ShotGunWorld Shotguns

It is currently Sat Nov 28, 2020 1:04 am

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]





Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 58 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 9:21 am 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Mon May 20, 2019 9:53 am
Posts: 1324
Would be a much better post if you could be more specific about what happened to the ejectors and trigger. Pics would be even better! Plenty of shotgun geeks on here who would appreciate the chance to see/learn/diagnose.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 10:11 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:04 am
Posts: 2837
Litespeed wrote:
RandyWakeman wrote:
EricB wrote:
To be fair, McDonald’s was never about quality. :D


Of course it is. Buns must be caramelized properly, the same with the fries, same consistency with their shakes, same cleanliness of dining rooms, same standards for rest-rooms, and do on. Consistency [b]is quality.[/b]


This.

Locally we have a fast food chain which has won the United States Malcolm Baldridge National Quality award, the very first business in the entire restaurant sector to win that prestigious award. Started in the mid-50s the company has always strived to improve through data and process driven quality control. They constantly work on consistency to provide a quality product every time. It may seem to be just hot dogs, hamburgers and shakes, but how it done time after time is what make this or any business stand out.

A co-worker moved here from another state and his high school daughter went to work at Pal's as she had worked at fast food places previously. Boy, did she ever get an education. Training to make hot dogs alone required over 30 steps. She was required to both write them in order, but also to demonstrate in practice that she could do correctly. All the other menu items were similar as the expectation was they be done right every time.

The link below is dated and Pal's has since grown a lot, but they still hammer on consistency and quality in everything they do. For years they have also run a Quality Academy where they teach the principals of data and process driven quality principals, which apply across all business sectors. So this little company can teach nationally known and very large businesses what they have learned about quality just by making fast food, but doing it consistently right every time. As Randy said, consistency is quality.

I include this link for any who may never have been involved in quality training or a quality control process at your place of work and may be curious about it. Years ago I went through the Edwards Deming quality training at my place of employment, learning how I could apply it to my own job within that company. I found it most interesting then and still do.

https://www.nist.gov/baldrige/pals-sudden-service

As far as Caesar Guerini quality possibly going down, I seriously doubt it. I've had my Summit Ascent only for a few months but in fit, finish and function it is a quality shotgun in every regard. Everything I read about their service and backing their product is good as well. It's easy to make assumptions about a product based on having a problem with it, large or small. What really counts is how the maker backs their product and takes care of any problem which might occur.



Bingo. The importance of competent, timely and responsive customer and technical service cannot be overstated. Problems with any manufactured product are going to occur and firearms are certainly no exception. Of course, it`s important for a company to minimize those as much as possible and do its best to ensure that the same problems are not re-occurring, but the American consumer can and will be very forgiving if they are well taken care of after the sale.

_________________
Fabarm L4S Initial Hunter
Remington 870 Super Magnum Turkey
Remington V3 Walnut
Remington 870 Express (Realtree Xtra camo)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 7:12 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:25 pm
Posts: 18
As an owner of 6 CG field guns I appreciate their quality in design, manufacture and finish.
That is why I have two more on order.
I have no hesitation in spending a significant amount of money on these guns as I know, if there is a manufacturing problem or later issue with the guns, the company will stand behind their product and fix it. This says to me the company has confidence in the quality of their product.

The original poster did not give us any details of the "problems" other than "puked" and did not give us any information regarding contact with CG. As such I think his post should be ignored and I am disappointed in his besmirching the reputation of CG. Too often people impulsively share their gripes before trying to solve them in an appropriate manner. This goes viral and good companies can suffer due to the laziness and click happy attitude of people with a gripe.

I have had many newer Browning field guns which I have parted with due to their finish inferior compared to CG, and lack of customer support with problems and repairs. I am very impressed with CG and believe they are a company focussed on improving and supporting their products.

As far as I am concerned, Caesar Guerini produces state of the art guns with very high quality and meets all of my needs at an affordable price. Don't be misled by one person with a gripe.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 17, 2020 7:57 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Fri Jul 10, 2020 4:20 pm
Posts: 278
gunstock wrote:
As an owner of 6 CG field guns I appreciate their quality in design, manufacture and finish.
That is why I have two more on order.
I have no hesitation in spending a significant amount of money on these guns as I know, if there is a manufacturing problem or later issue with the guns, the company will stand behind their product and fix it. This says to me the company has confidence in the quality of their product.

The original poster did not give us any details of the "problems" other than "puked" and did not give us any information regarding contact with CG. As such I think his post should be ignored and I am disappointed in his besmirching the reputation of CG. Too often people impulsively share their gripes before trying to solve them in an appropriate manner. This goes viral and good companies can suffer due to the laziness and click happy attitude of people with a gripe.

