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 Post subject: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 10:57 am 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:10 am
Posts: 608
Location: Charlotte, NC
Would like some recommendations for a decent SxS in 12 gauge or 20 gauge, 28" bbls for "fun" sporting clays. The Browning BSS with single trigger looks interesting @ $1500 or so, particularly the ones actually assembled in Japan. Do want something in the 8lb range, so not a field gun. Model 21's are out of my price range. Thanks for your input. :D




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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 12:19 pm 
Field Grade
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Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 10:50 am
Posts: 76
I have a few nice sxs for hunting, but I'm in the same boat as you.

Looking for a sxs for the rare sxs sporting events.

I saw Dehaan on one of the auction sites earlier that was listed at $650, raised rib and screw in chokes. I should have bid on it.

The dickinson sporting models also may fit the bill, it a bit pricey for a rarely used gun.

I keep trying to find the right search terms to find all the 12 ga, with chokes and raised rib.

*also want a 12 ga pump for the same reason.

Sent from my HD1905 using Tapatalk


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 12:22 pm 
Presentation Grade
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Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:00 pm
Posts: 532
It would help if you could establish a max price for your goal. Also, would you consider a used gun and/of extractors?


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 12:30 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Wed Mar 23, 2005 8:07 pm
Posts: 45
Location: Pa
SKB makes a decent sxs for sporting clays.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 12:32 pm 
Field Grade
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Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 10:50 am
Posts: 76
goosedowner wrote:
SKB makes a decent sxs for sporting clays.
I forgot about those...

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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 12:57 pm 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:10 am
Posts: 608
Location: Charlotte, NC
Dward, I'm only looking at used guns...ejector, extractor, doesn't matter. Would prefer a selective single trigger gun. Px? $2000 +/-. Condition is important...no rust or pitting. "Honest" wear ok. Looking for a shooter, not a collector.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 4:50 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Tue Jul 31, 2018 5:32 pm
Posts: 50
SKB 200HR is great for sporting clays. However without the ability to select the barrels, it’s not very convenient. Those are not made anymore but SKB will be coming out with a new version to compete with Dickinson that has a barrel selector but the price is over 3K from what I hear.

Nothing like the feeling of crushing a true pair in sporting with a SxS.

Good luck in your search.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 6:11 pm 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*

Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2011 3:09 pm
Posts: 639
Location: Massachusetts
I use a 12 gauge BC Miroku with double triggers and, 30" barrels (Japanese Browning BSS). I had it threaded for screw in chokes by Mike Orlen. I cut in an adjustable comb, and installed a Graco adjustable butt plate. It can fit everybody, and everybody likes to try it out. Good shooters shoot it good.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 03, 2021 11:11 pm 
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Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:00 pm
Posts: 532
rmiddlemas wrote:
Dward, I'm only looking at used guns...ejector, extractor, doesn't matter. Would prefer a selective single trigger gun. Px? $2000 +/-. Condition is important...no rust or pitting. "Honest" wear ok. Looking for a shooter, not a collector.


I think you can find a lot of good, used, high quality doubles in your price range. The biggest limitation is a selective single trigger. If you can live with double triggers you can find a lot of English and European guns. 12 gauge guns are cheaper than 20s and boxloks the most economical. Vintage Doubles in WA and Hill Rod and Gun in MT are good sources as well as Guns International.

If you are not aware check chamber length on English guns. Many are 2 1/2 inch. American doubles frequently have more drop than E and E guns.

I just looked. Right now GI is showing 787 English doubles and 1117 American doubles listed. Not all of them in your price range, but enough to get tired looking.

Since you mentioned weight, English and European guns tend to be lighter in weight than American guns.

Good luck with your selection. Have fun shopping. There are a lot of guns out there to look at.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:28 am 
Presentation Grade
User avatar

Joined: Sat Aug 01, 2020 11:50 pm
Posts: 575
Location: The wilds of rural central California
I found my 12 gauge Browning BSS on Guns International a few months ago.
In great shape, single selective trigger, manual safety and a full set of Colonial Thinwall interchangeable chokes.
Shooting SC with it is great fun. Gets quite a bit of attention from others too.
The best thing is I can actually do very well with it! It was well within your price range too.

tp

_________________
RM, NRA/USCCA RSO, NSSF, and a bunch of other acronyms.
12/30" Browning Citori CX White
12/28" 1978 Browning BSS
12/26" Franchi Affinity 3
12/26" ATI Cavalry (waiting >3 months now for a frikkin' firing pin)


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2021 9:46 am 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2007 2:36 pm
Posts: 1658
Location: Northeast Ohio
CZ sells a 12 ga. target model Sharp-tail. It checks all the boxes for a SxS competition gun. 30 inch barrels, single selective trigger, choke tubes.

If you like the way they feel, the redesigned Sharptail can be real sleepers. Great warranty and customer service. Current production, so no issue with parts or support. I chose a 20 ga. Sharptail. But for pure target use, the 12 ga. Target model was set up better, especially the 30 inch barrels. The 20 ga. only comes in 28 inch and no Target version. If you do end up considering a Sharptail, feel free to pm me for my phone number. I had a long talk with Mark Dehaan about it before I bought mine. It would be very helpful to consider what he had to say.



