

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 9:50 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:34 pm
Posts: 2222
Location: Nova Scotia,Canada
With the increase in use of non toxic shot I wonder if the 3 inch 28 gauge shell would allow for more pay load in using the bigger shot sizes that many times you have to use when using many of the lighter non toxic shot.Steel is a non toxic shot that comes to mind.

The longer case could allow hand loaders much more room to try larger non toxic loads in the 28 gauge as well.

Just some food for thought.

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 12:51 pm 
Diamond Grade
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Joined: Sun Oct 26, 2003 2:10 am
Posts: 1094
Sometimes I almost feel GLAD that I'm so near to the LAST SUNSET!
What's next... a 4" .410? 3.5 " 20?
The silliness knows no limits, I 'spose.
///olde :lol: pharte///

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 1:27 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 4:06 am
Posts: 85
Location: Ottawa, Ontario
A 3" 28 would make getting enough BIG steel pellets into a hull a lot easier. Now all we need are some steel wads for the 28 and we'd be all set for waterfowling.


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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 2:27 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sat Mar 27, 2010 10:33 pm
Posts: 30
Why use a 300 Win mag when there is the 30-06?

I think a 3 inch 28 gauge is kind of interesting. More and more private and public areas are specifying non-tox shot and a 3 inch 28 gauge may increase your options (especially with steel) with the 28 gauge a bit and who knows it may even pattern better. As it stands there appears to be only the 7/8 ounce load of tungsten shot which doesn't seem to offer more than some of the current non-tox loads in 2 3/4. Just another option to explore. It will be interesting to see if it goes anywhere.


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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:22 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:34 pm
Posts: 2222
Location: Nova Scotia,Canada
Windknot wrote:
A 3" 28 would make getting enough BIG steel pellets into a hull a lot easier. Now all we need are some steel wads for the 28 and we'd be all set for waterfowling.


In Canada and the United States non toxic shot has to be used for waterfowl.Not too long ago I purchased some factory Winchester 28 gauge steel loads.Have not had a chance to use them as of yet on waterfowl.Have only used lead in the old days on waterfowl and Bismuth nowadays in my 28 gauges when waterfowl hunting.

As A5ALIVE stated more and more places are going non toxic.In time lead could be gone altogether.A longer shell could help keep the 28 gauge in use with non toxic.I believe this is one reason that the 3 1/2 inch 12 gauge is now in general use.

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:34 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Thu Dec 04, 2008 1:58 pm
Posts: 92
I might be totally off base here but I was under the impression that one of the reasons that the 28 shoots so well is the 3/4 oz. load and the geometry of that shot size shot column in the almost .5 " bore, Some people call it the square load.


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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Jun 15, 2010 4:39 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2009 1:29 pm
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Location: Eastern Montana
Michael McIntosh states in his book "Shotguns & Shooting III";

"Fact is, the 28 and the .410 aren't even in the same phylum, much less the same family or genus. The .410's bore is simply too narrow to fire any decent amount of shot in anything but a strung-out swarm with enough gaps to throw a sackful of poodles through.

But take a bore that measures .550-inch, feed it a perfectly balanced shot charge, and magic begins to happen. Ammunition makers once thought a 5/8-ounce charge was optimal in a 28-gauge, but in the 1930s they discovered that a 3/4 ounce charge strikes an ideal proportion between the height of the shot column and the diameter of the bore. You'll sometimes hear this described as a "square" load, although it's a bit misleading; a 3/4 ounce charge in a 28-gauge case is slightly longer than it's diameter--but not so much longer as to be intrinsically inefficient.

This means the 28-bore produces a very short shot string, scarcely more than three feet, as opposed to the .410's typical seven- to 12-foot string. Or to put it another way, a 3/4-ounce charge doesn't contain alot of pellets--only about 300 No. 8s, for instance--but they all reach the target at pretty much the same time. With high-quality cartridges carrying extra hard shot in a good shotcup wad, it is one of the most ballistically efficient shotshells ever devised. If you want to see a bird die like it's been struck by lightning, center it with a 28-bore at any distance out to 35 yards or a bit beyond.

Inevitably, the 28 got it's share of abuse from the more-is-better fallacy, just like all other gauges. Years ago, Federal produced a 7/8 ounce load that ultimately proved to be not one wit better than the 3/4 ounce charge. Elmer Keith's grudging compliment toward the 28 was, not surprisingly, predicated on the one-ounce loads that both Federal and Winchester made for awhile in the late 60s. Winchester re-introduced this bit of nonsense a few years ago as it's so called Magnum one-ounce 28-gauge. I saw no sense in it at the time and see even less sense in it now that I've shot a couple cases of them. Overload a 28-bore and the same thing happens as when you overload any gauge--more recoil, more shot stringing, less efficiency. Anything beyond a 3/4-ounce charge is, in a word, worthless". [p. 48]

I think that one of McIntosh's points in all this was that a 3/4-ounce load in a 28-gauge is an ideal charge that produces efficient, dense, deadly shot strings. Americans tend to suffer from the "more power" syndrome, and often take a good thing and ruin it by trying to "improve" it or make it something it's not intended to be. If you need to shoot #4s, 5 or 6 shot you probably need another tool for that job. a 28-gauge is simply not the right hammer for that nail.


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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Thu Jun 17, 2010 9:15 am 
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Posts: 1094
:D " I'll buy THAT for a DOLLAR!", the man said.
(From a moderately comical movie.)

