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 Post subject: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 4:12 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 01, 2005 3:29 am
Posts: 600
Location: CA
At the risk of asking a 'dumb question', here goes. We have all had to remove a live primer from a hull, from time to time, when reloading shotshells. The way I have always done it in the past is to use the primer removal press punch on my MEC Sizemaster reloader to accomplish this. The first time I did this I checked to see if the primer punch itself would actually pierce through the inner covering of the primer. It didn't so it seemed to be an 'ok' way of removing a live primer from a hull .. I figured this was the way it was done .. ? .. I have never had a live primer go off using this method.

But, after reading on another thread about removing a live primer by prying the primer up on it's flanged end, by hand, to remove it from the hull that set the question in mind. Is using the primer punch the wrong way to remove a live primer .. ? ..

John




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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 5:26 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2004 10:25 pm
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Location: Michigan/Florida
I have done it exacly as you described, using the loader depriming punch, for forty years and have yet to notice any sign of danger. I hope to continue doing it like that for the next forty. Enjoy.


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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 5:32 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 1:24 am
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Location: So Illinois
I guesd I did it wrong. The first, last and only time I tried that the primer went off.

Now I don't remove them. If I'm discarding the shell I spray some oil in to kill the primer before pitching

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 6:08 pm 
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I can't imagine how one would set a primer off by using a deprimer. I wonder how many I have removed in both shotgun and metalic rifle and pistol cartridges over the years??? :?

BP

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:29 pm 
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Press it out from inside the hull and don't look back, that isn't the business end :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 9:48 pm 
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I've done it a lot of times, but i do wear safety glasses when doing this particular procedure,
i know,i should wear safety glasses while reloading,period,but i don't.
Does anyone wear safety glasses while just reloading?
It's kinda got me curious now, i'm always just too lazy to put em on, am i flirtin with disaster?
A little off topic:
I've never had a primer fire while reloading, BUT, i have always thought about a piece of shot gettin in the primer punch under a live primer, especially since i now use a 9000G, i've always used single stages till about 1 yr ago, perhaps i should wear glasses runnin the 9000?

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 10:06 pm 
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I just press em back out, an keep on loading. Never had a problem, so far.

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Mar 17, 2005 11:15 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jun 25, 2004 11:58 pm
Posts: 7160
Location: Eastern Oklahoma
Before your angst level over depriming a live primer reaches cosmic heights check out my latest adventure with one of those little bombinos:

http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewtop ... 823#326823

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2005 5:07 am 
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Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2004 6:13 pm
Posts: 42
Location: New York
UltraMag,
I have had a piece of #9 magnum shot roll or fall into the primer seating cup (unaware to me). After I rotated the hull plate and pulled the handel I noticed a change in the amount of force needed to complete the cycle. I did a little investigating and found a crushed piece of shot. I was shocked that the primer did not go off, If the shot was larger maybe it would have. I just thank the lord that I still have a face. If it had gone off it may have been disaterous.
Later,
Phil


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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2005 1:29 pm 
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I really don't think just pushing a piece of shot into a primer is going to cause it to go BANG! It is the impact that causes the priming compound to fire. I've done some crush tests with large rifle and pistol primers over the years and have yet to get one to fire just crushing one. A sharp impact between the primer cup and anvil? Well, that's a totaly different tin of tuna! I've deprimed crimped in military primers, live ones and you would be amazed at the condition they were in after thay finaly came out. They didn't fire though! I'm not at all conserned about depriming live shotgun primers and then even reusing them! :shock: I've reused a lot of deprimed large and small rifle and pistol primers over the many years of my ammo handloading carear, never an issue depriming or reusing removed live primers. You do it any way you see fit, we are all responsible for our own actions and consequences. As far as using safety glasses, untill I needed to wear glasses to read/see close detail, I didn't use safety glasses either. Now, I don't have any choice! If I want to see what the heck I'm doing, and that is imensly helpfull, by the way, I have to wear safety glasses. I wear them all the time, except in the shower and in bed! :wink:

BP

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Thu Jul 24, 2014 11:58 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2014 11:50 pm
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I have some shotgun rounds that i would like to take the primer out and put in a different hull (these are liver primers) i have the Lee Load All 12 gauge,would the deprimer work? Or is there any danger to doing this? Any info would be great


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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:03 am 
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Joined: Thu Nov 30, 2006 3:44 am
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Yup, I wear safety glasses every time I just reload. After all, it is just my eyesight I am protecting.


