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 Post subject: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 8:26 pm 
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Joined: Mon Oct 09, 2006 6:01 pm
Posts: 23
Location: N.E. Ohio
I just shot a box of Winchester AA Super-Handicap shells, They were excellent !!! Does anyone have a Recipe for a load like these??? I would love to try and duplicate it!!


Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 8:36 pm 
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Any 1 1/8oz 1250fps handicap load should reproduce that factory load sufficiently. The trap community gets really good performance with Green Dot at those speeds. Here's a tried & true recipe:

http://tinyurl.com/bsgdzm


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 8:37 pm 
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Check at the Hodgdon site for recipes that use WW Super Handicap powder. It is listed as the same powder as used in those shells that you like. Find the velocity that you want and make them up.

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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 2:31 pm 
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Shoot2reload wrote:
Any 1 1/8oz 1250fps handicap load should reproduce that factory load sufficiently. The trap community gets really good performance with Green Dot at those speeds. Here's a tried & true recipe:

http://tinyurl.com/bsgdzm


+1 on the Green Dot Powder load that the link refers to. I change shot size to fit what I'm doing. Currently plated 6's bottom bar. for pigeons over flushing dogs at 30-50 yd ranges.
excellent.
Handi Trap or Games 8's or 7.5's 27 yd or back fence
Doves 7.5
pheasants plated 5's
grouse woodcock 8,7's with spreader


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 5:56 pm 
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Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:09 pm
Posts: 2454
Location: Eastern Nebraska
If you want to make this load in the gray AA Super Handicap hull keep in mind that this is an AAHS hull which does not have a lot of internal volume. It will take about 21.5 grains of Green Dot. I have done a fair number of this load. I could not make it work with ClayBuster's standard AA clone (their CB1118.) It just won't fit. I also tried it with DownRange XL118. This was closer but still too big. With the Down Range clone of the AA it fits great. Wad pressure gauge just wiggles and nice tight flat crimps.

Much of the WW powder is pretty dense. I have not tired it (because the WW powder is too pricey) but I suspect its use would solve the fit issue.

I currently load 1 1/8 1250 FPS in Gray AAHS with 20.5 grains of American Select and the CB1114 wad. The shot cup on this wad fits 1 1/8 nicely and the overall wad is short enough that things fit very well. The 20.5 of Am Sel, 1 1/8 and W209 in WWAA is right out of Lymans. The only difference is the CB1114 instead of CB1118. I have confirmed with Claybuster that many of their customer make this substitution in AA hulls.

FYI: If you want the classic 1 1/8 with 18 of Red Dot or Promo (1200 FPS) in a modern AAHS the use of the CB1114 makes it fit a whole lot better.


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 9:55 pm 
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albatros,
Nice job, you da man, talk about excellent detail. Thanks DDF


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 10:23 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 9:07 pm
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Dead Dog Fritz wrote:
albatros,
Nice job, you da man, talk about excellent detail. Thanks DDF


Albatros, thanks for post.

For 1 1/8 oz. @ 1250fps. which powder? Green Dot or Am. Select?


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 10:51 pm 
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Joined: Fri Oct 22, 2004 1:10 am
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Location: Wichita,KS
Green Dot gets my vote

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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 8:06 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 30, 2009 3:57 pm
Posts: 12
Location: S.Central,NC
WHAT Curly SAID!

Tarheel2


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 8:34 am 
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tarheel2 wrote:
WHAT Curly SAID!

