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 Post subject: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Sat Dec 16, 2017 7:14 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 3:28 pm
Posts: 5707
What were the changes to the By-laws alluded to by Sec't-Treasurer Nalor in the Dec-2018 CTN?




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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Sun Dec 17, 2017 3:40 am 
Limited Edition

Joined: Sun Jul 02, 2017 5:33 am
Posts: 330
Location: Iowa
Only the Officers and Directors know the changes as of now.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:59 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 3:28 pm
Posts: 5707
D McMillen wrote:
Only the Officers and Directors know the changes as of now.


What's the big secret?

Why didn't they disclose the proposed changes to the membership BEFORE the vote?


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 12:43 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 3:28 pm
Posts: 5707
D McMillen wrote:
Only the Officers and Directors know the changes as of now.


Did the Directors have advance knowledge of the proposed By-law changes before the meeting at which they approved them?


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 2:20 pm 
Limited Edition

Joined: Sun Jul 02, 2017 5:33 am
Posts: 330
Location: Iowa
I have no idea ShowMe. I have better things to do than worry about a couple changes to by-laws. It will soon come out or better yet, why don't you get a hold of your state directors and ask them.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 4:51 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 3:28 pm
Posts: 5707
D McMillen wrote:
I have no idea ShowMe. I have better things to do than worry about a couple changes to by-laws.


I hope the directors that voted on the By-law changes didn't think like that.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 5:10 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 3:28 pm
Posts: 5707
D McMillen wrote:
I have no idea ShowMe. I have better things to do than worry about a couple changes to by-laws.


What if the by-laws changes said NSCA members could vote for the BoD members?

What if the by-laws changes said NSCA members could be members of the BoD?

What if the by-laws changes said NSCA was an equal owner in NSC?


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 7:00 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 9:15 pm
Posts: 5781
Location: Northern Virginia
D McMillen wrote:
I have no idea ShowMe. I have better things to do than worry about a couple changes to by-laws. It will soon come out or better yet, why don't you get a hold of your state directors and ask them.


Or even better, why don't you become a state director?? Most states need volunteers, and I am sure they would welcome a retiree who has time to travel to meetings to worry about the minutia of changing some spellings in the by-laws.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Wed Dec 20, 2017 10:59 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:34 pm
Posts: 6017
ShowMe wrote:
D McMillen wrote:
I have no idea ShowMe. I have better things to do than worry about a couple changes to by-laws.


What if the by-laws changes said NSCA members could vote for the BoD members?

What if the by-laws changes said NSCA members could be members of the BoD?

What if the by-laws changes said NSCA was an equal owner in NSC?


What if, while actually shooting....you called ‘pull’, and were pondering all these horrible, sky is falling scenarios, rather than thinking about breaking the target?


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 5:04 pm 
Crown Grade
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 8:49 pm
Posts: 3753
Location: Mormon Mecca
Hey Rooster,

Image

{hs#

_________________
Bob Hicks, from Mormon Mecca
I’m 78 years young and going as hard as I can for as long as I can.
“Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don’t mind.”
Image
Retired


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 5:42 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Jan 17, 2016 3:34 pm
Posts: 6017
Good point!


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 6:44 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:54 am
Posts: 174
Location: Southwest Michigan
It is my understanding that these changes would be considered basic housekeeping. No changes to the structure or leadership of the organization. These changes were made to bring our bylaws back into harmony with current Texas law. I would be disappointed in any director who would vote against any change which was made to ensure our compliance with the law. We are an association of skeet enthusiasts not an outlaw biker gang or a band of pirates. No offense intended to bikers or pirates. Both groups have always treated me fairly.

Best Regards,
Jason Johnson


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 7:03 pm 
Crown Grade
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 29, 2005 10:02 pm
Posts: 5651
Location: Central Pennsylvania and Southwest Florida
dubob wrote:
Hey Rooster,

Image

{hs#

So much for "Keep It Friendly...Might Apply to YOU" This place is getting more and more like that "other" site. If you don't agree with the clique you are nothin'.

_________________
{hs#
Jim


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 10:57 pm 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*

Joined: Sun Feb 18, 2007 11:22 am
Posts: 9089
Location: Rochester, NY
Jason Johnson wrote:
It is my understanding that these changes would be considered basic housekeeping. No changes to the structure or leadership of the organization. These changes were made to bring our bylaws back into harmony with current Texas law. I would be disappointed in any director who would vote against any change which was made to ensure our compliance with the law. We are an association of skeet enthusiasts not an outlaw biker gang or a band of pirates. No offense intended to bikers or pirates. Both groups have always treated me fairly.

Best Regards,
Jason Johnson


There should never be a need for a vote to maintain legal compliance, it should happen automatically, I believe this would be the job of a compliance officer. There is a disconnect somewhere if the association requires a vote to make sure they are not operating contrary to the law.

