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 Post subject: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:42 am 
Diamond Grade
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Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
The Benelli inertia action with its rotating bolt head as invented and patented by Paola Benelli has been widely copied and is the most common inertia action for shotguns currently produced. It does suffer from the so called Benelli click where the cam follower pin in the z slotted cam track in the bolt body can get stuck preventing the bolt head from fully rotating to close, the bolt not fully going into breech, and the gun not firing. The issue is overblown in my opinion but two manufacturers have stepped up with patented solutions to the problem. First up is Moretti in the ‘856 patent assigned to Benelli Armi S.p.A. As seen in the figures Moretti added a spring loaded ball 100 to push on the rotating bolt‘s flat to bias the bolt head to rotate counter clockwise and prevent the cam follower pin from hanging up in the cam track as the bolt fully closes.
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However, Benelli got a narrow species patent on one way of doing this versus patenting the general concept of applying a rotational force or preload to the bolt head to bias it to rotate and that opened the door for Retay to design around the Benelli patent. Sahin in the ‘542 patent added a circumferential groove and hole to the rotating bolt’s shaft. A torsion spring 30 sits in the groove with one dog leg stuck in the hole and the other riding on the cam track to bias the bolt to rotate to close.
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Both are said to completely eliminate the Benelli click. I have played with the Retay execution and was unable to get it to stick out of battery.

However never fear. If you don’t want to drop the coin on a new gun, there is an easy and inexpensive way to prevent the Benelli click while sneaking the bolt closed. On a pot hole duck sneak many, many years ago I experienced the Benelli click with my brand new H K import M1 super 90. I quickly learned that if I wanted to quietly sneak the bolt closed all I had to do was to reach into the ejection port with my index finger and apply a wee bit of rotational force to the bolt head to get it quietly into battery. And you can freely use this trick without fear of infringing either Benelli’s or Retay’s patent and your index finger is free!




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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:50 am 
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Joined: Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:02 am
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You are deeply disturbed, or a patent attorney - not mutually exclusive :)


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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 8:53 am 
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Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
:lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 10:48 am 
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You’re going to raise the ire of all the Benelli haters. They can’t rest knowing that you’re happy with your Benelli. Just wait, they’ll chime in any minute now.

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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:02 am 
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Joined: Thu Jun 14, 2018 2:17 pm
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I love this kind of post, thank you Patently Obvious. My friends have called me a Geek and I admit to it, so I like this kind of information. The founder of Geek Squad was asked how he defined the word "geek". His response was that a geek was someone who had read the manual - so, guilty as charged.
mwr01 accuses you of being a patent attorney. Given your screen name and post, he may be on to something. How, sir, do you plead?


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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:11 am 
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Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
I plead the fifth! But I have sat at more than one bar that didn’t serve drinks. :D


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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 11:22 am 
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Patently Obvious wrote:
I quickly learned that if I wanted to quietly sneak the bolt closed all I had to do was to reach into the ejection port with my index finger and apply a wee bit of rotational force to the bolt head to get it quietly into battery.


{hs#

If you've ever experienced "the click" and you didn't figure this out, it's time to trade your Benelli for a different brand. :wink:

I'm pretty new to the Benelli brand and have never experienced "the click." But I've read enough about it to have learned the solution that Patently Obvious has graciously shared.

Good shooting,
Bob (owner of eight different brands of shotguns; not a brand snob.)

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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 2:55 pm 
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Or you could do like this which I don't recommend.
https://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewto ... 8#p2428558


Thought he had a Youtube video out a couple years after the post if I remember correctly.


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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 3:43 pm 
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Joined: Sun Mar 03, 2013 11:01 am
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Man, just ordered a jumbo case of popcorn from Amazon, Prime delivery, cause I'm going to need it.
LOL.
Good Stuff P.A.

Sitting at bars that don't serve drinks, a crime if ever there were one.

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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 7:01 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 25, 2015 10:42 pm
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Patently Obvious

The fixed breech inertia design was introduced in the Sjogren design in 1908. It wasn't until much later in 1967 that the far more elegant Bruno Civolani version was designed. After being offered and rejected by several gun manufacturers the newly form division of the Benelli Brothers motorcycle company picked it up.............So Benelli DID NOT design the inertia action. They just picked up and ran with it.


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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Thu Nov 07, 2019 7:29 pm 
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The Happy Kaboomer wrote:
Patently Obvious

The fixed breech inertia design was introduced in the Sjogren design in 1908. It wasn't until much later in 1967 that the far more elegant Bruno Civolani version was designed. After being offered and rejected by several gun manufacturers the newly form division of the Benelli Brothers motorcycle company picked it up.............So Benelli DID NOT design the inertia action. They just picked up and ran with it.


That makes up for the credit Benelli didn't get with its release of the first production six-cylinder motorcycle, the "Sei". Honda released the six-cylinder CBX years later and acted like they invented the concept...

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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 6:09 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 7:19 pm
Posts: 1898
Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
I’ve been busy bird hunting so just getting back to this.

The Benelli action as invented and patented by Paolo Benelli in the 4,604,942 patent uses the principle of a floating bolt action, but has several significant differences from the Civolani action patented in the 3,447,417 patent. The floating bolt has a central bore and a z-shaped cam track. No such features in the ‘417 patent. The action uses a rotating bolt with elliptical locking lugs, a cylindrical shaft with a u-shaped notch, and a cam follower pin extending from the upper surface of the shaft. No such features in the ‘417 patent. The inertia spring is disposed in the bore of the floating bolt along with the cylindrical shaft significantly compacting the overall action such that the complete assembly can be readily removed from the gun. No such features in the ‘417 patent. As stated by Benelli in the ‘942 patent:

“The present invention relates to an improvement in bolt assembles for automatic firearms of the type with a locking bolt head and a floating bolt element with a spring interposed between them as disclosed in Italian patent no. 762,319 (Civolani). The operation of these bolt assemblies is based on the principle of kinetic recoil energy of the arm.

The solution suggested in said patent, while being one of the simplest solutions possible, requires however, a certain complex manufacture due to the presence of a nib which maintains the arm locked by resting both against the locking head bolt and abutment provided in the breech.

It is an object of the present invention to eliminate this disadvantage of the bolt assembles disclosed in Italian patent number 762,319.”

Given that Paolo Benelli was making these guns we should assume he knew what he was talking about. The Civolani patent expired in 1984 having been granted in 1967. To my knowledge no one copied this complex action. When Benelli’s patent expired it was knocked off by several companies showing it was indeed the preferred action for a floating bolt inertia gun. Retay’s patent copies it identically with the addition of the torsion spring to prevent the Benelli click.

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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Tue Nov 12, 2019 4:49 pm 
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I've always heard things click with Benelli owners.

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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 9:15 am 
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Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
We certainly are a clique ... but it’s not very hard to join. Lots of Benelli new and used to get your feet wet with.


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 Post subject: Re: Patents and the Benelli Click
PostPosted: Wed Nov 13, 2019 9:23 am 
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Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 7:19 pm
Posts: 1898
Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
Happened across a 28 gage Ethos yesterday at Cabela’s. It uses Benelli’s patented anti click mechanism and it smoothly went into battery no matter how slowly I snuck the bolt forward or tried right at the inflection point to stick it. Retay’s design is cheaper, but the torsion spring traverses in the bolt cam track as the rotary bolt head traverses back and forth so it may wear the dog leg and break eventually but would not impede basic gun function and is cheap to replace. Benelli’s design does not have the potential wear issue. Benelli should roll this down through the line to make all there guns distinct from the copied versions now that the ‘942 patent has expired.




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