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 Post subject: Warning - Double Check Optima Choke Fitment BEFORE Shooting
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 1:33 am 
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Rough day... I shot 1 round with each of my brand new barrels in my 682 Gold E combo today just to check fitment and whatnot. I went to clean up and noticed my unsingle didn't have a choke and now has a nice bulge... Not sure what I did wrong here. I hand tightened with the wrench and only shot 27 shells through it. Never had a choke tube do this before. Not a fun lesson on my brand new gun...

This is a 34" unsingle with adjustable rib. Is this something that is repairable?

Image




Last edited by bbludau34 on Sat Jan 23, 2021 3:55 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 2:17 am 
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I'm guessing the choke loosened up at some point within those 27 rounds and was then shot out of the barrel. Unfortunately, the barrel is probably toast. With some O/U barrels, I've heard of folks cutting the barrels back and rethreading with thinwall chokes. It'd be a lot more work and probably not worth the expense to turn a 34" adjustable rib unsingle into a less desirable 30-31" unsingle.


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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 8:27 am 
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Why can't you take it to a gun smith and get the choke tube threads repaired and install a choke? The choke would cover the bulge as I see it. Or turn it into a 33" unsingle.
I would post this in Shotgun Gunsmithing & Restoration forum too.

Steve

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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 9:35 am 
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I would find a new/used barrel and replace the original. About $1600.00, easy to find.

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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 9:37 am 
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"Brand new barrels"? Maybe send it to Beretta and see what they say. A choke ought not to do that. I can not see that you did anything wrong unless you were shooting steel shot or something? Or used the wrong series choke? (even that would be Berettas problem ) That is a pretty expensive barrel. I would start with Beretta.


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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 9:43 am 
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Send it to Rich Cole and he will explain to you your options

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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 9:51 am 
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Wow, that must have really hurt to have that happen on a new to you gun!
Sorry to hear that.

Check with Briley's about cutting the barrel and re-threading the choke.
A friend of mine had the same thing happen on one of his Guerini's and Briley repaired it.
His shotgun did not have an adjustable rib so it was a much easier fix.


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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 10:05 am 
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bbludau34 wrote:
Rough day... I shot 1 round with each of my brand new barrels in my 682 Gold E combo today just to check fitment and whatnot. I went to clean up and noticed my unsingle didn't have a choke and now has a nice bulge... Not sure what I did wrong here. I hand tightened with the wrench and only shot 27 shells through it. Never had a choke tube do this before. Not a fun lesson on my brand new gun...

This is a 34" unsingle with adjustable rib. Is this something that is repairable?

Image


Need a bit more information here. You say it is "brand new barrels in my 682 Gold E combo." I don't see that gun in the current Beretta online catalog. In fact, my memory seems to tell me that that gun hasn't been made in several years. So, are these just new barrels for your older gun, or is the whole thing new, or what??? Need some 'splaining please.

Second, and this is somewhat related to the first question, Beretta changes choke tube systems more often than some shooters change their underwear, so would you please explain what choke tube was used in this barrel and are you certain that this is the correct tube for this barrel? Also, did the tube come with the barrel or is it one you had on hand?

Another picture or two might provide more clues, but it just seems to me from the one picture that the bulges are in an odd place. Usually the bulge is a couple inches back from the muzzle, but in your pic it appears to be bulge is almost right at the muzzle. Perhaps this is due to thread location of that particular choke tube... whatever that may be.

Also, when a barrel is bulged in or near the choke tube area, one of the prime suspects is a flared skirt. Did you check the fitment of the choke tube in the barrel before shooting it? I ALWAYS check a new choke tube with a "feeler" wire to make sure that the skirt is not protruding into the bore before shooting it.

So, a little more info on these type details might tell us if you had the correct choke in the barrel and whether the choke may have been defective, and whether any responsibility might lie with the manufacturer, a previous owner (if any), or with the user for perhaps not installing the choke correctly, using the wrong type shot, not making sure the choke is tight, etc. etc. etc. Thanks.

