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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 10:51 pm 
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Joined: Tue May 22, 2012 3:12 pm
Posts: 553
Location: Central Texas
IMHO ... the a400 bolt knob looks like a bugle chip. Perhaps some Beretta engineer had a case of munchies when he or she had an epiphany.

See the resemblance-
https://www.midwestgunworks.com/page/mgwi/prod/C76197
https://www.turbosquid.com/3d-models/po ... max/940903

For my daughters a400 it was a no brainer to switch to a Briley purple bolt knob and bolt release.

DL




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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Sat Feb 06, 2021 10:37 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 20, 2004 6:00 pm
Posts: 389
Location: Suffolk County, New York
chilled shot wrote:
I like the ergonomics of the oversized release button but DON'T use the oversized bolt handle on either hunting or sporting autos.



I agree with this assessment.


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:23 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:16 am
Posts: 181
One of the reasons I joined this site is for the humor. I have thoroughly enjoyed this thread, and have been cracking up at some of the responses lol.

I’ll put my two cents in on this conversation. I do completely agree that oversized controls are completely unnecessary for the average man. I know I have never needed them, no matter what conditions I’ve hunted in. However, I did add them to my new waterfowl shotgun, and I’m pleased. The one gripe I had with my VM Sportsman is the dinky bolt release. I could still hit it in cold weather, however it was not easy to do when my hands were really cold.

I added a Briley bolt handle because I like the design better than standard bolt handles. They are solid, rounded and smooth. Even though it sticks out a little further, it doesn’t snag my winter hunting clothes like the factory one does. My 18 year old daughter now hunts with my A300 Outlander. She doesn’t have the strength in her fingers to operate the bolt handle as it is. The bolt release is large enough for her to use her palm to close it, but it isn’t easy for her. I will order a briley charging handle for it as well. Still on the fence about the bolt release for the outlander.

I have no interest in the Tacticool mess either. I am in law enforcement and actually have to employ tactical techniques in my line of work. I don’t do it for sport. I can say that there is really no need for fiber optic pipes at the end of a shotgun for that purpose either. When tactically clearing a building, we don’t focus on sighting. It’s CQB. We are scanning for threats. We train to point our guns where we are looking. When you point a shotgun loaded with buckshot down a hallway, that whole hallway is covered without having to aim.

Our department wasted thousands of $ equipping our AR15s with Eotech optics. Talk about Tacticool. What a joke! Who’s got time to fiddle with holding buttons down to turn on the optic and adjust it in the heat of battle? Secondly, it’s not a powered optic. If a man can’t point a rifle at a target 10 yards away or less without sighting to hit the target, he doesn’t need to carry one. Iron sights are more effective than an EOTech for distant shots. I just didn’t see any practical application for it, so I removed the EOTech from my rifle and turned it back in after they were issued to us. Lol


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2021 10:45 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sat Oct 24, 2020 7:18 pm
Posts: 59
Oversize controls aren't just a benefit when shooting with gloves they can also make it much easier to close the bolt QUIETLY. There are occasions when I feel like shooting something naughty so I'll take my CZ712 to the trap range where I can spew shells all over the shooting ground. You know, the shotgun equivalent of an 8 years old jumping in mud puddles.

Anyhow the Trap ranges at my club are sound triggered, say Taxi loud enough and a clay will be sent downrange. Drop the bolt too loudly and and a clay will be sent downrange. Any time I get that 712 out I end up wishing that if was a common enough model that oversize controls were available, because at least once or twice I'll end up sending a clay downrange without wanting to by not maintaining control of the bolt.


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:57 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:33 pm
Posts: 6676
Location: Mascoutah IL
Most semi-autos don't function well when you ride the bolt closed when feeding a round. Just let it fly and if a target launches as a result so be it.


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Mon Apr 05, 2021 10:42 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:16 am
Posts: 181
DEG wrote:
Most semi-autos don't function well when you ride the bolt closed when feeding a round. Just let it fly and if a target launches as a result so be it.

That would be a great way to simulate a surprise duck flying over from behind the blind. Good practice for quick target acquisition.


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:04 am 
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Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2021 5:03 pm
Posts: 26
As these oversized controls may be a welcome addition to SOME, I think the majority of gun buyers prefer to have a stock shotgun without them. If they want to sell as an accessory to add later and "customize" their guns, so be it. Oversized controls should not be the norm in my opinion.


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2021 11:17 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:05 pm
Posts: 455
Steelie68 wrote:
As these oversized controls may be a welcome addition to SOME, I think the majority of gun buyers prefer to have a stock shotgun without them. If they want to sell as an accessory to add later and "customize" their guns, so be it. Oversized controls should not be the norm in my opinion.