I'm not into SxS competitions any longer, but I was for quite awhile, especially with that great group of guys, Buckeye Vintagers. I've seen or shot a myriad of SxS guns of just about every style, and many, many, brands and price range. I have owned and hunted with various configurations. Including several mentioned in this thread and more.

There are lots of very good, enjoyable, guns available within your price range.

Good luck and let us know what you end up with.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2021 12:16 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 01, 2019 10:17 pm
Posts: 285
Location: Trinidad, CO
Grouse Gunner wrote:
CZ sells a 12 ga. target model Sharp-tail. It checks all the boxes for a SxS competition gun. 30 inch barrels, single selective trigger, choke tubes.

If you like the way they feel, the redesigned Sharptail can be real sleepers. Great warranty and customer service. Current production, so no issue with parts or support. I chose a 20 ga. Sharptail. But for pure target use, the 12 ga. Target model was set up better, especially the 30 inch barrels. The 20 ga. only comes in 28 inch and no Target version. If you do end up considering a Sharptail, feel free to pm me for my phone number. I had a long talk with Mark Dehaan about it before I bought mine. It would be very helpful to consider what he had to say.



I'm not into SxS competitions any longer, but I was for quite awhile, especially with that great group of guys, Buckeye Vintagers. I've seen or shot a myriad of SxS guns of just about every style, and many, many, brands and price range. I have owned and hunted with various configurations. Including several mentioned in this thread and more.

There are lots of very good, enjoyable, guns available within your price range.

Good luck and let us know what you end up with.

**********************************************************************
I concur with the above. I will say that initially I had problems with my Sharptail but CZ paid for shipping and fixed it right up. It is a very fun gun. I did add a bit of weight to the butt to make it more balanced for me. I also purchased Mueller chokes (Beretta Mobil). It is an extractor only gun but I have learned to deal with that.

s/f Steve


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2021 12:39 pm 
Field Grade
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 12, 2020 10:50 am
Posts: 76
Your post has me thinking about my plan more and more to pick up a SxS and a Pump just for sporting clays. The responses here keep my doing searches, and CZ sounds like a good option.

While searching, I picked up those "Not CZ" versions. I know I read about them here before. For the cost, I think I've spent more on Choke tubes. My search URL is here https://www.gunbroker.com/Side-By-Side-Shotguns/search?Keywords=12&PageSize=24&Sort=13&View=1&Ch-manufacturerName=CZ-USA


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 04, 2021 1:18 pm 
Limited Edition

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:26 pm
Posts: 378
Gunsite Guy wrote:
Grouse Gunner wrote:
CZ sells a 12 ga. target model Sharp-tail. It checks all the boxes for a SxS competition gun. 30 inch barrels, single selective trigger, choke tubes.

If you like the way they feel, the redesigned Sharptail can be real sleepers. Great warranty and customer service. Current production, so no issue with parts or support. I chose a 20 ga. Sharptail. But for pure target use, the 12 ga. Target model was set up better, especially the 30 inch barrels. The 20 ga. only comes in 28 inch and no Target version. If you do end up considering a Sharptail, feel free to pm me for my phone number. I had a long talk with Mark Dehaan about it before I bought mine. It would be very helpful to consider what he had to say.



I'm not into SxS competitions any longer, but I was for quite awhile, especially with that great group of guys, Buckeye Vintagers. I've seen or shot a myriad of SxS guns of just about every style, and many, many, brands and price range. I have owned and hunted with various configurations. Including several mentioned in this thread and more.

There are lots of very good, enjoyable, guns available within your price range.

Good luck and let us know what you end up with.

**********************************************************************
I concur with the above. I will say that initially I had problems with my Sharptail but CZ paid for shipping and fixed it right up. It is a very fun gun. I did add a bit of weight to the butt to make it more balanced for me. I also purchased Mueller chokes (Beretta Mobil). It is an extractor only gun but I have learned to deal with that.

s/f Steve


I added a 1 1/8” Kickeez to my BSS. Addressed the short LOP and it now balances on the hinge pin. It really improved the feel and handling on the very barrel heavy gun.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2021 1:17 pm 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Sun Jul 31, 2011 10:10 am
Posts: 608
Location: Charlotte, NC
Thanks all for the responses. While I'm looking at SxS as a "traditional" shotgun, the comments on the CZ are interesting and will check them out. Would love to handle one, but COVID has me grounded as my state (NC), and my location in particular, is spiking.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2021 1:47 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:12 am
Posts: 5714
CZ has a horrid trigger pull. I would look for a Japanese built older SKB SS.


