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 Post subject: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2020 7:02 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2015 9:06 am
Posts: 295
Location: California
As usual, the video of the tournament on the blog: www.frenchnick.com
Today, the Prelim video. Nice place, good targets, great squad. Check it out.



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Sponsors: Laporte, Krieghoff, B&P, Shurley Bros, Teague Chokes, Pilla


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Thu Dec 10, 2020 7:47 pm 
Limited Edition

Joined: Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:26 pm
Posts: 378
Thanks for the video. Targets looked tough on the video, but the scores do not reflect that.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Fri Dec 11, 2020 12:23 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jan 07, 2014 8:34 pm
Posts: 691
Nic, I see you aren't rocking the new vest? Did the sleeve on it cause an issue in cold weather?


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Sat Dec 12, 2020 5:38 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jul 14, 2015 9:06 am
Posts: 295
Location: California
No, I usually wear the new vest, but I lost weight and it's not as tight on me and bothers me for fitasc. I'm waiting for my new better fitted one!

Since I haven't been able to post any video yesterday (I was only shooting 5-stand and it's not possible to video record when shooting), I posted two new videos today. Check them out on: www.frenchnick.com

_________________
Nicolas X. Berry
C.E.O. & Founder at Little Trapper Inc.

NSCA Instructor
http://www.littletrapper.com
http://www.frenchnick.com
http://www.youtube.com/user/nikoberry

Sponsors: Laporte, Krieghoff, B&P, Shurley Bros, Teague Chokes, Pilla


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2020 12:23 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:29 pm
Posts: 2746
Location: Central Maine
The scores on the two main event layouts are dramatically different with blue scores appearing to be considerably lower.

Am curious what the target presentations differences were from layout to layout. Different target setters on the two main layouts? More space to throw more distance and speed? Or is blue just taking nasty to a higher level?

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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2020 5:23 pm 
Tournament Grade

Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2009 7:03 pm
Posts: 251
You guys want to see from different shooting styles, watch the prelim shoot off between Miles. Fanizzi, and Kidd.

It amazes me how far Fanizzi’s head is off his gun. That boy can really shoot. Miles is not real tight in either. Kidd is buried in it. Love the watch the different styles of these top guns.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Sun Dec 13, 2020 6:36 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 1:44 pm
Posts: 18
I just watched the video in regards to the shoot off. Why was there a call on delay of target for Kidd on two occasions? I thought the NSCA rules state there can be up to a 3 second delay.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 7:49 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:12 am
Posts: 5715
3. Call for Target—The target must be launched immediately
or with a delay of up to three (3) seconds.

Key word is OR. If the launch was immediate for all the other shooters they probably thought the delay was unfair. It's up to the field judge.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Mon Dec 14, 2020 7:27 pm 
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Joined: Fri Aug 28, 2009 7:03 pm
Posts: 251
Kidd is a pro and trust me if he thought it was unfair he would have said something as well as Miles. Fanizzi is fairly new in these situations so I have no idea.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 7:49 am 
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Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:12 am
Posts: 5715
snooky wrote:
Kidd is a pro and trust me if he thought it was unfair he would have said something as well as Miles. Fanizzi is fairly new in these situations so I have no idea.

Exactly, none of these long time pro's want to win anything that isn't fair. You also had a corrected call for Fanizzi on the outgoing target. You can hear the other shooters saying it was a dead bird. See 1:38 of the shoot off video.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 11:52 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 1:44 pm
Posts: 18
I believe all three in the shoot off are professionals and great for our sport. That being said, it seems to me that Kidd only complained about the delay on two occasions when he had missed a target.

The way the rule is written seems a little misleading: "Target must be launched immediately or with a delay of up to three (3) seconds."

So at any given station or shoot off does it have to be declared that there may be a delay up to three (3) seconds on any given target?

The score keeper / puller launches the target immediately on the call of the shooter or up to a three (3) second delay. If he is launching on delay it would be very difficult for the score keeper/puller to launch each particular target to each shooter with the same exact delay time. Will this lead to disputes?

Maybe the three (3) second delay should be removed from the rules.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 1:28 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2008 11:12 am
Posts: 5715
It's the call of the field judge. I didn't hear anyone protest.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 2:13 pm 
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Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:02 am
Posts: 100
RAT 3323 wrote:
I believe all three in the shoot off are professionals and great for our sport. That being said, it seems to me that Kidd only complained about the delay on two occasions when he had missed a target.

