ShotGunWorld Shotguns

It is currently Wed Apr 21, 2021 1:26 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 52 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 7:34 pm 
Shotgun Expert
Shotgun Expert
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:02 am
Posts: 27368
Location: Plainfield, IL
oneounceload wrote:
So what was the point of Roundhill getting into all of this in the first place?


Who is Roundhill? What, if anything, do they own and operate? What have they EVER owned and operated? Does Roundhill have any actual employees, at all? By what standard were they made a "qualified bidder" in the first place? Any standards at all?

Your question is unanswerable. You have nonsense articles like this one: https://www.thetruthaboutguns.com/round ... eat-again/ .

Quote:
Roundhill is due to close on the deal on Monday and Edwards told us he wants to get the Ilion workforce back from furlough and turning out firearms again just as fast at they can get all of the paperwork completed with the ATF. They’ll keep the Sturgis, South Dakota and Lenoir City, Tennessee facilities, too, and they’re in discussions with the city of Huntsville to maintain that newer production facility as well.


All of it was bogus. Here is another real dandy: https://www.alloutdoor.com/2020/10/08/e ... roundhill/ . A great deal of this nonsense came from Jeff Edwards, Roundhill partner and company spokesman . . . for a few weeks, anyway.

Mark O'Keefe wrote on Friday, October 23, 2020: "Then we get to Roundhill, LLC, the winning bidders of non-Marlin Remington firearms. I had previously reported that the ownership included industry veteran Jeff Edwards, but that is no longer the case. Edwards told me that they “couldn’t agree on the structure,” and he is out."


The sausage shrinks when it hits the frying pan.



_________________
--Randy

http://randywakeman.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 9:59 pm 
Shotgun Expert
Shotgun Expert
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:02 am
Posts: 27368
Location: Plainfield, IL
casonet wrote:
Few are bigger fans of Remington than I am owning about 20 of their long arms. I am also a former business man having owned and run a fair size company with several hundred employees. You have to cut through all of the emotion and nostalgia and look at the facts. Frankly, the way I see it, is they don’t look good at all. Show me a different and more favorable set of facts and I could change my attitude.


Case 20-81688-CRJ11 Doc 1552 Filed 03/01/21 Entered 03/01/21 15:56:58
----
Quote:
"First, the Roundhill APA does not require Roundhill“ to hire at least 200 bargaining unit employees.” Rather, the Roundhill APA requires only that Roundhill“offer employment to at least two hundred (200) union Employees,” –an obligation that Roundhill timely and fully complied with when it sent out offer letters on or about December 14, 2020. Furthermore, the Roundhill APA does not require that Roundhill commence operations at the Ilion facility or, therefore, that it actually “hire” anyone. Ultimately, if Roundhill decides to commence operations at the Ilion facility, a decision it has not yet made, then it will hire employees."

It continues . . .
Quote:
At this point, Roundhill has neither commenced operations at the Ilion Plant nor decided that it will do so. Therefore, Roundhill has no former bargaining unit members in its employ. As such, Roundhill is not a successor employer and is under no immediate duty to bargain with the Union.


Those are the facts, as represented to the court just yesterday. The facts, according to Roundhill anyway, are:

1) Roundhill has hired no former Remington union employees.
2) Roundhill does not have to hire anyone.
3) Roundhill has not so much as decided to begin operations at Ilion.


Statements of facts filed with the court are neither automatically good or bad, they just are what they are.

_________________
--Randy

http://randywakeman.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Tue Mar 02, 2021 10:11 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:16 am
Posts: 182
Roundhill purchased the Remington firearm line for some reason. I doubt millions of dollars were spent without any concern for return of investment. Personally, I don’t care if they sell the patents to another manufacturer, as long as Someone continues to manufacture some of the more successful models. In particular the Versa Max and V3 Line.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 1:20 pm 
Shotgun Expert
Shotgun Expert
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:02 am
Posts: 27368
Location: Plainfield, IL
"Some reason" hardly means a good reason, or anything that gives immediate results. Rightly or wrongly, the current situation started on or about July 28, 2020:
"Remington Outdoor Co. filed for bankruptcy for the second time in two years with plans to sell the 200-year-old maker of firearms. The company said reduced gun sales prevented it from making money, even after restructuring its finances in its first bankruptcy. Remington had $437.5 million in sales last year, about half the business it did in 2016, according to court papers filed in Decatur, Ala. The company owes various lenders more than $250 million, including a $12.5 million debt to Remington’s hometown of Huntsville, Ala."

