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 Post subject: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2005 6:35 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:21 am
Posts: 10
Hello All,

Last weekend, I bought a Baikal .410, what baikal calls a "JUNIOR" model, I favoured it over the 9mm flobert I intended to buy due to ammo availability (flobert ammo will die out soon I believe). To my bad luck, I havent been able to try it out and shoot it yet, but I think it feels great and fits me good. I bought several boxes of 3" magnum fiocchi loads, and little 2" ones for short range shooting.

One of my major concerns is the barrel, the length. The barrel is 24" long, do you people think that this is sufficient length for the powder in a 3" .410 load to burn out completely and give out maximum momentum on the shot cup, or will I lose some speed?

Also, I would like to ask a choke question, most .410's have full chokes, Baikal, on their website, lists this model as having a modified choke. When I broke the gun down yesterday, I saw that it had the marks "24" 3" IM" inside, which should mean that it has an improved modified choke. Is this constriction any good? Has anyone shot with a .410 with a mod/ i.mod choke before?

One more question, what your preferred load number for close range dove shooting, especially turtle, Rock,Collared and laughing doves, and maybe some quail. I bought two boxes of #7.5 and #6 shot.




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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Sun Dec 25, 2005 11:45 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Wed Nov 09, 2005 3:07 am
Posts: 1787
Location: Paris,Illinois
Take a deep breath and relax.The barrel length is more than enough to burn the powder.Your other questions can be answered by patterning the gun.By close range -do ya mean 25 yards?The loads listed will work.If you are unsure about the gun/shells I strongly urge a visit to the local skeet club.This will give ya an idea of how/where your breaks are. Ask the other squad members where/how hard the bird was hit.Remember the 410 is not the best gun for a novice shooter.


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 3:22 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:21 am
Posts: 10
hoashooter wrote:
Take a deep breath and relax.The barrel length is more than enough to burn the powder.Your other questions can be answered by patterning the gun.By close range -do ya mean 25 yards?The loads listed will work.If you are unsure about the gun/shells I strongly urge a visit to the local skeet club.This will give ya an idea of how/where your breaks are. Ask the other squad members where/how hard the bird was hit.Remember the 410 is not the best gun for a novice shooter.


Thanks alot Hoashooter. I wont shoot anything with it thats more than 30yards away, just wont work. Im visiting the skeet range today, then hopefully gonna head for a farm to see some doves. Ill tell ya what will happen after I get back.

As for the .410, I know its an experts gun, but I bought it for its lower noise and lighter weight than my 12ga O/U. Besides, I feel that the 12ga is too much for what Im gonna shoot, and I hate shooting the 20ga, so my next best choice was the little .410.


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 11:51 am 
Limited Edition
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Joined: Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:45 am
Posts: 390
Location: Olympia, WA
9mm_flobert wrote:
hoashooter wrote:
Take a deep breath and relax.The barrel length is more than enough to burn the powder.Your other questions can be answered by patterning the gun.By close range -do ya mean 25 yards?The loads listed will work.If you are unsure about the gun/shells I strongly urge a visit to the local skeet club.This will give ya an idea of how/where your breaks are. Ask the other squad members where/how hard the bird was hit.Remember the 410 is not the best gun for a novice shooter.


Thanks alot Hoashooter. I wont shoot anything with it thats more than 30yards away, just wont work. Im visiting the skeet range today, then hopefully gonna head for a farm to see some doves. Ill tell ya what will happen after I get back.

As for the .410, I know its an experts gun, but I bought it for its lower noise and lighter weight than my 12ga O/U. Besides, I feel that the 12ga is too much for what Im gonna shoot, and I hate shooting the 20ga, so my next best choice was the little .410.


Why do you hate the 20ga?

_________________
David
Only two defining forces have ever died for you:
1. Jesus Christ
2. The American Soldier, Sailor, Airman, & Marine
One died for your soul, the other for your freedom.

1 Cross + 3 Nails = 4 Given


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:42 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:21 am
Posts: 10
dawei wrote:
9mm_flobert wrote:
hoashooter wrote:
Take a deep breath and relax.The barrel length is more than enough to burn the powder.Your other questions can be answered by patterning the gun.By close range -do ya mean 25 yards?The loads listed will work.If you are unsure about the gun/shells I strongly urge a visit to the local skeet club.This will give ya an idea of how/where your breaks are. Ask the other squad members where/how hard the bird was hit.Remember the 410 is not the best gun for a novice shooter.


