ShotGunWorld Shotguns

It is currently Sat Aug 08, 2020 6:38 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Image



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 
Author Message
 Post subject: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 4:22 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:50 pm
Posts: 4
Good day all. I have several boxes of loose 1oz. factory type rifled Foster slugs. These measure out around .735" at the skirt. I am having trouble finding exact load data for these things. If anyone has a source for that data I would be truly grateful. If I remember right these were factory loaded with a card and fiber wad column. I see a lot of loads for the Lyman and Lee .690" slugs which ride in the shot cup of the wad. I see some information where people have adjusted those loads by cutting the petals off the wad for a larger slug however I don't see any published data for doing something like this. I have a lot of card and fiber spacers. I have some BPI brush wads for gas seal and spacing. I just can't find data to put anything together for the original Foster slug. It is not a priority I get them loaded up however it is now a quest for knowledge and secondly, if for some reason I really needed to load them up, I would prefer not to blow my face off. Any help would be appreciated. I guess my real question is about wad column substitution in slug loads. Lots of variables there and I know a little there can make big changes in pressures. I am fine with trimming hulls to fit a given load column height if I could find one. Thanks.




Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 5:20 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Tue May 03, 2011 1:25 pm
Posts: 242
Would help us a great deal if you posted the weight of slug and it's overall length. Both weight and length figure into what published load might directly work, or could be safely adjusted. And what manufacturer was this slug intended to be loaded by (Rem, Win, Fed)?

If you wanted to order this downloadable copy of Ballistics Products Slug load manual, you MIGHT get lucky and find the Foster slug load data used by a particular factory's Foster slug.

https://www.ballisticproducts.com/Downl ... fo/XMSLUG/

OK, I finally downloaded a copy of this for myself. Here's one of their published loads with a 375 grain Foster slug. You HAVE to check weigh your slugs and use this data only if the weight matches pretty closely.

BPI Load # 110309-2885
12 gauge Federal hulls, 2 3/4"
Fed 209A Primer
International 29 grains Powder
HCD24 Wad from BPI
Foster Slug 375 grains
Over-shot wad on top of slug COS121
ROLL CRIMPED
Pressure, PSI: 10100
Muzzle Velocity 1600


Now, what hull does this fit? According to the loading manual and the BPI on-line catalog, this is the hull (#0621275) in their catalog:

Federal 12ga 2-3/4" IBW hulls new/skived/primed 16mm brass (100/bag)

Color: Clear, translucent
Top Edge: Skived
Depth (center): 2.524"
Length: 2.751"
Brass Height: 0.630"
Brass Diam: .800"
Tube Diam: .787"
Primer: Federal 209A (Fed 202)
Current Headstamp: "12 GA FEDERAL"
Wall Thickness: 0.027"

Federal 12ga 2-3/4 hulls feature an extra-deep plastic base, plenty of internal space for very versatile load applications. The interior capacity of these hulls is so great that the primer actually extends up and over the basewad by 0.059". This is a very strong hull and one of the most consistent hulls we've ever seen in our ballistic lab. Used for many law enforcement applications.

Note: These are not the same as Federal's Gold Medal hull.

I would call the BPI folks and ask if they really mean this load is NOT suitable for the Gold Medal hull, as it is one of the easier Federal hulls to identify.

The loading manual shows you the special tools and techniques to get a good roll crimp.

Good luck, garrisonjoe


Last edited by garrisonjoe on Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 5:54 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:50 pm
Posts: 4
They weigh in at .438 grains and are .735"x.800" I have the Ballistics products manual and they do have loads for "Foster Slugs" however they do not show dimensions and they are showing the load using a shot cup type wad which leads me to believe that is for the smaller size (.690") hand cast slugs. I suppose what I am asking for is a load using a fiber and card wad column or one using a plastic piston type wad instead of a shot cup style wad. The factory loads and the old Breneke slugs were loaded with a nitro card/fiber filler wad/nitro card. I can reproduce that and get the hull length right but I don't have any powder/primer load data for it. As far as brand, I do not know. These are in bulk boxes without any manufacturer markings.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:15 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Tue May 03, 2011 1:25 pm
Posts: 242
The 8th Edition of the BPI manual now DOES have the weight and length of what they are calling the "Improved Foster" slug. Here's the measurements they publish:

Weight 7/8 oz (or 382 +/- grains)
Length 0.611”
Diameter 0.678”

So the load above that I shared IS NOT suitable for the old style slugs that you have. The quoted load is indeed for a "shot wad" into which the slug is inserted. Not suitable for a bore-diameter slug like these old Foster slugs you have.

