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 Post subject: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Sat Oct 02, 2010 8:06 pm 
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I was bequested my Dads old Remington Model 11 that was made exactly 100 years ago in 1910. As most of you know it was made on the Browning patent and is esentially the same gun as the
Auto 5.

My problem is that the fiber buffer that cushons the rear of the bolt when it slams rearward has totaly disintigrated. Anybody know where I can get one?

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Sun Oct 03, 2010 5:53 am 
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Ezra,

If your gun was made in 1910, it is a Remington Auto Loading Shotgun and not a M11. The M11 came out in 1911. Both were built on J.M. Browning's patents, as was the FN A5 that came out in 1903. The RAS and the M111 are slightly different guns and the A5 is very different with almost no parts that are interchangable with the Remington versions. The A5 has no "recoil buffer".

The good news is that Numrich carries the "buffers" for both the 20ga and 16/12ga Remington guns (their # 54690-01 for the 12/16ga & # 54690-02 for the 20ga). They also carry the proper rivet (# 54520) for the correct instalation of the "buffer". The rivet must be drilled out for proper replacement. I would highly recommend that you have a qualified gunsmith do this work.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 9:12 am 
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:D Not to steal thread,but...
this was an eyeopener to me, and tells me to cease search for Rem :roll: 11, stick with A5's.
Thank you!
///olde :shock: pharte///

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:45 am 
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I did not mean to imply that M11s were not good shotguns. They were just not made to the exacting tolerances that the FN guns of that time were. Higher grade M11s are a real thing of beauty. Field grade M11s are very tough and serviceable guns and can be purchased for much less than a similar Browning/FN A5. Sometimes, at about 1/2 the price and this makes them a great value. Also, the 20ga M11 came out long before the 20ga A5. IMHO great value and utility can be had with a ribbed 20ga M11 and these guns are often way under priced. We just bought an 80% VR, 20ga, 26", skeet M11 for $150 and it is well worth that price.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 10:54 pm 
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Ezra et al,

Poppertsgunparts.com has replacement buffers as well. I just snagged a 12ga Sportsman with a Cutts installed for a silly price. Dug around and found 3 more tubes for the old girl, and she breaks birds like crazy. I'm astonished as to how well the Cutts system works, haven't patterned her, but after leading the field last 2 outings at the clays course, I'm not complaining about the bulbous look. All for about $200.

Not quite the standard of build as the A5's, but well worth the money and they work well. If you don't mind cosmetically challenged, they go cheap. My recently acquired Auto 5 book says John Browning didn't think doing the smaller gauge was worth it, so their 20 is on the 16ga receiver, and there's no real advantage weight wise. Remington got it right IMO and did scale it down from the 16ga, and it's a nice light gun, beats my Sweet 16 by a couple of ozs with a longer barrel.The 20ga I've got I'm restocking, and I'll send the barrel off to Mike Orlen for choke threading. And if I do the Browning Light trick of taking some meat out of the buttstock, will go even lighter.

If you want a shooter, I highly recommend them, and as A5Guy points out, they're ez half the price.

Cheers,
R*2


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 12:55 pm 
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The Browning 20ga Light Weight came out in 1958 after J.M Browning was out of the picture. The 20ga Magnum came out in 1967. Both are made on 20ga receivers that are smaller than the 12ga & 16ga receivers.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 1:32 pm 
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A5Guy,

I stand corrected, don't own a Browning A5 20ga, though I did manage to get my hands on a 20ga barrel and plugged it in to a standard weight 2 3/4" 16ga receiver, took some fiddling with the carrier et al, but she works just fine. I assumed that with the barrel extension the same size, the frame would be as well.

Cheers,
R*2


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:01 pm 
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If you're looking for a nice light 20 in the Model 11, keep your eyes open for one of the "sportsman" models:
The "sportsman" was a version that was permanently plugged/limited to a total of three shells and was offered in all gauges, but the 20 was the trimmest and lightest, naturally.
These guns have a different style forend: lighter, slimmer, and are curved at the end-they don't have a magazine cap, just a knurled nut.
The vent rib models were really attractive, the rib was low, and the slots were so low I don't think you could pass a dime through the rib slots.
The best quail shot I ever saw shot one of these sportsman 20's all the years I hunted with him. Can't remember for sure, but I think that gun was bored either cylinder or skeet-must have been cylinder, the 1932 Stoeger Arms reproduction catalog that I have shows borings in cylinder, moldified, & full chokes. Stoeger offered the "sportsman" for $53.40 in the standard or field grade, vent rib was $14.30 extra-it was also made in the higher grades that A5 guy wrote about: B, C, D, E, & F. The standard grade even had some rather decent engraving on the receiver-not sure how it was done, probably roll stamped or something-it was too deep for etching. Even with the engraving, the sportsman sold for the same price as the standard Model 11. Only engraving or stamping I remember on the standard Model 11 receivers was the Remington logo, copyright symbol, and the model no. designation.