The sales drop from $865.1 million (2016) to $437.5 million (2019) was dramatic. Rightly or wrongly, the billion dollar banks that controlled Remington, unable to sell the company after trying for most of 2020 to do so, decided to throw in the towel and liquidate at auction by July. At that point, Remington Firearm's best mechanical engineers, product managers, customer service staff, marketing talent, etc., were forced to find employment elsewhere and they quickly did just that.

The hedge fund play in firearms is not a new thing, as most remember the Cerberus adventure which did not end particularly well. Hedge fund managers hardly play by the standard playbook, nor do they need to as they are playing with other people's money. It is high risk, high reward: buy a distressed asset, set up a shell company (RemArms), and tell your attorneys to start playing the magic money games.

To date, there has been no tangible progress. Even with a competent, experienced team in place, and a viable plan, it is all a year away after waving the go flag. Ruger has said as much with the Marlin line, for example, not anticipating production until late this year . . . and Ruger is not decisionally challenged.

_________________
--Randy

http://randywakeman.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 6:05 pm 
Presentation Grade
User avatar

Joined: Sat Mar 08, 2008 2:59 pm
Posts: 529
Location: ohio
RandyWakeman wrote:
"Some reason" hardly means a good reason, or anything that gives immediate results. Rightly or wrongly, the current situation started on or about July 28, 2020:
"Remington Outdoor Co. filed for bankruptcy for the second time in two years with plans to sell the 200-year-old maker of firearms. The company said reduced gun sales prevented it from making money, even after restructuring its finances in its first bankruptcy. Remington had $437.5 million in sales last year, about half the business it did in 2016, according to court papers filed in Decatur, Ala. The company owes various lenders more than $250 million, including a $12.5 million debt to Remington’s hometown of Huntsville, Ala."

The sales drop from $865.1 million (2016) to $437.5 million (2019) was dramatic. Rightly or wrongly, the billion dollar banks that controlled Remington, unable to sell the company after trying for most of 2020 to do so, decided to throw in the towel and liquidate at auction by July. At that point, Remington Firearm's best mechanical engineers, product managers, customer service staff, marketing talent, etc., were forced to find employment elsewhere and they quickly did just that.

The hedge fund play in firearms is not a new thing, as most remember the Cerberus adventure which did not end particularly well. Hedge fund managers hardly play by the standard playbook, nor do they need to as they are playing with other people's money. It is high risk, high reward: buy a distressed asset, set up a shell company (RemArms), and tell your attorneys to start playing the magic money games.

To date, there has been no tangible progress. Even with a competent, experienced team in place, and a viable plan, it is all a year away after waving the go flag. Ruger has said as much with the Marlin line, for example, not anticipating production until late this year . . . and Ruger is not decisionally challenged.



Time will tell.... We can all talk smack, but we will see how the future unfolds.

_________________
" A firearm can be a burden or tool depending on who handles it......."


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Wed Mar 03, 2021 7:56 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Thu Dec 27, 2018 10:16 am
Posts: 182
I just hope these great auto loaders are made again in the future by someone.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 12:24 pm 
Shotgun Expert
Shotgun Expert
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:02 am
Posts: 27368
Location: Plainfield, IL
https://www.syracuse.com/business/2021/ ... layed.html

Quote:
By Rick Moriarty | [email protected]

Syracuse, N.Y. -- The reopening of the Remington Arms factory in Ilion has been put off, but it’s unclear for how long.

The union that represents workers at the plant in Herkimer County said about 50 employees were scheduled to report to work on Monday, March 1, as part of a plan by Remington’s new owner to restart gun manufacturing.