Thanks alot Hoashooter. I wont shoot anything with it thats more than 30yards away, just wont work. Im visiting the skeet range today, then hopefully gonna head for a farm to see some doves. Ill tell ya what will happen after I get back.

As for the .410, I know its an experts gun, but I bought it for its lower noise and lighter weight than my 12ga O/U. Besides, I feel that the 12ga is too much for what Im gonna shoot, and I hate shooting the 20ga, so my next best choice was the little .410.


Why do you hate the 20ga?


I dont really hate it, I dont mind owning and shooting one, its just that I dont feel its a necessary gauge anymore. If you want to shoot something like a 20ga, shoot a 1oz (24g) 12ga load. The recoil is about the same, and you have more pellets after your bird, plus, atleast where I live, the shells of the 12ga are cheaper and easier to find. The other gauges which I believe are obsolete, are the 28ga and 10ga.

You may find me strange after reading this :D


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:54 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:21 am
Posts: 10
Hello,

just came back from shooting with this little sucker, and I have opposing views. At the skeet and trap range, i did real bad, skeet 10/25 and trap 15/25. When I went hunting with it, I could not hit s*** with it. Shot at doves and quail, cant even cut a feather. That was all done with a #10 9gr 2" fiocchi load and a #6 11/16 oz 3" load. Those shells sounded like crackers, and had no recoil, I didnt even feel like I was shooting a firearm. More like shooting a paintball gun.

That all changed after switching to a load I had a feeling that will work. #7.5 11/16 oz, MAX dram, 3" fiocchi magnum. After the mild shooting of the previous shells, shooting this one felt like I had switched to a real firearm. The sound was like that of a 12ga, I did feel some recoil, and most importantly, hit the birds!

After sunset, I had got 4 quail, and 27 doves, collared and laughing ones. All taken with the 3" fiocchi shell, nothing with the other shells. The gun performed flawlessly and shot really nice. I do however, prefer if it had a rib on it.


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 2:55 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 2:37 pm
Posts: 1226
Location: Essex, Ontario, Canada
I do a ton of shooting and hunting with the .410. I have 4 of them. I actually used to have the a Baikal O/U .410 and regret ever selling it. 24" barrels are plenty for .410. One thing I've found is that 3" loads for the .410 are unneseccary. The 2 1/2" 1/2oz loads pattern better than the 3" in an .410 I've ever owned plus they are faster and hit harder. For rabbits and pigeons I use 1/2oz #6 and all other birds 1/2oz #8. I have a recipe I use for a 1250fps 1/2oz load that works well out to 30yrds on everything I've ever shot it at. I think after you do some patterning you might find out the same about the 1/2oz loads as well. If your going to shoot 3" 11/16oz loads you might aswell have bought a 28ga and shoot 3/4oz loads becuase they too will pattern better than the 3" .410 loads.

Tim

_________________
If at first you don't succeed.......reload and try again.


Last edited by TReX300 on Mon Dec 26, 2005 4:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 3:08 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 10:15 am
Posts: 335
Location: The Golden State
Mr. 9mm,

Your really opened up a big can of worms! What do you mean the 20 gauge is an uneccesary gauge? So what would I use in the early season for pheasant? What would I use for skeet! What should I have my daughter use? The only thing that is useless are the tits on a boar hog! Now, that is useless!


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 5:09 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:21 am
Posts: 10
TReX300 wrote:
I do a ton of shooting and hunting with the .410. I have 4 of them. I actually used to have the a Baikal O/U .410 and regret ever selling it. 24" barrels are plenty for .410. One thing I've found is that 3" loads for the .410 are unneseccary. The 2 1/2" 1/2oz loads pattern better than the 3" in an .410 I've ever owned plus they are faster and hit harder. For rabbits and pigeons I use 1/2oz #6 and all other birds 1/2oz #8. I have a recipe I use for a 1250fps 1/2oz load that works well out to 30yrds on everything I've ever shot it at. I think after you do some patterning you might find out the same about the 1/2oz loads as well. If your going to shoot 3" 11/16oz loads you might aswell have bought a 28ga and shoot 3/4oz loads becuase they too will pattern better than the 3" .410 loads.

Tim


Im currently doing well with the fiocchi 3", I would love to reload, but I cant, due to lack of equipment and skills, plus I aint got the time to. I prefer just to buy and shoot. The next load I am hoping to try is the Rio 2 1/2". May I ask what choke you prefer when hunting doves and pigeons with the .410?