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 10:18 pm 
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I have a Remington Autoloading Shotgun made in 1910. In 1911 they renamed it the Model 11 but didn't really change anything but the name. It may not be an A5 (which I also have) but in my opinion is of comparable quality. Mine is still going strong after 100 years of shooting. I took her to a skeet party this year to celebrate her 100th birthday but she kept breaking all the plates.


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 12:26 am 
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I am a bit unclear about your conversion of a 16ga to 20ga. Was it a deal with both Remington receivers or a cross between a FN and a Remington receiver? I'd like to see the pictures. The magazine rings would have to be changed and very difficult extractor modifications made. I am not saying that you did not make the conversion. It is just that I have never heard of any master gunsmith that has tried it with any success.

Iy would be a very unique gun, indeed.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 2:28 am 
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A5Guy,

Not a cross brand conversion, Japanese Browning 2 3/4" 20ga Inv barrel into a Belgian Browning 16ga 2 3/4" Standard receiver(R99,4xx, so end of 1957). Sorry if I wasn't clear. The extractors on the bolt needed modifying to grab the smaller rim. And I tried to get a 20ga two piece lifter to work, but ended up with the 16ga lifter original working the action.

The barrel/receiver setup is quite different between the two, as you rightly point out. And impossible with the Rem without changing barrel extensions between gauges. With the price of an A5 in a Light Twenty usually approaching the grand mark, I sprung $150 for the barrel and with a $250 beater 16ga sitting in the closet with a bum barrel, it was worth a try.

I'll get some pics up, but I'm off for a week tomorrow morning.

Cheers,
R*2


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 11:43 am 
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tarheel wrote:
If you're looking for a nice light 20 in the Model 11, keep your eyes open for one of the "sportsman" models:
The "sportsman" was a version that was permanently plugged/limited to a total of three shells and was offered in all gauges, but the 20 was the trimmest and lightest, naturally.
These guns have a different style forend: lighter, slimmer, and are curved at the end-they don't have a magazine cap, just a knurled nut.
The vent rib models were really attractive, the rib was low, and the slots were so low I don't think you could pass a dime through the rib slots.
The best quail shot I ever saw shot one of these sportsman 20's all the years I hunted with him. Can't remember for sure, but I think that gun was bored either cylinder or skeet-must have been cylinder, the 1932 Stoeger Arms reproduction catalog that I have shows borings in cylinder, moldified, & full chokes. Stoeger offered the "sportsman" for $53.40 in the standard or field grade, vent rib was $14.30 extra-it was also made in the higher grades that A5 guy wrote about: B, C, D, E, & F. The standard grade even had some rather decent engraving on the receiver-not sure how it was done, probably roll stamped or something-it was too deep for etching. Even with the engraving, the sportsman sold for the same price as the standard Model 11. Only engraving or stamping I remember on the standard Model 11 receivers was the Remington logo, copyright symbol, and the model no. designation.



Complete agreement here.

I have a 20ga M11 Sportsman with a plain, IC barrel. It handles and shoots perfectly and is all that you have described above. I find the absence of a rib meaningless in the pointability of the gun. It is a 1948 gun, last of the production per the RAC website. As such, it is 98% overall condition. I just love it.

JHJ


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Model 11
PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 8:51 pm 
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A5Guy et al,
Here's some pics of the "plug the 20ga into a 16ga" experiment. Works well, though the speed load is a touch finicky. The extractors had to be modified and the cartridge and magazine stops had to be adjusted to suit the thinner shell. The ring setting is light, I'll get a 20ga recoil spring, I suspect they're a little weaker. Function is not quite a 100%, I had a hangup last 50 rounds at the clays course, a little more polishing on the internals I suspect.
It was an interesting exercise, and no regrets about doing it, I learned a lot about the internals of the Auto 5. Still managed to crack 40 but, {:o).
When economics permit I will get a Light 20, but as mentioned above, I had the rather tired 16ga standard and stumbled across the barrel at the right price. I did find a 20ga forearm, so that's the right fit on the barrel.
Cheers,
R*2

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