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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:22 am 
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EyeMissum wrote:
I just press em back out, an keep on loading. Never had a problem, so far.


^
+1

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 3:26 am 
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Location: Central Pennsylvania and Southwest Florida
I have heard several people relate their tales of exploding primers. One nearly lost a finger. To me the chance is not worth the nickle saved.

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:01 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 17, 2014 10:12 am
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Location: Georgia
Shootshellz wrote:
Yup, I wear safety glasses every time I just reload. After all, it is just my eyesight I am protecting.



Me too!

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:27 am 
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Although its a very personal decision, for me its just not worth the effort to recover a primer or a hull.

I did read Case's linked thread about actually drilling a primer out and not having it go off. However, I have on a couple of occasions missed a cocked primer in the cup on my Spolar and have it detonate when the hydraulics closed down on it.

My understanding from some research that did some time ago is that smokeless powder is not a high explosive but the stuff they use in primers is.

The difference is that smokeless powder is an oxidation process...it burns albeit very quickly and its this quick generation of gas that accelerates the payload. Nonetheless, its a burning process with energy released as oxygen chemically combines with the powder.

High explosives (e.g. fulminate of mercury and whatever is in primers) actually detonate. The energy comes from the breaking of chemical bonds via a shock wave (hit it with a firing pin and it starts and the process accelerates through the explosive at the speed of the shock wave passing through the material which is MUCH faster than the rate of oxidation of smokeless powder).

I know...very boring. Bottom line it it generally takes a sharp striking to set off these type of explosives so I imagine that you could slowly crush a primer...or drill it out...without necessarily setting it off.

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 9:50 am 
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For those interested i knowing more about the difference between a "propellant" (e.g. smokeless powder) and an "explosive" (e.g. fulminate of mercury used in primers), here's a link to a good article on them...and on pyrotechnics as well.

https://mysite.du.edu/~jcalvert/phys/bang.htm

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 7:43 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2014 7:06 pm
Posts: 167
Location: Glasgow,SCOTLAND
ssbadazz wrote:
I have some shotgun rounds that i would like to take the primer out and put in a different hull (these are liver primers) i have the Lee Load All 12 gauge,would the deprimer work? Or is there any danger to doing this? Any info would be great



I also have a Lee Load all 12 gauge and have used the deprimer to remove live primers from other hulls without any problems,although i haven't done it that often just as and when required.Remember your pushing the primer out from the opposite side and not the striking side,but after reading the above posts it does make you think, so wearing a pair of safety glasses may be not such a bad idea.

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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:06 pm 
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Okay guys, what am I missing? ...as in why would I want to remove a primer?

I know the days of 'a penny apiece' are long gone but even as a cheap SOB, I can't think of a reason that I'd want to take any kind of risk with primers. ???


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 Post subject: Re: Primer removal: Is this wrong .. ? ..
PostPosted: Fri Jul 25, 2014 8:34 pm 
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Joined: Sat Apr 26, 2014 7:06 pm
Posts: 167
Location: Glasgow,SCOTLAND
Stuck-N-Kali wrote:
Okay guys, what am I missing? ...as in why would I want to remove a primer?

I know the days of 'a penny apiece' are long gone but even as a cheap SOB, I can't think of a reason that I'd want to take any kind of risk with primers. ???


Waste not, want not springs to mind,if it can be used then why throw it away! it's hardly going to explode is it,a primer is only a source of ignition nothing more.



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