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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:56 pm 
Tournament Grade
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Joined: Thu Mar 18, 2004 9:13 pm
Posts: 245
Location: Philly, PA, U.S.A.
Ammo production as like cigarette manufacturing is highly automated, very few production employees.

With the 2016 election and Hillary as the expected winner there were a few stooges who bought train loads of shell for a day with 100% price increases




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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:25 pm 
Gunsmith
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Joined: Thu Oct 11, 2007 4:46 pm
Posts: 872
Location: Commerce Michigan
Auldthymer wrote:
Tron wrote:
In a word- hoarders.

And they can’t be dissuaded.


No, they can not and they always point the finger of blame to someone else.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:39 pm 
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A couple of months ago I posted this question:

Quote:
There is not a single round of 5.56 or 9MM on any dealers shelf in my town. In fact almost all common handgun and military rifle rounds are gone. I can't even find rifle or pistol primers. Has this craziness affected sporting shot shell availability where you live? If not, how long will it be before the ammo factories start diverting resources (lead and chemicals) away from clay busting sporting shells to high demand rounds for defensive weapons?


It appears resources are being diverted to fast selling high demand products. In other words, calibers for guns that might be banned. This is exactly what caused the .22 shortage back during the "Obama panic" in 2016. Manufacturers practically dropped low profit .22 manufacture and diverted lead, brass and chemicals to higher mark up 9MM, .223 Buckshot and other high demand calibers. This temporary and artificially induced shortage caused panic buying for .22LR and it went from the lowest profit item on the ammo shelf to one of the highest.

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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:57 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:32 am
Posts: 49
I was in Cabelas, and a lone box of 30-30 was looking at me for 12.99, I slaped my paw down on that sucker so hard I thought the shelf was going to break. I don't know why but Cabela's is not the place to buy ammo. Go to local farm supply places that carry ammo, or Maw and Paw gunshops. fishing stores. They seem to have better stock and supply.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 2:01 am 
Field Grade

Joined: Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:58 pm
Posts: 97
oneounceload wrote:
saskbooknut wrote:
Remington bankruptcy will contribute to lower supply too.
Buyers of Remington will have to move to other brands, for the moment.

No, Remington ammo is owned by Vista (Federal), so no issue in that regard. The issue is Covid and shortgaes of components.
Most production is geared to handgun ammo at the moment. As for 28 and 410; those are typically run once per year.


A guy working at federal said production lines of shells and centerfire/rimfire ammo are completely different. So no, pistol ammo production is not taking over shotshell production.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 9:41 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:22 pm
Posts: 283
Location: NE South Dakota
Another reason I keep about 2 years worth of reloading supplies on hand, to get through what I call the idiot bumps.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:18 am 
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Posts: 8994
Location: Rochester, NY
Life of Riley wrote:
oneounceload wrote:
saskbooknut wrote:
Remington bankruptcy will contribute to lower supply too.
Buyers of Remington will have to move to other brands, for the moment.

No, Remington ammo is owned by Vista (Federal), so no issue in that regard. The issue is Covid and shortgaes of components.
Most production is geared to handgun ammo at the moment. As for 28 and 410; those are typically run once per year.


A guy working at federal said production lines of shells and centerfire/rimfire ammo are completely different. So no, pistol ammo production is not taking over shotshell production.


But have they transferred employees from one line to another?

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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2020 10:42 am 
Limited Edition

Joined: Sun Feb 21, 2016 5:47 pm
Posts: 321
Location: N. IL
Online I have not seen any shortages of steel shot for waterfowl hunting and prices are still good. I see that Roger's and Dunns both have lead target loads available. I can get target loads locally for $60/flat plus tax. Online $60/flat plus tax and shipping, or $80/flat plus tax and free shipping.

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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:28 am 
*Proud to be a*
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Tron wrote:
Auldthymer wrote:
Tron wrote:
In a word- hoarders.

And they can’t be dissuaded.


No, they can not and they always point the finger of blame to someone else.

When ever I want to get in on the hoarding its too late, there is nothing left. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 6:40 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:22 pm
Posts: 283
Location: NE South Dakota
I was hoping they all had filled up there storage space with toilet paper.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 7:33 am 
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Location: Just South of Indiana Gun Club!
southdakbearfan wrote:
I was hoping they all had filled up there storage space with toilet paper.



:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


cdb

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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 18, 2020 11:17 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 9:31 pm
Posts: 2433
Hoarding, panic purchases (guns and ammunition), Covid-19 restrictions and some 7 million new gun owners in stressing manufacturing and supplies.

Not a pistol shooter but understand 9mm, .45ACP, .380ACP, .32ACP, .38S&W and .22 are hard to acquire. Thinking the .40S&W is making a comeback.

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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:38 pm 
Tournament Grade
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Joined: Thu Sep 07, 2006 10:30 pm
Posts: 107
Location: Louisiana
noweil wrote:
Online I have not seen any shortages of steel shot for waterfowl hunting and prices are still good. I see that Roger's and Dunns both have lead target loads available. I can get target loads locally for $60/flat plus tax. Online $60/flat plus tax and shipping, or $80/flat plus tax and free shipping.