However, the workers were called over the weekend and told not to come in, said Phil Smith, director of communications and governmental affairs for the United Mine Workers of America. Some employees did not get the word and were turned away at the door on Monday, he said.

Smith said the union has not been told the reason for the delay or when the workers will be called back.

A security guard who answered the phone at the plant Wednesday said no one from management was at the facility and available to comment.

_________________
--Randy

http://randywakeman.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 1:11 pm 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2009 1:54 pm
Posts: 12375
Location: Kansas
More smoke and mirrors

_________________
"We pulled the trigger, the safety went forward, both barrels fired almost together, the gun opened, ejectors kicked the fired cases over our shoulder ...the most completely automatic gun we ever fired" Elmer Keith- Shotguns by Keith


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:24 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:04 am
Posts: 3161
At some point, somebody, somehow, will bring this to a final conclusion. Through it all, Roundhill/RemArms has 13million in skins in this thing. While in the grand scheme of things that`s not a tremendous amount of money, it`s still a lot IMO to simply walk away from without trying to do SOMETHING that would yield at least SOME return on investment. That ROI may or may not involve an operating assembly line at the existing plant in Ilion. It may be a while before we know what that ultimately will be.

_________________
Fabarm L4S Initial Hunter
Remington 870 Super Magnum Turkey
Remington V3 Walnut
Remington 870 Express (Realtree Xtra camo)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:33 pm 
*Proud to be a*
*Proud to be a*
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jul 20, 2009 1:54 pm
Posts: 12375
Location: Kansas
I think that they will try to polish it up real nice and then try to flip it

_________________
"We pulled the trigger, the safety went forward, both barrels fired almost together, the gun opened, ejectors kicked the fired cases over our shoulder ...the most completely automatic gun we ever fired" Elmer Keith- Shotguns by Keith


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 2:53 pm 
Crown Grade

Joined: Sun Dec 17, 2017 9:04 am
Posts: 3161
casonet wrote:
I think that they will try to polish it up real nice and then try to flip it


Could well be the case. And it may be hard to do.

_________________
Fabarm L4S Initial Hunter
Remington 870 Super Magnum Turkey
Remington V3 Walnut
Remington 870 Express (Realtree Xtra camo)


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: RemArms website is up and running
PostPosted: Fri Mar 05, 2021 6:32 pm 
Shotgun Expert
Shotgun Expert
User avatar

Joined: Sat Sep 09, 2006 11:02 am
Posts: 27368
Location: Plainfield, IL
Tidefanatic wrote:
At some point, somebody, somehow, will bring this to a final conclusion. Through it all, Roundhill/RemArms has 13million in skins in this thing.


Do they? Whether someone likes the 'hedge fun way' or not, it is quite legal and happens all the time to the tune of billions, not just millions. Cathie Wood manages $29 billion in assets, she was the "the best stock picker of 2020" - - - yet hardly everyone completely agrees with her strategy. Few things are ever settled completely and nothing has a final conclusion when it comes to private equity. Consider OTC stocks: more than 1 trillion shares changed hands in over-the-counter trading in December, 2020.

You can throw it all against a wall and see what will stick. Whether Ilion is for sale again, whether new private investors are being sought, etc., ... we will never know.



_________________
--Randy

http://randywakeman.com/


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 52 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Registered users: 2LegsBetter, AHI, Barmaleykin, BENFISH, Biigote, Bing [Bot], BuckshotBilly, casonet, castnblast2, Colt99, dannyd93140, dfw_bill, Dmc57, double20, DoublesForever, ebcjr, ecorar, FlyChamps, Flyingtargets!, fullgallon, Google [Bot], Google Adsense [Bot], Google Feedfetcher, groyce, Husker90, John H, jrmev, Mike McAlpine, Mkk, oneounceload, painter*, Patently Obvious, PJDiesel, polywad6963, RAT 3323, raymond525, Road Man, Rubberhead, SD angler, skeetsit, SteveWilliams, troybmorrison, valencman, Warden, Winston Wolf, Ypm968


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group    - DMCA Notice