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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Mon Dec 21, 2020 12:59 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:22 pm
Posts: 354
Location: NE South Dakota
Having worked my inlaws pheasant hunting operation for over 10 years almost every weekend of the season. The biggest problem we had was guys with open chokes and way to light of ammo. They released zero birds, granted they pulled in pen raised birds released on adjacent land, but they killed on average over 3000 per season. We were always chasing wounded birds because of that stuff. One particular group it was so bad the father in law took all their ammo and gave them sufficient ammo free for a day and instructed them to either put in their full or modified chokes. Magically we had minimal wounded pheasants to chase that day.

I also didn't really like hunting with the guys that were adamant about I/C chokes because they were always super quick to shoot, often not making sure they had a clear shooting window and then impatient while we worked the dogs finding their wounded birds. Most were decent shots, but they spent the majority of their time hunting at clubs where they paid for x amount of birds to be released into the field right before they went out.

They pulled the plug about 7 years ago and sold it off, but I still hunt there an other places most of the year. I can definitely tell the biggest difference now is that almost everyone is releasing birds, due to the lack of wild ones in most places east of the river, and they get up close. Even hunting public lands close to my house I check the birds over and about 75 percent have a clipped toe.




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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 23, 2020 11:40 pm 
Shotgun Expert
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Posts: 27050
Location: Plainfield, IL
EricB wrote:
RandyWakeman wrote:
StinkeyPete wrote:
I am trying the No.5 Fiocci Golden Pheasant 1 3/8 oz 1485 fps in the new gun (L4s).


That is a pathetically poor shell: one of the worst I've ever patterned. Use Winchester Rooster XR 1-1/4 oz. #5 or Remington Nitro Pheasant 1-1/4 #5 and prepare to be amazed.


Funny you say that! I have a box of those that I bought because I like the package and wanted it on my shelf with other upland memorabilia. No intention of using the shells.


For several years, the Fiocchi 1485 fps 1-3/8 oz. loads were gag gifts, likely the ugly tie that gets given to some 'lucky" friend every year. It always has been a miserable load.

Olin-Winchester now loads the same thing (1485 fps 1-3/8 oz.) as one of the "Browning BXD" loads. :roll:

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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 24, 2020 5:47 am 
Diamond Grade
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Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 7:19 pm
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Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
southdakbearfan wrote:
Having worked my inlaws pheasant hunting operation for over 10 years almost every weekend of the season. The biggest problem we had was guys with open chokes and way to light of ammo. They released zero birds, granted they pulled in pen raised birds released on adjacent land, but they killed on average over 3000 per season. We were always chasing wounded birds because of that stuff. One particular group it was so bad the father in law took all their ammo and gave them sufficient ammo free for a day and instructed them to either put in their full or modified chokes. Magically we had minimal wounded pheasants to chase that day.

I also didn't really like hunting with the guys that were adamant about I/C chokes because they were always super quick to shoot, often not making sure they had a clear shooting window and then impatient while we worked the dogs finding their wounded birds. Most were decent shots, but they spent the majority of their time hunting at clubs where they paid for x amount of birds to be released into the field right before they went out.

They pulled the plug about 7 years ago and sold it off, but I still hunt there an other places most of the year. I can definitely tell the biggest difference now is that almost everyone is releasing birds, due to the lack of wild ones in most places east of the river, and they get up close. Even hunting public lands close to my house I check the birds over and about 75 percent have a clipped toe.



I’ve often wondered how many pen raised birds from Wisconsin are included in South Dakota’s harvest numbers every year.

Also never understood why people treat pheasant like shooting grouse, but then think ducks are super hard to kill.


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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Sat Dec 26, 2020 5:13 pm 
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Joined: Fri Sep 21, 2007 3:18 pm
Posts: 11294
Location: Mechanicsville IA
Cylinder should work over a good pointer in a double barrel.
I have stepped off enough dead birds, yes I have measured my stride and considered the average, that most are within twenty yards, wild or preserve.
I have also blown up late season frigid wild birds, that held tight, with a light modified choke.
Felt that a tight choke too often causes a cripple by hitting the bird with the edge instead of the center of a pattern.
I grew up with the idea that a full choke was needed for pheasants which may have been true for groups walking cornfields but I have changed my mind.
After finally learning how to shoot properly and judging distances a modified or improved modified is certainly more than sufficient enough for the second barrel more often than not. Over a point I tend to shoot quickly when the bird is still rising.
Pheasants prove the conventional wisdom of smart people wrong often enough.
SK1 and SK2 with a swift load of #7 1/2s over a good pointer may be the best compromise.

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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Wed Dec 30, 2020 5:59 pm 
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Location: Endless Mountains of PA
VictorGK,

I agree with you especially when using a 12 gauge double gun, and having a good bird dog to set the bird up for gunning. However growing up most of the 12 gauge double guns we used for Pheasant hunting were in fact choked F/F or M/F. I do have a nice Silver Breech 16 gauge L.C. Smith double gun, choked IC & M for Grouse hunting, I have killed a lot of Pheasants both wild and pen raised with that 16 gauge double gun with the more open chokes. This all comes back to the type of shells being used also. Using #6's and #5's even with the more open choked guns, these shells are deadly Pheasant killers.

Pine Creek/Dave
L.C. Smith Man

Couple of my most favorite Pheasant guns. Both used in my Grandfather era for shooting in Pigeon Shooting contests.