And I do not believe the concern is necessary with any proposed changes specifically, it is with the fact that the proposed changes are not made readily available to rank and file members so if they don't agree with what is proposed they can express their opinion to their directors. It would take about 30 seconds for NSSA to put a "Bylaw Change Proposal" post on the main page at the same time the email out the ballots.

_________________
S3 Smingler Shotgun Sports
Ian Smingler
585-613-8098
[email protected]
http://www.sminglershotgunsports.com

Manufacturer of Custom Brass Barrel Weights for over/under, top single, and unsingle shotguns.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Thu Dec 21, 2017 11:17 pm 
Limited Edition

Joined: Sun Oct 14, 2007 8:17 pm
Posts: 437
Location: South Alabama
Agree with Skeet_Man. Also agree with ShowMe that the membership should always question why leadership does not trust them with information necessary to discuss issues with their director.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 2:21 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 9:15 pm
Posts: 5781
Location: Northern Virginia
Most organizations operate under Robert's Rules....and Robert's rules DOES require a vote for by-law changes....regardless the reason for the changes.

Quote:
Robert's Rules for Amending Bylaws - dummies
http://www.dummies.com/careers/business ... ng-bylaws/
According to Robert's Rules, you should, at the very least, require a two-thirds vote and previous notice to make any change at all in your bylaws. ... The current bylaw. The bylaw as it will read if the amendment is adopted.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 8:19 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Tue Oct 02, 2012 7:54 am
Posts: 174
Location: Southwest Michigan
Skeet_Man wrote:
it is with the fact that the proposed changes are not made readily available to rank and file members so if they don't agree with what is proposed they can express their opinion to their directors. It would take about 30 seconds for NSSA to put a "Bylaw Change Proposal" post on the main page at the same time the email out the ballots.


My point was that the changes made were not of an organizational or operational nature. I agree 100% that COMMUNICATION with the membership and TRANSPARENCY in decision making are 2 things that every organization should strive for. Our organization has not been the best at either. I believe that they (the leadership) are working at getting better at both and hope that they continue to improve. Considering how easy it would have been to post the info to website or include it in target talk email, there is no reason that this should not have been done. I suspect that they felt that these changes were a minor housekeeping detail and that no reasonable person would be against it. Even if this was the case, they still should have communicated this to us so that we could decide if we cared about these minor changes or not. Again, communication and transparency...

Best Regards,
Jason Johnson


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:31 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 9:15 pm
Posts: 5781
Location: Northern Virginia
Guys,

I am a director, and most of you know I often disagree with things the EC and other leadership do.

These changes were quite mundane. Simply house keeping.

I will gladly email the Track Changes version to any of you who wants it. For those unfamiliar, Track Changes is a Word format that shows deletions in Red, and additions in Blue. So it makes it easy to see exactly what is being changed from the old version.

If you want the copy, post your email address on this thread. Don't PM it to me, as I am having issues with my PM every other day.

Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:33 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sat Nov 20, 2010 9:15 pm
Posts: 5781
Location: Northern Virginia
PS, I'll wait a couple days to see who all replies, then send it out in a single mailing.


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 Post subject: Re: By-law Changes???
PostPosted: Fri Dec 22, 2017 9:34 am 
Crown Grade
User avatar

Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 8:49 pm
Posts: 3753
Location: Mormon Mecca
Jim Miller wrote:
dubob wrote:
Hey Rooster,

Image

{hs#

So much for "Keep It Friendly...Might Apply to YOU" This place is getting more and more like that "other" site. If you don't agree with the clique you are nothin'.
It was a metaphor Jim. It conveys my opinion that arguing with that individual is a total waste of time. I haven't belonged to a 'clique' since my early twenties. That individual has produced negative statement after negative statement after negative statement about the NSSA on these forums for several years now. He has continuously questioned the leadership of the organization ad infinitum. Most of it has been nothing but sour grapes.

As to the issue in question, the NSSA has been making housekeeping changes to the by-laws without notifying the membership for as long as I've been a member (joined in 1986). It has never been a big deal that the membership got all bent out of shape over in those 30 plus years. Now, all of a sudden, one member thinks we should be totally outraged over it. That is absolutely absurd, IMHO. I don't recall ever seeing a positive comment about the NSSA on this site from that one member. I marked him as a foe a long time ago and don't ever read his posts unless they are quoted by others. Like SX1, he isn't worth the effort or time to debate on here. So I expressed that thought with a metaphor to Rooster. I don't see it as being friendly or unfriendly; just an expressed opinion. You are welcome to see it any way that suits you. No disrespect intended towards you at all. Merry Christmas to you and I hope you enjoy this holiday season to the fullest.
{hs#



_________________
Bob Hicks, from Mormon Mecca
I’m 78 years young and going as hard as I can for as long as I can.
“Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter, and those who matter don’t mind.”
Image
Retired


Last edited by dubob on Sat Dec 23, 2017 7:23 am, edited 1 time in total.

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