I have had many newer Browning field guns which I have parted with due to their finish inferior compared to CG, and lack of customer support with problems and repairs. I am very impressed with CG and believe they are a company focussed on improving and supporting their products.

As far as I am concerned, Caesar Guerini produces state of the art guns with very high quality and meets all of my needs at an affordable price. Don't be misled by one person with a gripe.

I am available for adoption if you are interested.

_________________
Morris


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2020 9:51 am 
Field Grade

Joined: Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:32 pm
Posts: 84
Here are a couple of links that may be of interest to some. The first is an article on the rise of Caesar Guerini as a gun maker. Well done article which speaks to the Guerini business model of customer service. It obviously predates the introduction of the Guerini Invictus, which is a different action from the standard Guerini action the article covers.

https://1v4la4180gt815aln11dh8w8-wpengi ... an0313.pdf

This is a video from the UK YouTube channel of The Gun Shop. I don't watch a lot of gun test videos, but I do like the shotgun ones done by John of The Gun Shop. He does some good short videos about the history of various shotgun makers like Perazzi, Browning, Beretta and others. This one is about the short history of Caesar Guerini. He includes the problems with some of the first Guerinis and how the company has addressed those problems to produce their current products. It's only six and a half minutes long and worth the time if you are interested in this brand.

https://video.search.yahoo.com/search/v ... tion=click


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 5:52 am 
Utility Grade

Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2020 5:09 pm
Posts: 15
Of course CG said send it in for repair. I'm glad no one else is having problems. Must be two flukes.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Thu Jul 23, 2020 7:04 am 
Diamond Grade
User avatar

Joined: Wed Oct 14, 2015 6:58 am
Posts: 1738
Location: Omaha, NE
Have you sent yet? Received back? Explanation? Result?
Truly interested.

_________________
“With age comes wisdom but sometimes age comes alone.”
-Oscar Wilde


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2020 4:03 am 
Utility Grade

Joined: Sat Jan 18, 2020 5:09 pm
Posts: 15
The inertial trigger on my wife's new gun quit resetting. The action was near impossible to open and close and the safety was so stiff she couldn't operate it. I fixed both of those issues. The top ejector on my friends new gun quit ejecting. These failures indicate lack of quality control to me. Both have been fixed. Both failures occurred in the first 200 rounds of firing. My Ellipse EVO Sporting is a great gun I also had a repair issue with it which I have since forgotten.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2020 4:47 am 
Field Grade

Joined: Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:41 am
Posts: 41
Location: E TN
Very happy with the Guerini's my family has.
My wife wanted a Syren Tempio last year, so I got her one at Christmas. She has about 5000 rounds through it without 1 issue. I did loosen it up a tad when new because it was too stiff for her. She loves it.

I liked her gun so much, 2 months later I bought myself an Invictus. 11000 rounds through it with zero issues.

Happy Guerini owners here!


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2020 6:04 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:25 pm
Posts: 18
My appologies to studdog88 if my post seemed too strong.
I am glad he has been able to resolve his issues.
All manufacturers will have problems with some of their guns. These are precision instruments used in a variety of adverse conditions.
What makes me a CG fanatic is they have technologically andvanced designs of high quality. But the real selling point is they stand behind their product and will fix problems very quickly.
I have had many of the big name guns and when they developed a problem there was no support from the manufacturer/distributor. The guns we are talking about are a significant cost and as consumers we deserve reasonable support.
Caesar Guerini USA delivers this unquestionably.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 25, 2020 6:51 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Mon May 20, 2019 9:53 am
Posts: 1324
gonna have to disagree with the 'technologically advanced' concept. nothing advanced about a rizzini action and push button forearms. CG took a run of the mill design that is cheap to mfr and put a very nice finish and strong marketing campaign behind it.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:45 am 
Shotgun Expert
Shotgun Expert
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:02 am
Posts: 26772
Location: Plainfield, IL
gunstock wrote:
What makes me a CG fanatic is they have technologically advanced designs of high quality


There is no question that the Invictus O/U action is the most advanced O/U shotgun on the market. https://www.shotgunworld.com/shotguns/gu ... ictus.html .

_________________
--Randy

http://randywakeman.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 2:29 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Mon May 20, 2019 9:53 am
Posts: 1324
perhaps in your mind but not in mine.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 2:39 pm 
Crown Grade
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2007 5:21 pm
Posts: 5197
Location: UK
There's nothing advanced about any of the Beretta offerings either, and the Miroku/Browning action design is truly primitive. Not surprising since it was designed in a barn almost 100 years ago.

_________________
“when Muslims are in the minority they are very concerned with minority rights, when they are in the majority there are no minority rights.”


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:20 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:04 am
Posts: 2837
birdhunter39 wrote:
perhaps in your mind but not in mine.


