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 Post subject: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 11:10 pm 
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I just bought (on this website) a 16 Gauge Gran Lightning. SO now I'm looking for another Grabber to start reloading. Since I'm starting from scratch in this gauge what hulls would be the best? I use AAs for the 28, 20 and 12 gauages but obviously that's not an option.

Thanks

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2011 11:31 pm 
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As you have probably already found out, there are not as many choices in 16 as there are in other gauges but now there are a lot more than when I first started in the 16 gauge world.

Because Remington the most common brand where I live that is what I reload pretty much exclusively.

Fiocchi and Federal are also very popular with many 16 shooters, although my experience with them is zero. This is only because those brands are not common in Southern California unless you do some detective work.

Downrange makes an excellent wad, DR16, for 7/8 oz. loads. The DR16 is almost exclusively my go to wad. Remington makes wads, SP16, for 1 1/8 oz. loads. Ballistic products also sells several 16 ga wads but I'm not familiar with them.

The MEC Sizemaster is an excellent reloader if you can find one.

For good reloading data go to 16ga.com and join the Low Pressure Group. This will give you access to several spreadsheets full of reloading recipes.

Have fun with your new gun.


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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 7:32 am 
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Art,

Thanks very much for the information. I've started hawking the 16ga site. From what I've read so far, Remington hulls require a different primer than the WW 209 I'm using for everything else. I'm going to try and find hulls that accept the 209s since I've stockpiled so many. Much obliged for the information.

Robin

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:09 am 
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Robin...the current Remington hulls will take your W209 primers just fine. Safe and a good fit. I believe the odd size primers you may be referring to are the old "Rem. 57" primers which you see mentioned in old data or discussions from time to time. They have not been made for many years nor have the Rem. hulls they were matched to.

As long as you are loading currently produced Remington hulls from at least the past decade (that's a conservative estimate...it's actually longer I'm sure) you will be fine. Current Rem 16 ga. hulls are all the same internally whether they are green Express hulls or the black Remington Game Loads (identified as "RGL" in some data sources). Current hulls will have a plastic base wad which is easily seen if you look inside the hull. I do not load any Rem. hulls with a paper or fiber base wad in part because I don't know which primer they are matched to. I suspect any with paper/fiber may be the old discontinued #57 hulls.

Welcome to the 16 ga. reloading experience! It can be a bit frustrating at first but worth it to enjoy hunting and clays with your own crafted light target loads and game getters. True framed 16 ga. guns are great and they really do "carry like a 20 and hit like a 12"!

Be forwarned, you will find no 16 ga. hull currently available that will last as long or load as conveniently as the other guages you are used to, but they are still useful and the end result is enjoyable.


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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:21 am 
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The best hull the 16 Gauge has right now is the Cheddite, which is also the exact hull that Winchester now uses for its current 16 Gauge ammunition.

Next in line is the Fiocchi, followed by Federal and a distant last place goes to the Remington, because the mouth of the Remington hulls get brittle very fast.

Personally I load the Cheddites and the Federals. There is loading data for all the current 16 Gauge hulls on the Hodgdon website.

I would look at the data first before you buy components.

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:45 am 
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The Federal, as well as Cheddite have larger capacity that can result in lower pressure and/or larger payloads.

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 10:12 am 
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If you get really lucky and can find some of the old CF WW hulls they are far and away the best. WW didn't make any AA CF hulls per se, but the older (during that time frame) WW field loads had a CF AA style hull. Next in line would be the Activ hull. Again one has to be lucky to run across any, but..... Keep an eye out.

I've not loaded any of the Cheddite 16 ga hulls but have many 12, 20, 28, and .410s. I assume the 16 ga would be similar. If so, they probabaly are the next best or current best 16 ga hulls available. I know not whether the current AA 16 ga hulls really are Cheddites or not. I assume dogchaser knows what he is talking about.