Tarheel2

Curly only said what he said because the OP used the word "Duplicate". If the OP only wants to have similar performance, Green Dot should be a more affordable choice. If he wants to get up into the 1300's then Unique or Herco are better choices with 9/8 shot loads.
ProReach is a great choice for boomer loads also.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/ ... 7&gauge=12

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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 11:42 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:09 pm
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Location: Eastern Nebraska
As usual, Curly is dead on. If you want to DUPLICATE the actual load you wold need to use Gray AAHS hulls, W209 primers, 1 1/8 WWAA wads, and WW Super Handicap Powder. Even with these components it is impossible to be sure. We all assume that WW uses WW Super Handicap Powder in this load but we really don't KNOW that. They MIGHT use some sort of special blend that they order. If they do use actual WW AA 1 1/8 wads then they certainly do use something SIMILAR to Super Handicap. Hodgdon lists 20.9 grains which on a single stage press would PROBABLY take around a MEC #23 or 24 bushing. Any time you use a bushing this small with a standard AA wad in an AAHS things fit great. It would probably load with zero wad pressure and crimp very nicely. At least in my experience, you can go up to a charge of powder that takes around a #27-28 bushing and still make it fit (with some wad pressure) with a standard AA 1 1/8 wad or CB1118. When you start using powder charges that take around a #30-31 things will fit into an AAHS a lot better if you use s shorter wad like a CB1114 or the Down Range AA Clone. When you get up around a #33 or 34 (like 21+ of Green Dot) the Down Range wad is about the only thing available that will allow it to all fit, unless you use so much wad pressure that you mash down the compression section.)

If you really do want to DUPLICATE the factory load you would have to pretty much stick with the WW components. If you start substituting it is not a DUPLICATE and there is a real good chance it would not even fit into the shell.

If you want to DUPLICATE the performance (and save some money) there are a lot of options. Powders like American Select and Green Dot and aftermarket clone wads are all good options and there are a lot of possibilities. If you want "snappier" than 1250 FPS then powders like Unique, Universal,Herco, Longshot, WSF, and Pro Reach all come into the picture.


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 11:55 am 
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When WW introduced the Super Handicap powder, they took special effort to say that it is the powder used in their Grey Handicap shells.
Per this:
October 2006

For Immediate Release

Ron Reiber, Ballistics Manager and Master Class Sporting Clays shooter, today announced a powerful new addition to the Winchester® Smokeless Propellants lineup. Super-Handicap®, -- this is the identical powder loaded in Winchester’s Super-Handicap 12 gauge shell and nick named, by experienced clay target shooters, the “silver bullet”. Load Super-Handicap powder for a lightning fast 1345 feet per second 1 ounce load or duplicate the factory loading of 1250 feet per second with an ounce and an eighth. Handicap shooters, race game shooters, or Annie Oakley shooters who want to duplicate the venerable Winchester Super Handicap shell can load it at home and come to the club armed for success. Super-Handicap powder will be available early this spring in 1-pound cans, 4-pound caddies and 8-pound kegs. Join the team that shoots Winchester powders and go long with Super-Handicap! For 288 additional loads visit wwpowder.com





SUPER HANDICAP 12 GAUGE LOADS



SHOT WT

POWDER

PRIMER

WAD

VELOCITY



1 OUNCE

22.0 gr.

WW209

WAA12SL

1345 FPS



1-1/8 OUNCE

20.9 gr.

WW209

WAA12

1250 FPS

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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2012 12:20 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Wed Feb 17, 2010 9:51 am
Posts: 1673
Who's da MAN ....................Curley, again..........DDF


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 11:55 am 
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Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 3:09 pm
Posts: 2454
Location: Eastern Nebraska
Curly-Nohair wrote:
When WW introduced the Super Handicap powder, they took special effort to say that it is the powder used in their Grey Handicap shells.
Per this:
October 2006

For Immediate Release



I stand corrected!
As always, Curly has the straight poop, straight from the manufacturer.
Why am I not surprised?
There is an old saying about what "assume" means and I have demonstrated it again.


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 Post subject: Re: AA Super- Handicap loads
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2012 1:13 pm 
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Location: Knoxville, Tn area Nyuck, Nyuck
albatros wrote:
Curly-Nohair wrote:
When WW introduced the Super Handicap powder, they took special effort to say that it is the powder used in their Grey Handicap shells.
Per this:
October 2006

For Immediate Release



I stand corrected!
As always, Curly has the straight poop, straight from the manufacturer.
Why am I not surprised?

Clearly you have missed a few of my blunders :lol:
Curly

There is an old saying about what "assume" means and I have demonstrated it again.

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