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 Post subject: H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion Autoloader Failure to Feed
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 9:01 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:33 am
Posts: 170
Location: CT
Figured this might get more attention here than in the Fabarm section:

Recently acquired a used H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion (Red Lion? H368?). The gun appears to be barely used. No marks anywhere on it, and the bore and chambers are shockingly clean.

Action and functions look almost identical to my synthetic H368 Lion (duck gun).

Went through and thoroughly cleaned everything. Used very light amount of oil on moving pieces then wiped lightly off, the exact same way that I clean and oil my H368 duck gun (and I’ve never had an issue with the H368 duck gun cycling anything).

However, today, my first day shooting it (skeet), the SC Competition it failed to feed 1 out 4 1st rounds being loaded, and all 2nd rounds (after first was fired and ejected). The 1st shot was fine, ejected fine. The 2nd round will begin to load, begin to enter the chamber and the bolt would not close all the way nor push the round into the chamber. It would get stuck a bit before it was 1/2 way in. A slight push/tap of the handle and it would finish loading. And I could fire the 2nd round it would eject perfectly fine.

Shot 2 rounds of skeet this way. Shot 4 different types of shells. All 1 1/8oz loads, Rio, Gun Club, AA, Federal. All had the problem...

Where do I start? Clean again? Thoroughly “degrease” again? Shoot it with no oil anywhere? Could it be the gun is so lightly used it still needs to be broken in? What else to look at?

Some additional thoughts: (1) swap carrier springs between the guns and see how both act? (2) Put STOS or Perazzi or RIG grease on the ramp and elsewhere? (3) shoot heavy duck loads through it for a while?

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 Post subject: Re: H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion Autoloader Failure to Fee
PostPosted: Sat Dec 26, 2020 12:15 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:33 am
Posts: 170
Location: CT
Shot it again today. First I greased the loading ramp. This worked for the first 2 single manual loads, and then it also worked for a double. The 5th load (a single manual load) it got stuck like it was the other day. And did so for almost all loads after that for the rest of the skeet round (shooting only singles but loading a 2nd shell in hopes it would load). Then I swapped springs. The gun then wouldn’t eject the first shell, so the second shell would never load. However each manual single load worked fine (they just wouldn’t eject after the shot). I then shot my duck gun with the spring originally from my sporting gun, and it had the same issue as my sporting gun had, it would load even a single manual shell. It would get stuck too. So the original problem followed the spring to another gun.


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 Post subject: Re: H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion Autoloader Failure to Fee
PostPosted: Sat Dec 26, 2020 12:52 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Mon Jan 23, 2017 9:08 am
Posts: 2499
Location: Central NH
I think at this point I'd try the duck gun spring in the sporting gun, and see what happens.


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 Post subject: Re: H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion Autoloader Failure to Fee
PostPosted: Sat Dec 26, 2020 2:01 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:33 am
Posts: 170
Location: CT
painter* wrote:
I think at this point I'd try the duck gun spring in the sporting gun, and see what happens.
Yup, I did. I swapped springs. The sporting gun then wouldn’t eject the first shell, so the second shell would never load. Seemed like the recoil produced wasn’t strong enough to open the action enough, or fast/hard enough to eject the spent shell. However, each manual single load worked fine (they just wouldn’t eject after the shot).


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 Post subject: Re: H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion Autoloader Failure to Fee
PostPosted: Sun Jan 17, 2021 1:35 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:33 am
Posts: 170
Location: CT
Update: no more failure to feed or ejecting issues.  The last 2 things I’d did was (1) applied CLP oil to the “action bar,” as Fabarm calls it.  This slides into the reciever, and is what the breach bolt assembly is attached to.  And (2) I replaced the “recuperation” spring l as Fabarm call later it.  This the main spring or recoil spring.  Since then feeding and ejecting has been flawless for about 10 rounds of skeet, with a cleaning after 5 rounds.  Today, in my 3rd round of skeet (about 37* outside), the gun started failing to fire the second shot during doubles.  If I bumped the stock, the second shot would fire.  Happened every time my 3rd round.  Yes, the gun was mounted well into my shoulder.  I haven’t torn into a trigger mechanism yet, but I’m hoping the trigger reset mechanism is just dirty/bunked up.  This gun has a removable trigger group so guess I’ll start there.  Any other thoughts?


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 Post subject: Re: H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion Autoloader Failure to Fee
PostPosted: Tue Mar 16, 2021 5:39 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Fri Mar 19, 2004 9:07 pm
Posts: 2375
fishrising wrote:
Update: no more failure to feed or ejecting issues.  The last 2 things I’d did was (1) applied CLP oil to the “action bar,” as Fabarm calls it.  This slides into the reciever, and is what the breach bolt assembly is attached to.  And (2) I replaced the “recuperation” spring l as Fabarm call later it.  This the main spring or recoil spring.  Since then feeding and ejecting has been flawless for about 10 rounds of skeet, with a cleaning after 5 rounds.  Today, in my 3rd round of skeet (about 37* outside), the gun started failing to fire the second shot during doubles.  If I bumped the stock, the second shot would fire.  Happened every time my 3rd round.  Yes, the gun was mounted well into my shoulder.  I haven’t torn into a trigger mechanism yet, but I’m hoping the trigger reset mechanism is just dirty/bunked up.  This gun has a removable trigger group so guess I’ll start there.  Any other thoughts?


Fish......If the gun was not really broken in when you purchased it, it probably is now, so that's out of the equation. The gas piston has to move freely up and down the mag. tube and with the action locked back and you move the muzzle up and down you can hear it.

Give Andrew (lead gunsmith for Fabarm USA) a call....he's very knowledgeable and approachable. He should be able to solve the problem.

410-901-1260


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 Post subject: Re: H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion Autoloader Failure to Fee
PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2021 6:53 am 
Crown Grade
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 7:19 pm
Posts: 2026
Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
I have this exact same sporting clays gun. Mine had a few FTF when I bought it used. After shooting it a bunch they just seemed to work there way out of the gun. I’d try feeding stout ammo for a bit and see if things smooth out. 1 and 1/8 ounce and 1350 ish fpm. Also be sure your carrier is free to move fore and aft. It controls feeding and locking bolt open. That could be part of issue. Right now this is my go to gun for sporting. I put the drop shim in and pushed adjustable comb over for some cast and it’s a good fit with a slip on pad to lengthen. As mentioned, fabarm USA will support these guns for the cost of repairs. HK’s lifetime warranty is toast and they will no longer support the guns they imported.


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 Post subject: Re: H&K Fabarm SC Competition Lion Autoloader Failure to Fee
PostPosted: Wed Mar 17, 2021 2:44 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 8:33 am
Posts: 170
Location: CT
I was about to ship the gun off to Fabarm, but now you guys are making me second guess that and try shooting it some more. It’s just the weird thing of it failing to fire the second shot quite often now, after the first shot’s spent hull is ejected and the second shell is loaded. It doesn’t even click when I pull the trigger the second time. Almost like the trigger doesn’t get reset. But if I bump the stock and then pull the trigger again after it fails to fire...it goes bang! I’ll shoot my heaviest loads through it hopefully this weekend and see what happens.




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