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 Post subject: Re: Perazzi Copies Like 1911 Copies?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 8:43 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:26 pm
Posts: 319
Rizzini BR440 is a Perazzi clone is it not ?




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 Post subject: Re: Perazzi Copies Like 1911 Copies?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 11:53 pm 
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Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2013 8:21 pm
Posts: 653
DKW1 wrote:
Rizzini BR440 is a Perazzi clone is it not ?

Similar, but not the same. Actually, some possible advantages in the BR440 design (replaceable insert in the receiver side lugs, for one). Triggers look similar to a removable coil spring design, but a little different.

You can see pics here: http://www.rasgeleavci.com/docs/rizzini_katalog.pdf

They also tend to go for around $6500.

I wonder how well established Rizzini is in the US? That's another concern; that they'll fold up like Kemen and leave the U.S. market. It took a bit, but I think Zoli has made it over the hump and is here to stay (they've built a great reputation for service, and in my experience, well-deserved), but I think the jury is still out on Rizzini. At least if something were a *clone* of a Perazzi (not just having similar features, or a similar design), parts availability wouldn't be a problem...just like how you can always get parts for 1911s.


Last edited by mpolans on Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:15 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Perazzi Copies Like 1911 Copies?
PostPosted: Sun Jul 26, 2020 11:56 pm 
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PJR wrote:
It's not the design that makes a Perazzi a Perazzi. It's the skill of the people who make them.

I disagree. Its a smart design that's well executed that draws me to a Perazzi.

If the Perazzi factory suddenly decided to start making a clone of a Remington 1100, I'm not gonna suddenly start wanting to drop thousands on one because they're making well-finished 1100s.


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 Post subject: Re: Perazzi Copies Like 1911 Copies?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:10 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2013 8:21 pm
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Skeet_Man wrote:
mpolans wrote:
So there are tons of reputable manufacturers making 1911 copies. You can't swing a dead cat around without hitting a manufacturer who makes one (Colt, Sig, Remington, S&W, Springfield Armory, Ruger, etc, etc).

Since the patents on Perazzi MX8 and MX12 have expired, why hasn't anyone (except for Yildiz) copied the design? I'd love to see a reputable manufacturer like Remington, Ruger, etc, make an MX8 or MX12 copy, without any engraving, maybe with silver soldered barrels that won't separate and other improvements.


Never going to happen with an established mfg. Remington would sell 10k 870s for every Perazzi clone they could make, at a higher profit margin on each 870.

When you make a clone it will ALWAYS be compared to what you cloned it from. This is why the Yildiz makes basically ZERO sense, why would you buy the clone when you could buy a used version of the original for the same $? Plenty of MT6s and MX12s out there in the price range of a Yildiz if you look hard enough. Plenty more Type 3 MX8s in the price range as well.

I hadn't thought of the aspect cannibalizing sales from existing models or higher profit margins on existing models taking up capacity.
While there might be plenty of MT6s in the $2500-3500 range, I haven't seen any MX12s that low, nor any Type 4 MX8s (I'm not a big fan of Type 3 and earlier MX8s). I'd think that if a reputable company (think Beretta, Browning, or an equivalent) with a good reputation came out with a clone of an MX8 or MX12 and called it a "BX8" or "BX12" for $2500-3000, it'd sell like hotcakes. Imagine if instead of coming out with the 692, Beretta invested minimal R&D and just marketed an MX8 or MX12 clone. While it might not be great for the corporate ego, I bet a lot of folks would jump at a Beretta-made MX8 or MX12 for $2500-3500. As for why some folks might want one over a used MT6 for the same price, some folks care about warranties and just like having new guns. If the barrels were manufactured such that the side ribs were guaranteed for life not to come loose (or were made without side ribs), that would be another draw.


Last edited by mpolans on Mon Jul 27, 2020 9:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Perazzi Copies Like 1911 Copies?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 7:21 am 
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Joined: Sat Jun 07, 2003 4:35 pm
Posts: 705
mpolans wrote:
PJR wrote:
It's not the design that makes a Perazzi a Perazzi. It's the skill of the people who make them.

I disagree. Its a smart design that's well executed that draws me to a Perazzi.

If the Perazzi factory suddenly decided to start making a clone of a Remington 1100, I'm not gonna suddenly start wanting to drop thousands on one because they're making well-finished 1100s.

If the Perazzi factory started making an 1100 clone it would be superior but more expensive than those produced by Remington. The reverse is also true. If the Remington factory built an MX8 clone it would be inferior but less expensive and I wouldn't want one either.


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 Post subject: Re: Perazzi Copies Like 1911 Copies?
PostPosted: Mon Jul 27, 2020 11:22 am 
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PJR wrote:
It's not the design that makes a Perazzi a Perazzi. It's the skill of the people who make them.

This.

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 Post subject: Re: Perazzi Copies Like 1911 Copies?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 05, 2020 7:07 pm 
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Joined: Wed Jun 26, 2013 3:22 pm
Posts: 26
Perazzi is itself a copy of the Boss/Woodward action. Perazzi refined it for modern manufacture and added a removable trigger design that is unsurpassed. There is little incentive to copy a Perazzi since for over half a century there hasn't been any design or functional improvement over a custom made gun like the Perazzi. Any "enhancement" is baked in when you order the gun at no extra cost. In any copy, there must be a compromise in materials, costs, and quality to even have a shot at profitability. There's little doubt that modern 1911 copies of Browning's design, like Cabot, Nighthawk, Wilson Combat, etc. are improvements to the design. A more obvious comparison would be "why doesn't a company clone a Cabot or Nighthawk 1911?




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