I agree. I actually just "customized" my son's new A400 by removing the .50 cal charging handle it came with and replacing it with a normal sized bolt handle.


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 Post subject: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2021 12:37 pm 
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Joined: Thu May 13, 2010 4:08 pm
Posts: 2818
MNGunner wrote:
Steelie68 wrote:
As these oversized controls may be a welcome addition to SOME, I think the majority of gun buyers prefer to have a stock shotgun without them. If they want to sell as an accessory to add later and "customize" their guns, so be it. Oversized controls should not be the norm in my opinion.


I agree. I actually just "customized" my son's new A400 by removing the .50 cal charging handle it came with and replacing it with a normal sized bolt handle.


If either of you were actually selling guns to the public you would know that isn't true. Put a gun, particularly a waterfowl or sporting semi, with oversized controls out next to a gun with out them and the oversize controls gun outsells them 3 to 1.

I suspect that trend will change some day. But for now, if you were making a living selling shotguns you wouldn't be saying that.


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:09 pm 
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Joined: Mon Mar 22, 2021 5:03 pm
Posts: 26
drawdc wrote:
MNGunner wrote:
Steelie68 wrote:
As these oversized controls may be a welcome addition to SOME, I think the majority of gun buyers prefer to have a stock shotgun without them. If they want to sell as an accessory to add later and "customize" their guns, so be it. Oversized controls should not be the norm in my opinion.


I agree. I actually just "customized" my son's new A400 by removing the .50 cal charging handle it came with and replacing it with a normal sized bolt handle.


If either of you were actually selling guns to the public you would know that isn't true. Put a gun, particularly a waterfowl or sporting semi, with oversized controls out next to a gun with out them and the oversize controls gun outsells them 3 to 1.

I suspect that trend will change some day. But for now, if you were making a living selling shotguns you wouldn't be saying

As they say, you're entitled to your opinions but not you're own facts. Thats why they call this an "opinion" forum.


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:23 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:16 am
Posts: 181
manufacturers will add accessories that sell. A gun with oversize controls most likely does sell better than one without them. Consumers who don’t want them have two choices. Purchase a gun that doesn’t have them, or purchase normal size parts and instal them. It’s no different than being a consumer who wants them on a gun that doesn’t have them. I personally like the oversize controls on my waterfowl gun. My daughter wanted an oversized charging handle on the one she hunts with, so she could chamber a round without help. Kind of a minor thing to complain about imo. If you like em, get em. If you don’t want them, don’t get em. Lol


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Wed Apr 07, 2021 8:18 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2011 8:05 pm
Posts: 455
drawdc wrote:
MNGunner wrote:
Steelie68 wrote:
As these oversized controls may be a welcome addition to SOME, I think the majority of gun buyers prefer to have a stock shotgun without them. If they want to sell as an accessory to add later and "customize" their guns, so be it. Oversized controls should not be the norm in my opinion.


I agree. I actually just "customized" my son's new A400 by removing the .50 cal charging handle it came with and replacing it with a normal sized bolt handle.


If either of you were actually selling guns to the public you would know that isn't true. Put a gun, particularly a waterfowl or sporting semi, with oversized controls out next to a gun with out them and the oversize controls gun outsells them 3 to 1.

I suspect that trend will change some day. But for now, if you were making a living selling shotguns you wouldn't be saying that.


Nope I don't make my living selling guns (or actually selling anything at all). This is just my opinion of what I want on MY shotguns as a CUSTOMER not as a gun merchant.

I also think flat-billed hats, fidget-spinners, Amazon Prime memberships, whole-life-insurance and video games are stupid, but they sell a ton of them. There have been lots of stupid trends that sell over time.
This isn't a market analysis. It's an opinion thread.


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2021 6:06 am 
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Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2005 7:35 am
Posts: 80
I think the answer lies with the desire to customize, upgrade.
Seems harmless enough, low cost and reversible.

Maybe spills over from the ar world


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 Post subject: Re: Oversize controls madness
PostPosted: Tue Apr 13, 2021 7:40 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:33 pm
Posts: 6676
Location: Mascoutah IL
Steelie68 wrote:
As these oversized controls may be a welcome addition to SOME, I think the majority of gun buyers prefer to have a stock shotgun without them. If they want to sell as an accessory to add later and "customize" their guns, so be it. Oversized controls should not be the norm in my opinion.


I think it's the exact opposite. Some are annoyed by them, but the majority of gun buyers see the value in them and prefer them.




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