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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Mon Jan 11, 2021 6:27 pm 
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I agree that in the current political arena, calling it a weapon just brings more negative connotations to it. Whether that's right or wrong.

Biden just said he is going to try to take down the NRA.....get ready!!




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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 9:26 am 
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Having heard an instructor at Holland & Holland refer to one of their top-tier shotguns as a "weapon" I have no issue using the same term when referring to my own guns.


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 1:09 pm 
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PJR wrote:
Having heard an instructor at Holland & Holland refer to one of their top-tier shotguns as a "weapon" I have no issue using the same term when referring to my own guns.


I'm sure that given the incredible support and acceptance of firearms in Canada, your use of whatever terminology you see fit is welcomed warmly.


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:16 pm 
Field Grade

Joined: Sat Jan 20, 2018 5:30 pm
Posts: 27
The first time I flew with a shotgun many years ago, it was a used 20 gauge 1100 Wingmaster that I had found in a pawn shop. A dove shooting machine that I was taking as a gift to my brother's surprise birthday party. Beautiful wood, blued steel.

When the TSA lady asked me to open the case to inspect it, she offhandedly referred to it as a "weapon" and it almost made me cry.


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 5:26 pm 
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Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2020 9:56 am
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Well, you would not tell your daughter setting the dinner table to not forget the weapons when you were referring to steak knives. Switchblades, maybe. So we are, indeed, talking about intended use, not inherent capability.


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 12, 2021 7:16 pm 
Utility Grade

Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2021 7:00 pm
Posts: 1
Hello all. First post...

I find machines if all types interesting and enjoy learning about them.

That said, if I owned any, I would refer to them as firearms.

Sent from my Pixel 4a using Tapatalk


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:18 am 
Diamond Grade

Joined: Sat Feb 13, 2016 6:28 pm
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Location: Skeet and Trap Fields
Yeah, it bugs me. We don't casually refer to our kitchen knives or baseball bats as "my weapon" tho they are just as likely to be used as such. I own shotguns, rifles and handguns, all firearms. I don't own a single "weapon" - - - at least not yet. Tho depending on the circumstances - - one certainly could become one. Guns that are routinely carried as weapons are military, police and criminals. I hope mine never become weapons.


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:21 am 
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PJR wrote:
Having heard an instructor at Holland & Holland refer to one of their top-tier shotguns as a "weapon" I have no issue using the same term when referring to my own guns.


As if that somehow makes his nomenclature correct. I doubt that many H&H shotguns were purchased to be "weapons." I would have corrected him that it's a sporting arm. Even H&H instructors can learn something.


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:51 am 
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John Henry wrote:
I agree that in the current political arena, calling it a weapon just brings more negative connotations to it. Whether that's right or wrong.

Biden just said he is going to try to take down the NRA.....get ready!!


One of the strengths, of the NEW culture, is the ability to alter the meanings of words and phrases. ie: "Hook up" was a term, that my generation, referred to attaching a trailer to a vehicle for the purpose of transporting said trailer to a particular destination. The "Greatest Generation" referred to "Hook up" as attaching a farm implement to a horse or mule. Today's generation definition of "Hook up" cannot be used on this forum as it refers to something not related to vehicles, trailers, farm implements, vehicles,etc.

Sprinkle words with a little fairy dust and unicorn dreams and the meanings change.

I became a life member of the NRA at the ripe old age of 21. I became a "Life Endowment" member a few years back. I will continue to support the NRA until a newer dog, with sharper teeth comes along. I remember when the NRA had the largest lobby in D.C. Now they are way down the list, not even close to the strength they were 40 years ago. Biden may not take down the NRA, but the NRA will make whatever concessions they need to satisfy D.C. and still stay in business. There are too many huge, inflated, salaries at the NRA. Follow the money, Always follow the money.

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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 8:55 am 
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twohigh wrote:
PJR wrote:
Having heard an instructor at Holland & Holland refer to one of their top-tier shotguns as a "weapon" I have no issue using the same term when referring to my own guns.


As if that somehow makes his nomenclature correct. I doubt that many H&H shotguns were purchased to be "weapons." I would have corrected him that it's a sporting arm. Even H&H instructors can learn something.


I'd be spending a lot of time correcting people because the term "weapon" seems to be used more often in reference to sporting arms in the UK and Europe than in North America. "Firearm" is a more accurate term while "weapon" is more general but not incorrrect when referring to a firearm.

I'm also not one of those puffed-up, know-it-all types who goes around around correcting people if they say "clip" instead of "magazine" or if they refer to a semi-automatic rifle in a military configuration as an "assault rifle." YMMV


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 12:34 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:41 pm
Posts: 282
Back to the original point. The female shooter was probably not a native English speaker. Use of the term weapon most likely more about unfamiliarity with the language than any political intent.

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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 1:30 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2020 4:02 pm
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sneem2 wrote:
Back to the original point. The female shooter was probably not a native English speaker. Use of the term weapon most likely more about unfamiliarity with the language than any political intent.