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2021 2:13 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Thu Mar 16, 2017 1:45 pm
Posts: 64
Location: Oswego, ks
I can also second the nomination for the CZ Sharptail! I have the forerunner, the Ringneck in 16ga and I have shot a lot of sporting clays with it and when I do my part it wins for me. If I were buying a sxs gun for sporting I would definitely go for the Target model Sparptail.
As far as the claim about bad triggers, I have never seen the single trigger models to have a problem. My G2 Bobwhite 28ga had a stiff front trigger when I first got it but it didn't take long to smooth out or you can have CZ repair it as warranty work which is also excellent.

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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2021 10:58 am 
Limited Edition

Joined: Mon Feb 15, 2010 6:04 am
Posts: 437
Another vote for the Browning SxS. Also you might want to consider the Winchester 23 , I have one that I use for a field gun and it’s built like a tank. Swings great !


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2021 4:55 pm 
Limited Edition
User avatar

Joined: Tue Apr 25, 2006 1:46 pm
Posts: 492
Location: MN.
It is somewhat a shallow pool if you end up shooting a lot of clays. The BSS works if it fits you, they do not me. And don't feel right to me either.

Non selective triggers is not a big deal. Screw in a pair of bore matched .015 or .020 and just shoot the damn gun. Don't overthink it :-) I had the same concern now I am thankful for them, it is one less thing to think about. Not like those shooting a semi or pump have to select which choke in which bbl. to use and they seem to do OK....

Winchester 23 is a good choice I went with a 20 ga. and 28" bbls. then had Briley install thinwalls. I shoot it lights out.

Image

The day before the Great Northern Shoot at the all you can shoot for $100 buffet I put 400 rounds through it. Then the selective trigger went down on me. Got it fixed the next week for $120 but hate having any gun go down on me.

In 12 ga. the 30" Winchester 23 handles much better than the 28" but they only made that in a Heavy Duck and only made 500 of them. Came close but ended up going a different route in 12 ga.

Have a CZ Sharptail 16 ga. got it for clays it is a pound heavier than most 16 ga. guns which is good for clays. Punctured primers out of the gate and as mentioned warranty is good they took care of it. Warranty is only 5 years though after that pretty much throw them away and get a new one. I am not trigger sensitive and might have been able to live with the heavy pull. But the creep on it was outrageous and drove me up the wall. So had a local smith take care of it and he did a good job.

Fixed chokes and supposed to be IC and Mod. But measures .001 and .011. You would be surprised how far out you can break a clay with .001! Not every time though and I got it for clays. CZ told me sorry Charlie you are stuck with it. Not sure I want to install tubes or not likely just send it down the road. Have a hard time warming up to the gun at this point.

Few years back a pro shooter from CZ showed up at the Duluth Double Gun shoot with a CZ Sharptail target and cleaned house. More than a few of us wonder how many CZ guns he carries with him as backups but general thought is more than 1 identical backup. The Sharptail target has extended choke tubes and after he showed up you can no longer use extended choke tubes at the DDG shoot. Because no one should ever have to look at extended choke tubes sticking out the end of a SxS :-)

As mentioned AKUS is releasing the selective trigger sometime this year. And choke tubes will finally have slots in them they will no longer be Teauge style tubes. That applies across the board to both Dickinson and SKB they are made by AKUS and same internals. SKB for the new design sent forends from a 12 ga. and 20 ga. Winchester 21 for them to duplicate. With SKB you get what they order. With Dickinson you can custom order anything they make and Pacific Sporting Arms will work with you to get anything you want.

Pacific Sporting Arms has been great to deal with on my Dickinson Plantation Sporters. For the 12 ga. went with 32" bbls. and had an adjustable comb cut and an ISIS recoil reducer installed. If I am shooting a 12 I am shooting full payload.

Image

I shoot a lot of clays. And hardly shoot my other guns anymore I use SxS guns for pretty much everything all the time. At least half a dozen of my friends that I shoot with pretty much only shoot SxS guns anymore also.

I like my 12 Dickinson so much I ended up getting a 20 ga. with 30" bbls. and shoot it a lot more than the Winchester 23 now when shooting the 20.

Image

Next up will be a 32" Plantation Sporter 16 ga. The Sharptail most likely will be going down the road.

I own a lot of pump guns mainly Ithaca 37's that is what I grew up with. Not even sure how many I have now LOL but do know most of them are 16 ga. and a few 12's. My gun for trombone gun events is a 28" 37 RVD in 16 ga. that I had Briley install tubes in.

Image


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 Post subject: Re: S X S Recommendation for Sporting?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 19, 2021 9:34 pm 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2008 4:23 pm
Posts: 507
Location: Upper Midwest
Lots of good advice offered here. I've shot a lot of rounds through SXS shotguns. A lot. I mean way more than anyone I know. Every older American and European SXS I've owned has broken. Some several times including the only RBL I've owned. I now shoot a pair of Browning BSS guns - a 30" 12 gauge and a 28" 20 gauge. Mine have the original tight fixed chokes of modified/full and nonselective triggers. I just put two shells in and holler pull. There is not a more reliable SXS on the planet than a BSS. They are wonderful pieces of engineering with outstanding build quality. They are not light and lithe game guns, that's for sure. If you want an excellent and reliable SXS for target shooting get a BSS. No BS.
Jeff




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