12 gauge #5 L.C. Smith with 30" Barrels and Hunter one trigger, choked F/F
Image


L.C. Smith 12 Gauge Pigeon Gun with 30" Barrels and DT, Choked F/F
Image

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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:57 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 05, 2021 10:24 pm
Posts: 4
Having shot the crossing shots not so great over, like, 15 years of skeet shooting, I would really question the ability of most people, not well experienced and pretty good shots, to actually be able to get the lead right that would be at the ranges that a 1 1/4 oz. load of #5's that wouldn't hit a pheasent several times.
Just like if you can't figure the drop of a bullet over a long range rifle shot.

Modified, I found against my early, young pre-disposions, was fairly tight for what I was doing. Putting that many pellets into a circle of a decent diameter is pretty far away. (I didn't say that well.) Because you can't make those long shots means you shouldn't take them.
I'm speaking of my perspective, offering it up for consideration. I'm sure many people may disagree.


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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2021 4:32 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 09, 2019 1:03 pm
Posts: 6
Location: Central South Dakota
Patently Obvious wrote:


I’ve often wondered how many pen raised birds from Wisconsin are included in South Dakota’s harvest numbers every year.

Also never understood why people treat pheasant like shooting grouse, but then think ducks are super hard to kill.


Very few from Wisconsin, if any at all. Most all of them are raised right here.

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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 07, 2021 9:09 pm 
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Joined: Mon May 27, 2013 7:19 pm
Posts: 1942
Location: Indian Head Country Wisconsin
Are u sure? Where do you think the chicks come from? Wisconsin has several large pheasant producers.

https://www.pheasant.com/

“MacFarlane Pheasants, Inc has been in the game bird business since 1929 and has grown to be the largest pheasant producer in North America. Our years of experience not only helps us in our work to produce and raise the best birds on the market, it also allows us to supply our customers with the best service after sale.

We maintain our own breeding flocks of pheasants, and in 2018 we produced 1.8 million day old pheasant chicks. We ship day old pheasants throughout the U.S. and Canada, exporting to Europe and the Middle East as well.”


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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Fri Jan 08, 2021 10:21 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 27, 2019 7:22 pm
Posts: 354
Location: NE South Dakota
Gisi farms produces the vast majority in South Dakota.


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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:18 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 09, 2019 1:03 pm
Posts: 6
Location: Central South Dakota
I am in the know and have been advised that Gisi produced more than one million adult roosters in 2019. Yes, I am sure.

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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:21 pm 
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Joined: Sun Feb 21, 2016 5:47 pm
Posts: 410
Location: N. IL
Looking back at over 50 years of pheasant hunting I can recall 2 guys shooting cylinder barrels. A friend of my dad's brought an Ithaca Deer Slayer with a smooth bore slug barrel one time and sailed a pheasant out into an alfalfa field that we could not find with a great dog. My dad always talked about that being the only pheasant that was ever knocked down and not recovered hunting with that dog. Years later I pheasant hunted with a guy on property his family farmed. He showed up with a 20 ga coach gun. He could hit birds with it, but someone else had to knock every one of them down.

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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:32 pm 
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Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:50 pm
Posts: 2570
Location: SE Ohio...where ruffed grouse were
My 12 gauge Deerslayer measured IC...shot well with Remington slugs, they did not do quite as much bouncing down the barrel as Winchester or Federal.


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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:41 pm 
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Joined: Sun Feb 21, 2016 5:47 pm
Posts: 410
Location: N. IL
Multiflora wrote:
My 12 gauge Deerslayer measured IC...shot well with Remington slugs, they did not do quite as much bouncing down the barrel as Winchester or Federal.


Multiflora, Deer Slayers had an undersized bore but they had no choke constriction in the end of the barrel. They are a cylinder choke if you put bird shot thru them. They were about the most accurate smooth bore slug guns of their day.

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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:51 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Tue Dec 27, 2011 5:50 pm
Posts: 2570
Location: SE Ohio...where ruffed grouse were
Yes, I know....I also know what the Baker bore gauge indicated.
I was surprised.

I do agree about the accuracy, once Ohio only allowed punkinballs, meaning Foster slugs.


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 Post subject: Re: Cylinder choke for pheasant?
PostPosted: Sun Jan 24, 2021 1:10 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:36 pm
Posts: 1009
Location: Endless Mountains of PA
Sylvianeous69,

What you say is definitely true, until a sportsman become more experienced with his double gun, using the F/F choked gun can be a problem when Pheasant hunting. However to alleviate some of the problems RST and Poly have made some real nice #6 shells that I use myself, in my L.C. Smith #5 gun.

Granted I am an experience bird gunner, however the patterns with these RST & Poly shells make it easier to gun wild birds from between 28 - 38 yards, with the full choked guns. The patterns from these shells out of the Classic American and German Best double guns are real Pheasant killers. In fact sense I have been using them, I have not had to shoot at a Pheasant more than one time, the pattern is that good coming out of my L.C. Smith #5 gun.

I do have some good dogs that set the birds up pretty darn well for my gunning, however I give a lot of the credit for downing these Pheasants to the RST and Poly shells, they make the old L.C. Smith gun throw patterns like the old slow burning powders did, and the patterns that develop are just fantastic. Now understand each gun is going to be a might different, however in my guns these shells work real well, especially when Pheasant hunting with F/F chokes.

all the best

Pine Creek/Dave
L.C. Smith Man

This L.C. Smith #5 gun with 30" Barrels was made to order for Mr Kraus's live bird shooting, and it really destroys Pheasants with the RST & Poly shells.
Image



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