{hs#


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:08 pm 
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Yes, of course it's a weapon. It was designed as such, and the clay games many of us play were designed to simulate hunting, including calling some of the targets "rabbits." Or the term "trap" evolved out of pigeon traps where a person would pull a rope to release the birds, which is also why we say "pull". (At least that's what I read in Rollin Oswald's book, and I have no reason to doubt him.)

In fact, I'd reckon that many clay shooters use the same weapon for birds and small game as they do for clay-shooting games. I often see posts here and elsewhere from newbies looking for a do-all shotgun.

I don't always hear shotguns referred to as weapons, but sometimes I do, and I'd never think to be such a pansy as to let it bother me or to worry what someone might "feel".

My kids fence, and I note that fencers always refer to the three primary "weapons" of fencing: foil, épée, and sabre. Somehow the fencing crowd has avoided being so weak-kneed that they have to fear the disapproving scowls of emotion-based leftists. And their sport's traditions are so important to them that they're reluctant to change. They still wear all white because it used to show who drew first blood. We could use some similar reverence for past practices of trapping birds, and the related etymology, it would appear.

This is an important point even for those who never shoot anything more than clay games, because they are still using a hunting weapon, because that's what defines the sport. There are indeed leftists out there who have said that shooting sports can easily be simulated by using different technologies like harmless laser pointers and targets with sensors, and therefore none of us actually "need" a firearm. These same people think that children should not be raised in a home with weapons, and they get a case of the vapors when I tell them that our junior high school has a trap shooting team. I've heard all of these anti-gun points made by kooks. They don't want shooting or possessing weapons to be normal behavior, because of their own mental illness. The fear of weapons is truly, as Jeff Cooper said, a sickness -- hoplophobia.

Never, ever forget that leftism is a cult, and they want nothing more than to change language because it ultimately changes thoughts and eventually practices. Never, ever concede anything to the cult, not even one simple word because you fear it might hurt someone's feelings. If someone has their feelings hurt by the word "weapon", it's actually critical that you use it to crush their delusional dreams of progressivism.


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:22 pm 
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From Webster's 1828 dictionary

WEAPON, noun [G., Latin ]

1. Any instrument of offense; any thing used or designed to be used in destroying or annoying an enemy. The weapons of rude nations are clubs, stones and bows and arrows. Modern weapons of war are swords, muskets, pistols, cannon and the like.

2. An instrument for contest, or for combating enemies.

3. An instrument of defense.

4. Weapons, in botany, arms; thorns, prickles, and stings, with which plants are furnished for defense; enumerated among the fulcres by Linne.

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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 4:36 pm 
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oldskeetshooter wrote:
From Webster's 1828 dictionary

WEAPON, noun [G., Latin ]

1. Any instrument of offense; any thing used or designed to be used in destroying or annoying an enemy. The weapons of rude nations are clubs, stones and bows and arrows. Modern weapons of war are swords, muskets, pistols, cannon and the like.

2. An instrument for contest, or for combating enemies.

3. An instrument of defense.

4. Weapons, in botany, arms; thorns, prickles, and stings, with which plants are furnished for defense; enumerated among the fulcres by Linne.



Wow. A 193 year old definition of a word to make your point. Very impressive. Of course it is nothing like the current Webster definition.

weapon noun

weap·​on | \ ˈwe-pən \
Definition of weapon
1: something (such as a club, knife, or gun) used to injure, defeat, or destroy
2: a means of contending against another

You can call a pair of scissors a weapon if you want to. Your choice. That doesn't make it appropriate. Just because you can doesn't mean you should.


Last edited by drawdc on Thu Jan 14, 2021 10:10 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 6:33 pm 
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drawdc wrote:
Wow. A 197 year old definition of a word to make your point.


Good point. If you put too much stock in 197 year-old word usage, you're liable to show up at the range and announce to your shooting buddies that you're "feeling rather gay today!"


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:51 pm 
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HenryVac wrote:
Yes, of course it's a weapon. . . .

. . . . If someone has their feelings hurt by the word "weapon", it's actually critical that you use it to crush their delusional dreams of progressivism.
I like it!

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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:36 am 
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Joined: Sat Mar 09, 2019 10:14 pm
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Location: Near, but not in, Portland, OR
Meh, I have an Army background and wouldn't care in the least. I would think it was out of place, but even I slip up and call firearms "weapons" from time to time.

But I sure don't care what other people call them. I have other things to think about.

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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:28 am 
Crown Grade

Joined: Tue Nov 15, 2005 9:33 pm
Posts: 6533
Location: Mascoutah IL
It bothers me and I believe she was factually wrong with her use of the term unless she intended her shotgun to be used for defensive or offensive purposes.

If I ride around in my car with a baseball bat in the seat next to me with the intent to use it to fight off car jackers then that bat is my weapon. Her use of the term would be like a baseball player calling his bat a weapon.

The term weapon applies based on intended use of the object; not the object itself.


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 Post subject: Re: Does this term bother you?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 10:41 am 
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HenryVac wrote:
drawdc wrote:
Wow. A 197 year old definition of a word to make your point.


Good point. If you put too much stock in 197 year-old word usage, you're liable to show up at the range and announce to your shooting buddies that you're "feeling rather gay today!"


:lol: You might also be shooting alone...




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