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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 10:05 am 
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The only way this barrel would bulge is by restriction. A little snow or mud in the tube, a wad stuck at the tube, a bridge, whatever. The barrel cant be swaged with the rib mount attached to the barrel, but it could be removed and attached again after swaging, thereto cutting the threads again for tubes.

Cut the barrel, replace the 34" rib with a 32", cut new choke threads.

Or >>>>> order a new barrel and be up and shooting in a few weeks, not months. Hopefully the gun is a combo set and the O/U barrels will work fine and keep you in the game.

Maltz

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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 10:17 am 
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New Beretta barrels are not generally drop in fits, although it is possible. That’s why you need to send it to Cole’s

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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 10:52 am 
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By new, I meant new to me. I just bought this set from a shooting buddy of my FIL. It came with 3 Optima extended (factory kit from Beretta with the 682 Gold E pkg) a set of 5 of these Optima -HP tubes, and an additional Full that looked identical to these for the unsingle. I installed the choke seconds before shooting my 1st round of trap, and ended up like this.

Both barrel sets are marked "Optima Bore" I'm guessing the HP Choke is what did it? They were included when I purchased the gun, so it never crossed my mind they would be the wrong tubes.

Image

I believe the unsingle I have here is a set that was matched at Joel Etchen's shop. It has a beretta serial # and then the gun's serial was added when matched. Does that sound right?


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 Post subject: Re: Solved - Thank You
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 2:11 pm 
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https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/how-to ... hoke-tube/


Quote:
The start of the threaded portion of the Optima-Choke-HP 12 gauge tube is located a nominal 40 mm (1.57 inch) from the breech end of the choke tube.

The length of the threaded portion is a nominal 19 mm (.748 inch).

The major diameter of the choke tube thread is 20 mm (.787 inch).


Quote:
The start of the threaded portion of the Optima-Choke tube is located a nominal 50.78 mm (2.00 inch) from the breech end of the choke tube.

The length of the threaded portion is a nominal 15.9 mm (.625 inch).

The major diameter of the choke tube thread is 20 mm (.787 inch).


Based on the above info, it looks like the Optima HP chokes are about 1.57" + 0.748" = 2.32" in length and 0.787" in diameter.

The Optima chokes are about 2.00" + 0.625" = 2.62" in length and the same 0.787" in diameter.

Therefore the Optima HP chokes are about 2.62" - 2.32" = 0.30" SHORTER in overall length than the Optima chokes and the same diameter. So, it appears that the HP chokes should be able to screw into the regular Optima barrel with room to spare provided the thread pitch is nearly the same.

This sounds like a dangerous situation because if the HP chokes screw into the regular Optima barrel (and apparently they do), then you're going to have about 0.30" of gap between the choke ledge in the barrel and the beginning of the skirt of the HP choke. This is a perfect recipe for launching the choke tube down range and possibly bulging the barrel which is apparently what happened.

It's too bad that the OP didn't check this out further before using the wrong choke tube, but I think it is a darn poor design on Beretta's part to make the HP choke so similar in size that it will screw easily into the regular Optima barrel.

Other shooters who have Beretta guns with the Optima barrels should be aware of this situation and be very cautious about mixing up choke tubes. If you have a Optima HP barrel, then it appears that the regular Optima choke would screw into it, but would have about 0.30" of threads sticking out of the barrel.

These are just my observations based on the above data from the Beretta website. I haven't actually tried this with these chokes because I don't have any of them or barrels threaded for them. All of my Beretta guns have the Mobilchoke barrels and chokes.

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 Post subject: Re: Solved - Thank You
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 4:04 pm 
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Ulysses wrote:
https://www.berettausa.com/en-us/how-to-choose-the-right-choke-tube/

It's too bad that the OP didn't check this out further before using the wrong choke tube, but I think it is a darn poor design on Beretta's part to make the HP choke so similar in size that it will screw easily into the regular Optima barrel.