I've loaded mostly the Federal 16 ga hull, and it is no different than any other paper base wad Federal hull. I think that hull is better than most people give it credit for. I think it ought to go for 5 or 6 loads. I get that many or more out of my Federal 28 ga hulls. I'm not particularly fond of the Fiocchi hull in general, but it may be another available choice. UEE hulls, which many times are confused with Cheddites are very similar and could be just as good. I suspect the B&P 16 ga hulls just may be Cheddites too, so don't just leave them laying on the ground.

16 ga hulls just aren't available in the quality we have become used to in the other gauges. Myself, I load Federals since that's what I have most of. So far I've only loaded any I think 3 times and I get good enough crimps to run through my Model 12 with no difficulty.

I have some of the Rermington wads as well as the Gualandi that had been available through Graf's. It is a 7/8 ox wad I think. Depending on which hull and powder one wad or other will fit well enough for my purposes. Crimps may be a bit dished at times, but not too bad. Granted, I do take a few liberties regarding wad and hull combinations, but considering availability of components, I've no choice. I base my decisions on extensive experience of performance of similar components in other gauges over many years. I've not seen or used any of the DR 16 ga wads, I suppose I really should get a bag and give them a go, but I don't shoot that much 16 ga. It might not be worth my while, but then again, so what? I've done, still do and still have lots of things left over that aren't/weren't worth my time.

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 3:30 pm 
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dogchaser37 wrote:
The best hull the 16 Gauge has right now is the Cheddite, which is also the exact hull that Winchester now uses for its current 16 Gauge ammunition.

Next in line is the Fiocchi, followed by Federal and a distant last place goes to the Remington, because the mouth of the Remington hulls get brittle very fast.

Personally I load the Cheddites and the Federals. There is loading data for all the current 16 Gauge hulls on the Hodgdon website.

I would look at the data first before you buy components.


+1

I load only the Cheddites because I have a sufficient supply of them.

Most reloaders that I've spoken with don't like the Remington for the same reason Mark mentioned above, the mouth gets brittle very quickly. The Remington does use a 209 primer.


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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Nov 11, 2011 5:30 pm 
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dogchaser37 wrote:
The best hull the 16 Gauge has right now is the Cheddite, which is also the exact hull that Winchester now uses for its current 16 Gauge ammunition.

Next in line is the Fiocchi, followed by Federal and a distant last place goes to the Remington, because the mouth of the Remington hulls get brittle very fast.

Personally I load the Cheddites and the Federals. There is loading data for all the current 16 Gauge hulls on the Hodgdon website.

I would look at the data first before you buy components.


I have a tendency to disagree with Mark about a number of things, but he has (mostly) given you great info here. I also rate the Cheddite hull as the best available in 16 ga., followed by the Federal/Estate hulls.

I had a really serious problem with the last batch of Fiocchi's I tried to reload. The hulls seperated from the brass bases in about 1/2 the hulls on the first firing, so I no longer recommend them.

I find I'm lucky to 1 or 2 reloads out of the Rem hulls and I no longer bother with them at all.

A friend has given me some once fired Ely 16 ga. hulls, but I have not tried to reload them yet, so I don't know how they will perform.

Good luck.

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:15 am 
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I'm assuming that you are a target shooter and the following may not apply.
Poor quality and selection of loaded ammo and hulls for 16 Ga. is the reason that I went to all brass hulls. I don't shoot more than 2 boxes of target loads at any one time and never more than 4 times a year. I shoot targets to stay in practice for birds. I takes me about 30 seconds to reload a hull and the patterns from my Parker and AyA are the best that I have ever achieved.

barrowsr wrote:
I just bought (on this website) a 16 Gauge Gran Lightning. SO now I'm looking for another Grabber to start reloading. Since I'm starting from scratch in this gauge what hulls would be the best? I use AAs for the 28, 20 and 12 gauages but obviously that's not an option.

Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Sat Nov 12, 2011 10:57 am 
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Brass hulls - now that is classy!!! My plans are to shoot the gun at Skeet and clays to keep my hand in for birds. No competition clay games anymore - it's all about the dog now. I've always thought the 16 to be a good gauge and this was an opportunity. Given the limited slection of factory loads reloading for me is almost mandatory.

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 3:40 pm 
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if i'm target shooting alot it is with the 28ga or 410. Upland hunting 16ga and brass hulls.


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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Sun Nov 13, 2011 3:50 pm 
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Best hulls are the old Activs. Oh, you were asking about currently available? Sorry, none of them.

Dan


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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 5:50 pm 
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bprater wrote -

"A friend has given me some once fired Ely 16 ga. hulls, but I have not tried to reload them yet, so I don't know how they will perform."


Eley hulls vary considerably depending on age and type. Reloadability is pretty much the bottom of Eley's list of priorities.

I use them almost exclusively for 16ga reloading, because they're all I can get on this side of the pond.

You'll be lucky to get more than 2 loads out of them before the necks split, and be slow and careful on crimp starting and closing. Choose data as if loading Cheddites.

Be careful with CCI, Remington primers, whiich may be a tad small for the primer pocket. European primers fit just fine.


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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Mon Nov 14, 2011 9:48 pm 
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lemming -

I appreciate the comments. As I only have 25 of them, I simply put 'em on a shelf and not bother.

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Tue Nov 15, 2011 12:48 am 
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Hey barrowsr,

For the past 20+ years I have been using Remington Game Loads for 16 gauge for a number of reasons, most of which have already been noted by others. In the central Pennsylvania area, they are the most readily available loads, and they are usually able to be found at relatively inexpensive prices. And yes, they do use standard primers. Wad choice has always been rather limited for me; it was either Remington or Winchester wads.

I usually load my Remington 16 gauge hulls on my Hornady 366 progressive loader. When loading special loads such as buck shot in smaller quantities, I load them on my MEC Sizemaster single stage press. I agree that hull mouths on Remington Game Loads get brittle and ratty more quickly than hull mouths on Remington STS hulls. That does not mean that Game Load hulls are not reloadable, however. I find I can easily reload a 16 Gauge Remington Game Load hull five times, and that is with my Hornady 366 progressive press which is a lot more picky when it comes to hull mouth condition. If I wanted to get more loads out of the Game Load hulls, I could reload them on the Sizemaster single stage press and get several more loads out of each hull. Since I prefer to get more production from my progressive press, I simply accept that my expected hull life will be five reloads per hull, and I throw them away after that. I would expect you should get similar hull life results with a Grabber.

Would I rather buy 16 gauge shells in Remington STS hulls? Absolutely, but I have never seen 16 gauge in STS, so I find Game Loads to be a good choice for me.

I have been using both CCI and Winchester primers as far back as I can remember. I used Greendot powder for at least 10 years (probably more), and I think I switched to Clays powder perhaps 10 years ago.

I am not stating that Remington Game Loads are the best hulls for 16 gauge shells. I would, however, state that Game Load hulls will serve quite well if you do not have or find a better choice.

Best wishes,
Dave Wile


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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Wed Nov 16, 2011 3:47 pm 
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Since you are new to the 16, have you gone to www.16ga.com yet? They have wonderful reloading data and forum sites. Enjoy.

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2011 7:30 am 
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After reading about the possibility of the paper basewad lodging in the bore (it happened to one member) I will probably sell the estate/federal hulls and shop for either remington or winchester ammo that can be reloaded. Thanks

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2011 4:40 pm 
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Robin:
I have reloaded several thousand Estate hulls without problem. I have heard your concerns before, and now load only Rem. hulls in 12 ga. and various (non-paper) hulls in 16ga.

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 Post subject: Re: Best hulls for 16 gauge reloading
PostPosted: Fri Dec 16, 2011 5:14 pm 
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There seems to be some folks who don't trust the paper base wads and those that don't have a problem with them. I'm still trying to decide which camp I'll fall into. I certainly appreciate the information to be gained from others on this site.

Robin

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