Thanks alot!


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 5:18 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:21 am
Posts: 10
marine one wrote:
Mr. 9mm,

Your really opened up a big can of worms! What do you mean the 20 gauge is an uneccesary gauge? So what would I use in the early season for pheasant? What would I use for skeet! What should I have my daughter use? The only thing that is useless are the tits on a boar hog! Now, that is useless!


I really did, and I must say, unintentionally :D

Its just my personal views, that mostly depend on the availability of ammo where I live (20ga is very, very hard to find) I may not be as experienced in hunting and shooting as you Mr.Marine (im 20 and Ive been shooting for about 12 years), if you find my claims silly, I must bow to your experience.

As for pheasant, I rarely shot at these nice birds, but my favourite load would be a #6 1oz 12ga, at no more than 35 yards. For skeet (I shoot that ALOT), I would use the olympic standards, a 12ga. For your daughter, it really depends on her age and her height, and if she really likes to hunt and sacrifices being beaten up. I started shooting a 12ga when I was 14, I was short and skinny. It beat the hell out of me :lol: , but everytime my dad asked me how I felt, I answered "Im fine", for I was a shooting maniac when I was young.


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 5:18 pm 
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Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2004 2:37 pm
Posts: 1226
Location: Essex, Ontario, Canada
The 3" maybe working all right for you but if you get a chance try the 2 1/2". Winchester makes a 2 1/2" 1/2oz 1300fps factory load thats deadly on dove size birds. If you ever get time you should look into reloading for the .410 the $2.25/box cost makes shooting them that much more fun. Most of my guns are choked Full or modified and to be honest with you if I shot them on paper you cant really tell a big difference btween the two at 20yrds unless you get into counting holes and drawing circles. The difference in choke designation in the .410 dosnt seem to be as large as with the other gauges. So I wouldnt get over conserned with it. I have one .410 that has a cylinder choke and that you can notice. I use it mainly for rabbits where my shots are going to be under 15-20yrds, like when jumping bush piles. If you gun is marked IM then you are going o get just as much range out of it as any of my Full choked guns.

Tim

_________________
If at first you don't succeed.......reload and try again.


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Mon Dec 26, 2005 5:24 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 16, 2005 5:21 am
Posts: 10
Thanks alot Trex, Im gonna try the Remington and winchester loads.


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2005 11:24 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 2:40 pm
Posts: 1654
Location: NW PA
[quote="9mm_flobert"]
I dont really hate it, I dont mind owning and shooting one, its just that I dont feel its a necessary gauge anymore. If you want to shoot something like a 20ga, shoot a 1oz (24g) 12ga load. The recoil is about the same, and you have more pellets after your bird, [/quote]

A 1 oz load (of whatever size shot) throws the same number of pellets, whether it's coming out of a 12, 16 or 20 gauge. A 1 oz load is a 1 oz load.

As for a 20 gauge, if all I need is a 1 oz load, I'd rather haul a light 20 gauge gun through the woods all day than a heavier 12 or even a 16.

Michael


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2005 1:24 pm 
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Quote:
9mm_flobert Posted:

The other gauges which I believe are obsolete, are the 28ga and 10ga.




Where the heck do you live? Around here the 28 ga. is very much alive an well. Sure as heck ain't obsolete.

As for the 10 ga. I don't see it as much as the 28 but it ain't dead either.

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Skeet aren't hard to hit, just easy to miss....!!


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Tue Dec 27, 2005 2:15 pm 
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Joined: Sat Jan 22, 2005 10:54 pm
Posts: 173
Location: Paso Robles, CA
where the heck do you live that you can't find 20ga shells? seems like every gunshop / supply store I go to anymore has just as many 20ga shells as they do 12's. this seems like a pretty blown up claim that 20ga shells are very very hard to find, especially where you are able to find 2-3 different brand/loads of .410. last time I was at the shop I was only able to find ONE brand/load of .410 (AA's) and it was close to 7.00 a box.

-Scott


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 Post subject: Re: Baikal .410
PostPosted: Wed Dec 28, 2005 1:02 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 30, 2005 10:15 am
Posts: 335
Location: The Golden State
Mr 9mm,
you really opened up a can of worms! Yes 20gauge ammo is plentiful! Where are you any ways that you are not able to see all these gauges that you claim not to exist?




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