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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 12:37 pm 
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https://www.wktv.com/content/news/Remin ... 96201.html



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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:28 pm 
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Surprising that the Mine Union isn't trying to do SOMETHING to keep the jobs there; unless they have just given up hope

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 1:40 pm 
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Remington Arms may go on in some fashion somewhere, but we may well be seeing the death of an American community. I don`t know what else Ilion my have that can absorb this kind of loss. I do feel sorry for those folks. They weren`t the cause of any of this.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 2:11 pm 
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Tidefanatic wrote:
I don`t know what else Ilion my have that can absorb this kind of loss.


Basically nothing.

Here's the employers for Herkimer county:

http://www.shovelready.com/employers_list.asp?Herkimer

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 4:31 pm 
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And since they are Red, Cuomo will do nothing to help.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Thu Sep 24, 2020 10:51 pm 
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“That condition is unknown until it is thoroughly characterized. If nothing is found, then it’s a moot point. Buyers who fail to do an environmental assessment basically “buy” any pre-existing problems that may exist. If a pre-existing problem is identified before the sale then it belongs to the seller. If the seller is broke or has no assets or no longer exists then the problem is owned buy the state or if it is of great magnitude then it becomes a CERCLA (Superfund) site. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superfund. That’s it in a highly condensed nutshell.”

Thank you for a direct answer to my question. This is a rare event.


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 12:01 am 
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Just goes to show the jurisprudence evolving in the Newtown litigation may well be the newest form of gun control.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 3:57 am 
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Skeet_Man wrote:
I'm not sure how you can say with certainty to what I am referring. My quote is a direct quote from 10 days ago.

Considering Remington does (or at least did) employ 1300 people in Ilion alone, and what you posted only pertains to Madison employees, I would infer that the statement I quoted does NOT have anything to do with the WARN letter you posted.


In fact, your quote from a couple of weeks ago is wildly incorrect. What happened, as far as Ilion, just happened Thursday afternoon.

https://www.wktv.com/content/news/Plant ... 25941.html

Remington has less than 700 employees in Ilion, called "more than 600." As of yesterday afternoon, the plant is closed.

Quote:
More than 600 Remington Arms workers were furloughed Thursday. They learned through an email from Remington Outdoor Company CEO, Ken D'Arcy, when they got to work Thursday. They left the plant shortly after learning of the plant-wide furlough, at around 12:30.
Posted: Sep 24, 2020 6:07 PM

Posted By: Joleen Ferris


Remington has told employees they might be able to tell them more October 12.

As far as Herkimer County, https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/herkimercountynewyork there are about 12.665 jobs. 600 or so of them are Remington / Ilion.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 6:34 am 
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oneounceload wrote:
And since they are Red, Cuomo will do nothing to help.


And even made matters worse by not declaring them essential and not letting them change over to build other products during the early onset of the CCP virus.


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:18 am 
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oyeme wrote:
And even made matters worse by not declaring them essential and not letting them change over to build other products during the early onset of the CCP virus.


The main problem is that the primary owners of Remington (banks) never wanted to be owners in the first place. Nor did they care to fund Remington properly long-term, if at all. Owning a company that you have no interest in owning, in an industry you care and know nothing about is not a recipe for success. You're right, of course: NY cares nothing about 600 jobs upstate.

Quote:
Around 2.5 million New Yorkers have filed an initial unemployment claim since the shutdowns began. Those numbers don't include the workers who have had their hours and salaries cut during this time, or people on the state's shared work program.

And around 1.8 million jobs have been lost in the state between April 2019 and April 2020, a decline of more than 19%. Every part of the state from — Buffalo to Albany to New York City to Long Island — has suffered significant job losses.

The numbers dwarf what we saw during the Great Recession when New York state lost 291,900 jobs from a peak in July 2008 through December 2009, a decline of 3.3%. More than 70% of those losses were in New York City and its suburbs.


New York has big problems.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:26 am 
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RandyWakeman wrote:
oyeme wrote:
And even made matters worse by not declaring them essential and not letting them change over to build other products during the early onset of the CCP virus.


The main problem is that the primary owners of Remington (banks) never wanted to be owners in the first place. Nor did they care to fund Remington properly long-term, if at all. Owning a company that you have no interest in owning, in an industry you care and know nothing about is not a recipe for success. You're right, of course: NY cares nothing about 600 jobs upstate.

Quote:
Around 2.5 million New Yorkers have filed an initial unemployment claim since the shutdowns began. Those numbers don't include the workers who have had their hours and salaries cut during this time, or people on the state's shared work program.

And around 1.8 million jobs have been lost in the state between April 2019 and April 2020, a decline of more than 19%. Every part of the state from — Buffalo to Albany to New York City to Long Island — has suffered significant job losses.

The numbers dwarf what we saw during the Great Recession when New York state lost 291,900 jobs from a peak in July 2008 through December 2009, a decline of 3.3%. More than 70% of those losses were in New York City and its suburbs.


New York has big problems.


{hs# Indubitably!

Just because I never get a chance to use that word!


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:29 am 
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oyeme wrote:
RandyWakeman wrote:
oyeme wrote:
And even made matters worse by not declaring them essential and not letting them change over to build other products during the early onset of the CCP virus.