An accurate assumption that you are not a CG/Fabarm fan ?

_________________
Fabarm L4S Initial Hunter
Remington 870 Super Magnum Turkey
Remington V3 Walnut
Remington 870 Express (Realtree Xtra camo)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 8:49 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Mon May 20, 2019 9:53 am
Posts: 1324
Fabarm no.

CG however is doing a great thing in this market by pushing other major makers to up their game in the finish department AND perhaps more importantly the service end. I've liked most of the models i've handled. Good weight and stock dimensions and of course pretty finishes.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 9:17 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:04 am
Posts: 2837
birdhunter39 wrote:
Fabarm no.

CG however is doing a great thing in this market by pushing other major makers to up their game in the finish department AND perhaps more importantly the service end. I've liked most of the models i've handled. Good weight and stock dimensions and of course pretty finishes.


I’d be curious to know what issues you’ve had with Fabarm guns. I’ve only owned one , my L4S Initial Hunter and it’s been a faultless field gun. CG and Fabarm share the same customer service and I’ve found them to be outstanding, although I’ve not needed actual gun work.

_________________
Fabarm L4S Initial Hunter
Remington 870 Super Magnum Turkey
Remington V3 Walnut
Remington 870 Express (Realtree Xtra camo)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:57 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 9:31 pm
Posts: 2433
Trickster wrote:
There's nothing advanced about any of the Beretta offerings either, and the Miroku/Browning action design is truly primitive. Not surprising since it was designed in a barn almost 100 years ago.


LOL and they both work.

_________________
Never sell a gun you shoot well, no matter how ugly or unpopular.
Copyright 2020 by SEB7515. All Rights Reserved.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 2:13 pm 
Crown Grade
User avatar

Joined: Tue Mar 06, 2007 5:21 pm
Posts: 5197
Location: UK
seb7515 wrote:
Trickster wrote:
There's nothing advanced about any of the Beretta offerings either, and the Miroku/Browning action design is truly primitive. Not surprising since it was designed in a barn almost 100 years ago.


LOL and they both work.
Exactly. Shotguns are mechanically simple, unsophisticated devices and super spiffy elegant engineering designs are pointless. Material and manufacturing quality along with attention to detail are what matter and CG is not lacking in that area.

_________________
“when Muslims are in the minority they are very concerned with minority rights, when they are in the majority there are no minority rights.”


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: CG quality going down?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 3:37 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Thu Feb 07, 2013 6:25 pm
Posts: 18
I agree with Tricksters post entirely. I would like to explain to Birdhunter39 why I feel CG are technologically advanced. I am not referring to the Invictus in which I believe Randy is right on. That gun is leaps and bounds beyond the traditional offerings.
I spend 4 months a year, full time bird hunting with my dogs. The various guns I used, mainly Browning, did not meet my needs. They were not easy to maintain in the field, dirt was easily introduced into the action. The barrels were only chromed in the breech section. The guns required more shots than I will ever shoot in the field, to "wear" in. The current wood quality on their field guns is shoddy. The guns felt bulky due to their design.
CG offered a gun, that although it is a traditional Brescia design, has refinements that make it stand out above other offerings.
The ejectors can be removed for cleaning in seconds. The barrels are fully chrome lined. The stock finish is Boiled Linseed Oil which is the easiest finish in my opinion to maintain and refinish ( I know this is not a technological advancement but it is recognition that our predecessors got it right). The bearing surfaces are jewelled which aids in lubricant retention. The push button fore stock release is simple and effective. Why go to a more complex mechanism that introduces more failure opportunities. The manufacturing process is so refined that I have three 20g field guns and all of their barrels are interchangeable with no fitting required ( despite CG's instructions ). The metal and wood finish is outstanding on all their guns which is as it should be on guns in this price range. Most other manufacturers seem to think that $7000 is required for nice wood.
I worked in maintaining Nuclear reactors. Good simple design equates to reliability.
CG has taken a very sensible approach in taken a time proven design, improving it technologically, and adding the higher quality finish that we as North Americans appreciate. I don't believe their strong marketing campaign was an attempt at swaying gun buyers. I think it was a notice to all the gun owners in North America that we are a company who are here to support you and ensure your satisfaction.
I have been to CG and enjoyed their hospitality, they are great people and serious gun experts.
CG has earned my loyalty and I am extremely happy shooting their guns.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 58 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Registered users: Bing [Bot], cheecho1960, Cumberland, dickgtax, DooFighter, F*W*F, Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], Google Feedfetcher, johnnie g, LilBoog, Mark Pfeifer, Mkk, OldStufferA5#1911, Rack-N-Roy, RetroRain, sewmacoil, Stuck-N-Kali, Supertex1978, Waldyo


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group    - DMCA Notice