I beg to differ. I’m on the waiting list for my fave stuff.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Fri Nov 20, 2020 9:52 pm 
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Shotgun shells are big compared to pistol and rifle rounds. Therefore they use a lot more lead and powder. In todays panic buying lead and powder will be diverted to high demand and high profit rounds for guns that may soon be in political jeopardy. Ammo for your quaint 19th century double takes the back seat to what sells right now. People are stocking up on weapons, not fouling pieces. Ammo follows suit.

The tree of liberty....

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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 2:47 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:32 am
Posts: 49
I'm seeing more ammo on the shelf, things seem to be getting better. Gander Outdoors has a lot.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 6:45 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2007 8:36 pm
Posts: 57
Cabela's, Bass Pro and Academy in my area all have very limited stock of anything, but getting harder to find 12 ga. target loads. Gun club so far has rounds available.

Smaller LGS have been getting 9mm/5.56 sporadically, but they are selling at outrageous prices.

Some day things will normalize out, but it's no fun going through it.

JD


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 9:35 am 
Field Grade
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Joined: Fri Mar 07, 2014 2:00 pm
Posts: 54
Location: Midland, GA
I do the wholesale buying at our club. Mostly targets, reloading supplies and some shotshells. We are shotgun only.

This week our suppliers look like this:

Shotshells
Target/Light hunting loads=Some but typically only premiums like Winchester AA and Federal Gold Medal. Retail prices will be rising to the $11.00 to $14.00 a box range. No “inexpensive stuff”

Duck Stuff = appears to be plenty of steel in stock.

Components
Lead shot=yes (inventory building)
Wads=yes (warehouse looks full)
Powder=yes (selection very limited)
Primers=Hahaha! Not a single shotgun primer in stock for the past 3 months. Nothing.

Summary: oh crap!

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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Tue Nov 24, 2020 8:40 am 
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Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2005 12:52 am
Posts: 569
Location: Ohio
I am not having any problem buying 12 or 20ga promo target loads at Walmart. I did see some shortage of bird hunting loads, but that is to be expected since it's bird hunting season.

Now, I can say for sure that ammo is moving quickly in all calibers. Panic, hunting season and the huge increase in gun sales. If one is seeing regional shortages on shotgun ammo, it is likely that a lot of people bought shotguns. These folks may not be all that sophisticated in the gun owner sense and one shell is just like another. If I don't know a lot about shotguns, and I just bought one to keep the TIFA's away, that $1 a shot buck seems like less of a value than that 100 pack for $22.

I live in between 2 walmarts out here in the hinterlands where everyone was pretty well gunned up. The one closer to the major metro area had plenty of 20 but no 12. The other had both plus a lone box of 6.5 CM on the ammo shelves.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 2:32 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Sun Sep 25, 2016 12:33 pm
Posts: 159
My Walmart's shelves were completely bare of everything this morning. I bought three 4 packs of Estates last week. Not preferred shell, but it goes bang. The week before I bought 5 flats from Academy. Today I cannot find anything. I agree with the 1-2 year supply theory, but unfortunately I was a few days late. Hopefully I am good until supplies come back to normal.

Obviously posting a supply source on here would be dangerous, but if anyone wants to PM me ideas, please do.


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 Post subject: Re: why the shotgun shell shortage?
PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2020 5:31 pm 
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Location: Missouri
The ammunition shortage is caused by demand overriding supply.

The demand is caused by panic buying.

During World War Two, which was a real crisis, the government decided that all ammunition and firearms production should be reserved for the war effort, with limited exceptions.

That was a supply problem. The demand was much less, as well, because 16 million young men joined the service where they had no need for sport shooting.

But also during WW2, there was a classic panic buying of all things,,,,coffee.

People drank coffee then, only not as much per person as today. Then (and still today) the American coffee supply came from South America, mainly Brazil, with better coffee beans from Columbia.

It was hauled by specialized coffee boats that made return trips empty. A German U boat commander would hardly knowingly waste a precious torpedo on one. To shell one with a deck gun risked detection. Like coastal fishing boats they were mostly left to go about their trade.

But for whatever reason, a bored U boat captain shelled a loaded coffee boat that burned for days just off the coast, drawing the usual reporters to the scene.

Suddenly there was panic buying of coffee in all the stores, by people afraid it would be rationed.

And rationed coffee was. The government put a ration stamp for one pound every five weeks in every adult’s ration book. Trouble was that most people didn’t drink coffee back then, and those that did drank something like a pound a week on average. But suddenly everybody had the right to buy a pound can of coffee, whether they drank coffee or not, and it was only about a quarter or so a can.

The plan addicted millions of new coffee drinkers. And also resulted in pound cans of coffee stacking up in cupboards of tea drinkers because, it was in short supply, after all.

And bye and bye a wise government official required the storekeeper to open the pound can of coffee at the point of sale.

Which completely and suddenly eliminated hoarding, and rationing ended quickly after that. But to this day Americans drink more coffee, because everybody got a taste of it during WW2.

I have a paper can of Hogdon 4831 marked $1.95 I bought from David Lauer of Boonville about ten years ago. It reads 4831 IS GOVERNMENT SURPLUS POWDER STORAGE LIFE IS NOT GUARANTEED. It smells fresh and Dave said it was probably from the late 50s or early 60s, he forgot exactly how old.

I could load 30-06 with it, if I run out of my three pounds of IMR 4350 and 8 pounds of H4350, so I think I’ll keep it in reserve.

But as soon as this panic passes I’m stocking up on small pistol and small rifle primers.

People must be hoarding them.



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