The main problem is that the primary owners of Remington (banks) never wanted to be owners in the first place. Nor did they care to fund Remington properly long-term, if at all. Owning a company that you have no interest in owning, in an industry you care and know nothing about is not a recipe for success. You're right, of course: NY cares nothing about 600 jobs upstate.

Quote:
Around 2.5 million New Yorkers have filed an initial unemployment claim since the shutdowns began. Those numbers don't include the workers who have had their hours and salaries cut during this time, or people on the state's shared work program.

And around 1.8 million jobs have been lost in the state between April 2019 and April 2020, a decline of more than 19%. Every part of the state from — Buffalo to Albany to New York City to Long Island — has suffered significant job losses.

The numbers dwarf what we saw during the Great Recession when New York state lost 291,900 jobs from a peak in July 2008 through December 2009, a decline of 3.3%. More than 70% of those losses were in New York City and its suburbs.


New York has big problems.


{hs# Indubitably!

Just because I never get a chance to use that word!


Good word!


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:46 am 
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Now reading biography on HS Truman and how Wall Street used Holding Companies to bleed the life out of the railroads in the 1930s. This sounds exactly like what happened to Remington Arms

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:00 am 
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Freedom Group was created by and was 95 percent owned by Cerberus Capital Management. In 2012, the sheepish comment from Cerberus when they decided to sell what they assembled was, "As a Firm, we are investors, not statesmen or policy makers. Our role is to make investments on behalf of our clients who are comprised of the pension plans of firemen, teachers, policemen and other municipal workers and unions, endowments, and other institutions and individuals."
"It is not our role to take positions, or attempt to shape or influence the gun control policy debate. That is the job of our federal and state legislators."

What no industry needs is a company that has no interest in policy that affects their business. A gun company that has no interest in gun policy is a pathetic joke, in my opinion.

Along the way, there has been Robert Nardelli, James Marcotuli, Anthony Acitelli, and now Ken D'Arcy . . . and ultimately, accidental ownership by former creditors, now debtors, who want little to do with firearms.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 10:12 am 
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RandyWakeman wrote:
Freedom Group was created by and was 95 percent owned by Cerberus Capital Management. In 2012, the sheepish comment from Cerberus when they decided to sell what they assembled was, "As a Firm, we are investors, not statesmen or policy makers. Our role is to make investments on behalf of our clients who are comprised of the pension plans of firemen, teachers, policemen and other municipal workers and unions, endowments, and other institutions and individuals."
"It is not our role to take positions, or attempt to shape or influence the gun control policy debate. That is the job of our federal and state legislators."

What no industry needs is a company that has no interest in policy that affects their business. A gun company that has no interest in gun policy is a pathetic joke, in my opinion.

Along the way, there has been Robert Nardelli, James Marcotuli, Anthony Acitelli, and now Ken D'Arcy . . . and ultimately, accidental ownership by former creditors, now debtors, who want little to do with firearms.


Excellent summary Randy. What it all adds up to is a recipe for the disaster that`s befallen a company that`s a true American icon and major employer for a segment of the NY population. It would be difficult enough with the current external societal and political environment to be successful. Add in what you mention? The proverbial snowball has a better chance.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 1:22 pm 
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Anyone thinking of buying a Remington shotgun, go for it. You are likely to see some good buys.
Worrying about parts for 1100 shotguns is not realistic.
It's been 50+ years since the Winchester Model 12 ceased production, and there's a gazillion of them still shooting.


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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 1:31 pm 
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RandyWakeman wrote:
and now Ken D'Arcy


I was hoping Ken would be able to turn things around, but probably way too late. At least Ken was a shooter and gun owner (and former CEO of Crosman). Hopefully the new owner's keep him around, but doubtful.

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 1:41 pm 
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RandyWakeman wrote:
Freedom Group was created by and was 95 percent owned by Cerberus Capital Management. In 2012, the sheepish comment from Cerberus when they decided to sell what they assembled was, "As a Firm, we are investors, not statesmen or policy makers. Our role is to make investments on behalf of our clients who are comprised of the pension plans of firemen, teachers, policemen and other municipal workers and unions, endowments, and other institutions and individuals."
"It is not our role to take positions, or attempt to shape or influence the gun control policy debate. That is the job of our federal and state legislators."

What no industry needs is a company that has no interest in policy that affects their business. A gun company that has no interest in gun policy is a pathetic joke, in my opinion.

Along the way, there has been Robert Nardelli, James Marcotuli, Anthony Acitelli, and now Ken D'Arcy . . . and ultimately, accidental ownership by former creditors, now debtors, who want little to do with firearms.


Thank you Randal. 8)

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 2:08 pm 
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saskbooknut wrote:
Anyone thinking of buying a Remington shotgun, go for it. You are likely to see some good buys.
Worrying about parts for 1100 shotguns is not realistic.
It's been 50+ years since the Winchester Model 12 ceased production, and there's a gazillion of them still shooting.


Yep, I`d agree. Regardless of what happens, I will have shuffled off this mortal coil long before the last Remington shotgun leaves the fields and woods. I`ll be shooting the hell out of mine!

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 Post subject: Re: Remington Closures . . . . .
PostPosted: Fri Sep 25, 2020 2:42 pm 
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I’m shooting Remington models 32 and 31 that are pre war as well as a slew of 1100s and 870s that are considerably newer. My Grandfather’s Model 11 made in 1934 is still going strong. Why in the world would I hesitate to buy a new model?



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