Will be interesting to see if anyone has data for those old slugs!

Good luck, garrisonjoe


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:36 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:50 pm
Posts: 4
Thanks Joe. I wonder if for instance I can dissemble a current factory Foster Slug load and recreate it. I wonder if there is data anywhere as to what powder and primers the manufacturers use. The Bass Pro Shops site has a good set of images for the Winchester Super X Foster Slug round. I would assume it is a Winchester tapered hull, Winchester primer and a Winchester powder. The wad column looks like three fiber wads to make up height. Of course I am not going to cobble something together but it might be a place to start. Defiantly some research needed. I haven't figured out how to post pictures here or I would have done that instead of just referencing the image.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:37 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Tue May 03, 2011 1:25 pm
Posts: 242
From a quick search in the CASTBOOLITS forum (yes, that is spelled right), here's a load that I have never tried and the origin of it was stated as Lyman's 4th Shotshell loads manual.

See 10 year old post
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthr ... oster-data

That load was:
Federal plastic hunting case with paper base wad, 12 gauge, 2 3/4"
Lyman 475gr Foster slug,
32.0gr Unique powder,
Win 209 primer, WAA12 wad with petals removed,
2 BPI 0.125" (hard) cards under slug base,
Roll crimp.
1465 fps, 10,300 LUP.

You might consider something like that for your lighter slugs. Going to a lighter weight should be an extra margin of safety in the load, but that is for YOU to evaluate. I have not tested this load!

A teflon wrapper around the slug might increase accuracy and reduce leading, as discussed in the BPI loading manual.

Good luck, garrisonjoe


Last edited by garrisonjoe on Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:40 pm, edited 2 times in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:43 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Tue May 03, 2011 1:25 pm
Posts: 242
Disassembling a factory load may be interesting but rarely is PROOF of what the factory is doing with their design. The main reason is the factory uses (mostly) non-cannister powders made to their ballistics requirements for each load. These non-cannister powders are almost never sold to reloaders. It takes a deep set of analytical chemistry and materials science to understand all that they stuff into a shell. I would not use any conclusions other than the weight of the lead slug in the shell. And that is probably stamped on the box, along with the muzzle velocity they measured in their test equipment.

If I had those slugs, I'd melt them down and cast them into a shape that has modern loading data available for it (hint - Lee Drive Key slug mold, or the Lyman sabot slug).

Good luck, garrisonjoe


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 6:55 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2020 3:50 pm
Posts: 4
I may spend this evening looking for a mold and lead pot. Thanks Joe.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 7:50 pm 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*

Joined: Thu Oct 09, 2003 4:31 pm
Posts: 2534
Location: Virginia
Lyman No. 3 has the data you are looking for.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Load data for factory style Foster slugs
PostPosted: Sat Aug 01, 2020 8:39 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Tue May 03, 2011 1:25 pm
Posts: 242
Well, Lyman 3 and 4 have data for the LYMAN Foster design slug, which weighs a nominal 475 grains. The OP has some factory Foster slugs that weigh 438 grains. Whether the data from Lyman works well with the obviously different factory slug, is to be determined. As I stated above, it is LIKELY to be safe since the OP has a lighter slug, but it is literally NOT the data the OP was looking for, AFAIK.




Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 10 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Registered users: 828UBenelli, Anatidae, bigeejakes, Bill M., Bing [Bot], Bird Guide, Bladeswitcher, brm, cole1, Coopdog, ctr0022, Curly N, dfw_bill, dhb66, Diddle, dogchaser37, double20, Ductape, eaglerjs, ebcjr, Ernest T, Gard72977, geometric, George Z, gomerdog, goodemachine, Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], Gunsite Guy, hollywood63, hopper810, ithacanut, JacksBack, Keperkey, Majestic-12 [Bot], Malcolm7, Matalpa2, MAX & TOBY, maxrios, May, McFarmer, Milkmaster, misterdom, oneounceload, PdxK80, Qdog002, redi, Redsoilreaper, REFAK, RichM, Rooster booster, shacked, smadam78, smlekid, sv10001975, ThrowAway, VetEyeDoc, Waldyo, wcampb7899, Wilfred1955


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group    - DMCA Notice