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Thu Jun 24, 2010 8:34 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 2:20 pm
Posts: 4479
Location: Pointe Coupee Parish, South La.
I was given two boxes of Fio 2 3/4" 1oz loads to try by a friend for my quail hunting. The only thing I managed with one box was more recoil! Gave the other box to my nephew (hunting partner). He used the box and went back as I did to 3/4oz. loads. "If it ain't broke-Don't fix it!".


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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:38 pm 
Limited Edition

Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 3:33 pm
Posts: 387
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
Today I was cleaning up downstairs and found a box of 28 b loads in an old Winchester box. I'm not sure where they came from (translate that into I just don't remember) and when I looked at them they appeared to be long. I dug out a box of new Winchester AA's and some Fiochhi field loads in the 28 b and the ones I have are longer.
I had never heard of a 3" 28 b until I did a search here on the most informative board I have ever had the privledge to be a member. :D
I have some old Winchester paper shells, some dark red plastic Federals and an unidentified purple shell that are all 3".
You learn something everyday!!! :!:
Has anyone seen a gun chambered for a 3" shell? :?:

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 3:49 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:34 pm
Posts: 2222
Location: Nova Scotia,Canada
Airmedic1 wrote:
Today I was cleaning up downstairs and found a box of 28 b loads in an old Winchester box. I'm not sure where they came from (translate that into I just don't remember) and when I looked at them they appeared to be long. I dug out a box of new Winchester AA's and some Fiochhi field loads in the 28 b and the ones I have are longer.
I had never heard of a 3" 28 b until I did a search here on the most informative board I have ever had the privledge to be a member. :D
I have some old Winchester paper shells, some dark red plastic Federals and an unidentified purple shell that are all 3".
You learn something everyday!!! :!:
Has anyone seen a gun chambered for a 3" shell? :?:



Are you sure they are 3 inch 28 gauge shells?Fiocchi is suppose to be the first 28 gauge 3 inch manufactured.Those Old Winchester and Federal 28 gauge shells could be 2 7/8 inch shells which both manufactures made at one time.

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Mon Jan 31, 2011 4:01 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sat Feb 05, 2005 4:51 pm
Posts: 6854
Location: E. Rochester NY
Shooting Sportsman did an article on the history of the 28 several years ago. That was a good source of info on old shell variants. For some reason, I loaned it to someone, and never got it back.

Anyway, the 2 3/4" version works fine for my needs, so I'll just hang on to my 3 ol' 28 ga. guns.

BobK

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 7:55 am 
Field Grade

Joined: Thu Aug 23, 2007 11:23 am
Posts: 52
Location: NW IL
1gsplover wrote:
Sometimes I almost feel GLAD that I'm so near to the LAST SUNSET!
What's next... a 4" .410? 3.5 " 20?
The silliness knows no limits, I 'spose.
///olde :lol: pharte///



They have already done the 3 1/2" 20 ga. Although it is a slug load.

http://hastingsammo.accountsupport.com/ ... 2/id2.html

I do think it is a bit ridiculous, but if it floats yer boat...


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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 10:01 am 
Limited Edition

Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 3:33 pm
Posts: 387
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
28 gauge:

You were right, they are 2 7/8" or more precisely 2 15/16" by my calipers. Could you share a little history on the 2 7/8" loading? Did they chamber guns for that lenght or did they say it was acceptable to fire in a 2 3/4" chamber. I find this type of history fascinating!

Thanks

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 5:50 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Jul 16, 2006 2:34 pm
Posts: 2222
Location: Nova Scotia,Canada
Airmedic1 wrote:
28 gauge:

You were right, they are 2 7/8" or more precisely 2 15/16" by my calipers. Could you share a little history on the 2 7/8" loading? Did they chamber guns for that lenght or did they say it was acceptable to fire in a 2 3/4" chamber. I find this type of history fascinating!

Thanks


The 28 gauge 2 7/8 inch shells should be fired in 28 gauge shotguns having a 2 7/8 inch chamber or longer.Even though until now, no 28 gauge 3 inch shells were manufactured, for some reason there are some 3 inch chambered 28 gauge shotguns around.I saw one at a gun show last fall.Also one or two members of the 28 Gauge Society have 3 inch 28 gauge chambered shotguns.

The 28 gauge Winchester Model 12 and Model 37 shotguns had 2 7/8 inch chambers.Rumour has it the shell was designed for the Model 12 but I believe they were around before the 28 gauge Model 12 was introduced.


At one time the standard 28 gauge load was the 2 1/2 inch shell.I believe the 2 7/8 inch shell came next using 3/4 and 1 ouce loads.Later, as I understand it, when the 28 gauge was used in skeet, a 2 3/4 inch shell was the longest shell allowed.Since the shells were loaded the same, the 2 7/8 inch shell lost out to the 2 3/4 inch shell.

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 7:23 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 10:50 am
Posts: 275
Location: VIRGINIA
I used to own a B Rizzini Aurum Classic 28 that had a 3 inch chamber. Wouldnt mind having it back to pattern a few of these 3 inch shells.

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 Post subject: Re: 3 inch 28 gauge
PostPosted: Tue Feb 01, 2011 7:44 pm 
Limited Edition

Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2006 3:33 pm
Posts: 387
Location: Lincoln, Nebraska
That would make sense, the box is marked M-37 even though the box is marked 2 3/4".

Thanks



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