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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 3:39 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2005 9:22 am
Posts: 4360
Location: East Mountains, NM
Scotty, didn't #18 show up in an auction of stuff that belonged to Remington? I thought I saw that here.




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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 3:51 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2007 7:03 pm
Posts: 1157
Location: DFW, TEXAS
Remington had #44; I called the auction house and got the "Sold for" price quote.

There was a gun somewhere that seems to have been #18, but I don't think it was a Super. Initially I thought it might have been a 20 gauge Super, but I think they started at around #220 and went up from there, give or take. According to Glen Jensen, in 12 gauge, only #19 and #22 were "Browning" guns sold in the US before the Remington #44 serial number.

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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2015 3:58 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Mon Oct 31, 2005 9:22 am
Posts: 4360
Location: East Mountains, NM
Thanks, it's tough to keep it all straight.


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 12:14 am 
Utility Grade

Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:00 am
Posts: 13
I pulled the butt off and got another twist to the puzzle.
Serial on the stock is early but not matching. Serial is 12068.

I have been told this may have been early manufacture, but not completed or sold until around 1935. Maybe switched by the dealer? Forearm wood looks original but I can't find a serial. All the metal is matching on the forearm metal.


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 6:59 am 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Mon Aug 06, 2007 7:03 pm
Posts: 1157
Location: DFW, TEXAS
I'm not sure that is the butt stock's serial number. Might be some other random number...

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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Sat Sep 26, 2015 11:52 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:00 am
Posts: 13
Got a couple more photos up


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 1:30 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2015 10:59 am
Posts: 66
Butt stock has been replaced is my guess.


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:11 am 
*Proud to be a*
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Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:49 am
Posts: 1040
In order to enhance collect-ability, Browning inscribes or stamps the gun's serial number on the stock so that one can quickly determine if the gun has been re-stocked. Unfortunately, I don't know when Browning started this practice, or if that is case with your pre-war Super. Nor am I positive as to whether this practice applies to all Supers, or just the high grades with fancy wood.

Now I want to check my Grade I Supers and my Citori shotguns to see! :s

Respectfully,

CFB

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Last edited by crazyforbrownings on Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 1:28 pm 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:27 pm
Posts: 917
CFB's comment about serial numbers under the pad or butt plate is a quick check. If there's nothing there, then.......

I might add that you can look in the trigger tang inlet and in the barrel channel on the inside of the forearm to confirm serial number matches. However, it is AS important to recognize character size and stamp type when trying to authenticate the wood 'stamping'.

From my limited experience, FN used one type-style/size for Browning guns.........

Image
'57 Gr IV

......and used a smaller type-style/size on FN guns.


Image
'62 C2

So depending on period and whether it is a Browning or an FN, the gun should have one of these two stamp-types (from pre-war thru mid-60's). If not, then it may not be the original stock.

I also suspect that wood stamps can be cleverly duplicated to appear close to the original stamps used at FN (or maybe Browning, in some cases).


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 1:47 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:00 am
Posts: 13
Image
Image
Image
Image
Image


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 10:22 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:00 am
Posts: 13
She shoots as advertised! Anybody decipher the choke code in the first block of pics? It's Belgian style without stars
18.4 CHOKE 18.3.

Shots a little tighter than my modified auto 5


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 10:23 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 9:56 am
Posts: 8519
Location: Maryland
In what auction were the deassessioned guns from the Remington Research collection sold? How do you get word of these sales?


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 3:18 pm 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:27 pm
Posts: 917
Now you know how frustrated I was to find- out about the July 24th Morphy auction 2 days after :mrgreen:


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Sun Oct 04, 2015 9:23 pm 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Wed Jul 25, 2007 9:16 pm
Posts: 1203
Location: Louisiana
Scotty has spend some time researching very early Supers, including visiting the Browning factory in Belgium.

Nice gun, don't see many Mono-Blocks as they didn't make many, went to the current system very early on.

Is the stock number different than the gun, maybe an early stock replacement?

DF


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Mon Oct 05, 2015 9:47 am 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*

Joined: Fri Feb 24, 2012 10:49 am
Posts: 1040
wbaad:

Are those twin-single triggers? or double triggers?

I'm going to have to dig out my copy of Schwing and remind myself as to when Browning started using the twin-single.

CFB

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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Tue Oct 06, 2015 10:28 pm 
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Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:00 am
Posts: 13
It is the double triggers.


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Mon Oct 12, 2015 11:44 pm 
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Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:29 am
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This Super was manufactured in 1930. Sold in 1935. Restocked with a 1938 replacement. Possibly it was originally stocked with a Monte Carlo stock and beavertail forearm that many considered ugly in the post war years. Food for thought. Keep the research alive.


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Tue Oct 13, 2015 9:55 am 
Utility Grade

Joined: Wed Sep 23, 2015 12:00 am
Posts: 13
It appears the forearm is original. I couldn't find a number on the wood, but all the metal on the forearm matches the gun and fits the wood perfectly. Anybody know where the serial would be on the wood?


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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 5:29 am 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:51 pm
Posts: 115
Location: Australia
NoDak Scotty wrote:
Here is what I know about 2-digit Supers:
Browning has #1 on display in Ogden, vent rib with an English grip and a pad.
#19 and #22 were sold in CA and UT, but I have no data on their survival or location. According to Glen Jensen, those were the lowest numbered Supers SOLD in the USA.
I have #31, an FN gun I imported from the UK. Monobloc bbls, raised solid rib, pad, double triggers.
Remington bought #44 brand new and kept it in their museum until it was sold at auction in 2011 for $2,000.
I believe #99 is in Australia.



Bit late chiming in to the thread
I have #95 here in Australia. I purchased it at auction , they didn’t have much info , as I was hungry to know it’s heritage , all they could tell me is it came from a estate collection that was being sold off.
On this gun the action is in the white and accessories are blued.

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 Post subject: Re: Pre war FN superposed info
PostPosted: Sat Sep 14, 2019 7:02 am 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:27 pm
Posts: 917
Paul, It is good to hear from you again. I've lost touch with 'SimonW' and 'Powell', for some reason......even though I have their e-mail addresses...….and haven't seen 'aussieshooter59' on here since 2016.

Nice to finally hear from down under. Thanks for sharing some of #95's info with us. I haven't seen many, 'in-the-white' receivers and knuckles but have encountered several early high grade FN's with coin finishes and blued (or bronzed) barrel lugs and fences.

On the subject of 2-digit serial numbers, I can add that #'s 75 and 77 were in the UK at one point - of course I do not know their original 'Destinataires' from the shipping ledger.




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