Other shooters who have Beretta guns with the Optima barrels should be aware of this situation and be very cautious about mixing up choke tubes. If you have a Optima HP barrel, then it appears that the regular Optima choke would screw into it, but would have about 0.30" of threads sticking out of the barrel.



This is basically what happened. Both barrel sets are Optima and the guy I bought it from had included a set of 4 chokes and an additional full for the unsingle. Unfortunately they were all Optima HP, rather than Optima, and I blindly trusted the package I bought instead of double checking. I had only ever owned a 391 automatic from Beretta before buying this o/u combo, and honestly didn't realize Beretta had so many choke lines to keep track of. (Expensive) lesson learned.

Barrel is on it's way to Briley for diagnosis.

On a completely separate note, I happen know a guy with a set of Optima HP choke tubes looking for a new home if anyone needs a set.

Image

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Warning - Double Check Optima Choke Fitment BEFORE Shoot
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 7:01 pm 
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Never heard much about this with older regular optima and mobile choke guns. Never got why beretta named 3 different chokes optima in a relatively short interval.


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 Post subject: Re: Warning - Double Check Optima Choke Fitment BEFORE Shoot
PostPosted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 8:56 pm 
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This is an interesting post for me. I just picked up a 682 Gold E two days ago and wanted to order some new chokes for it. I have a wide selection of Mobile chokes and Optima HP chokes, of course this gun had to be different. Oh well, I'm glad I took it apart before I ordered my new chokes yesterday.

As for the OP, I'm sorry this happened but mentioning it does serve as a reminder to others. thank you


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 Post subject: Re: What Kind of Damage Did I Do?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 2:51 am 
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bbludau34 wrote:
By new, I meant new to me. I just bought this set from a shooting buddy of my FIL. It came with 3 Optima extended (factory kit from Beretta with the 682 Gold E pkg) a set of 5 of these Optima -HP tubes, and an additional Full that looked identical to these for the unsingle. I installed the choke seconds before shooting my 1st round of trap, and ended up like this.

Both barrel sets are marked "Optima Bore" I'm guessing the HP Choke is what did it? They were included when I purchased the gun, so it never crossed my mind they would be the wrong tubes.

Image

I believe the unsingle I have here is a set that was matched at Joel Etchen's shop. It has a beretta serial # and then the gun's serial was added when matched. Does that sound right?


I think we've found our problem. Optima HP chokes won't fully seat in the barrel. A wad caught the lip of the choke and probably ripped it out of the gun.


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 Post subject: Re: Warning - Double Check Optima Choke Fitment BEFORE Shoot
PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 4:51 pm 
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Another reason I prefer fixed chokes. I feel your pain by blowing up your barrel. That’s crazy that Beretta has so many choke tube styles. Yours was an easy mistake to make.


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 Post subject: Re: Warning - Double Check Optima Choke Fitment BEFORE Shoot
PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 9:30 pm 
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winmod21 wrote:
Another reason I prefer fixed chokes. I feel your pain by blowing up your barrel. That’s crazy that Beretta has so many choke tube styles. Yours was an easy mistake to make.

The problem isn't so much the many choke styles as it is Beretta's stupidity in naming several of them so similarly: Optima, Optima Plus, and Optima HP.


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 Post subject: Re: Warning - Double Check Optima Choke Fitment BEFORE Shoot
PostPosted: Tue Jan 26, 2021 1:28 pm 
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From the Beretta support page.

Important Note: The Optima-Choke HP choke tubes are not interchangeable nor usable with barrels designed for the Optima-Choke system. Use of Optima-Choke HP choke tubes in barrels designed for use with Optima-Choke Tubes may result in catastrophic damage to your barrel and personal injury or death to the shooter or persons in the immediate vicinity!


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 Post subject: Re: Warning - Double Check Optima Choke Fitment BEFORE Shoot
PostPosted: Wed Jan 27, 2021 12:06 pm 
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I never understood why Beretta had to have 3 different chokes.



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