The way the rule is written seems a little misleading: "Target must be launched immediately or with a delay of up to three (3) seconds."

So at any given station or shoot off does it have to be declared that there may be a delay up to three (3) seconds on any given target?

The score keeper / puller launches the target immediately on the call of the shooter or up to a three (3) second delay. If he is launching on delay it would be very difficult for the score keeper/puller to launch each particular target to each shooter with the same exact delay time. Will this lead to disputes?

Maybe the three (3) second delay should be removed from the rules.


Some systems can pre-set a delay or program for a random delay that all shooters would deal with. The rules may be accounting for that situation. I dont think the intent is for a target that is generally being thrown without a delay to be allowed to be randomly thrown with a delay.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 2:35 pm 
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Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2018 2:51 pm
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Location: S.E. Wisconsin
Lacyb wrote:
Some systems can pre-set a delay or program for a random delay that all shooters would deal with.


This rule has been "on the books" since the days of hand traps, long before the use of any pre-sets or programs.
Further more it still relies on a trapper to push the button each time to start the program that counts down to release the target.
What I dont like about the rule is it allows a trapper to mess with a shooter he might not like. For example, first three shooters all get "instant pulls". Next guy, first bird 2 second delay, next bird instant, third bird 2.5 second delay, last bird 1 second. Last shooter all perfect instant pulls. Legal, yes as per the rules, but was it truly fair?

Steve

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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 4:29 pm 
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Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 1:44 pm
Posts: 18
In watching the video at about 2:34 you will see Kidd miss a target and then there is a call of a delay. At about 3:04 Kidd misses another target and immediately calls a delay.

Where does this rule come into play that a target can be launched immediately upon call for the target or up to a three (3) second delay. Seems by this rule the targets were all fair.

With the rule stating up to a three (3) second delay it would be very difficult for a trapper to present every target to every shooter at exactly 1, 2 or 3 second delay and be consistent for all shooters.

I know a delay can throw a shooter off when he is in rhythm and his timing is good. Then all of a sudden the target is delayed and there is a change in timing and the shot is not as smooth.


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 4:58 pm 
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Joined: Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:29 pm
Posts: 2746
Location: Central Maine
RAT 3323 wrote:
In watching the video at about 2:34 you will see Kidd miss a target and then there is a call of a delay. At about 3:04 Kidd misses another target and immediately calls a delay.

Where does this rule come into play that a target can be launched immediately upon call for the target or up to a three (3) second delay. Seems by this rule the targets were all fair.

With the rule stating up to a three (3) second delay it would be very difficult for a trapper to present every target to every shooter at exactly 1, 2 or 3 second delay and be consistent for all shooters.

I know a delay can throw a shooter off when he is in rhythm and his timing is good. Then all of a sudden the target is delayed and there is a change in timing and the shot is not as smooth.


I have watched this and I am not sure who called off the pair but I suspect it was the trapper. I think otherwise that Kidd would have kept moving to the second target.

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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 5:07 pm 
Limited Edition

Joined: Tue Nov 01, 2011 9:32 am
Posts: 392
In a similar context, Wendell Cherry stated in his last podcast on Behind the Break that it would be impossible to slow pull him and affect his shot. He said he practices not moving and slow pulls purposely, only moving on the flash.

Dave


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Tue Dec 15, 2020 7:40 pm 
Presentation Grade

Joined: Tue Apr 07, 2015 5:52 pm
Posts: 613
Location: Michigan
Gunsmokesupply wrote:
In a similar context, Wendell Cherry stated in his last podcast on Behind the Break that it would be impossible to slow pull him and affect his shot. He said he practices not moving and slow pulls purposely, only moving on the flash.

Dave


I practice that and also practice the trapper can pull any target in any order/presentation he wants, now, if only I could shoot like Wendell Cherry..... :(^


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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 8:45 am 
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Joined: Mon May 16, 2011 9:59 am
Posts: 557
I thought the three second rule was installed so shooters could not claim slow pull and take it over.
I dont think its meant to be a delay for everyone more of if it goes within 3 its a good target.
It does suck for shooters on a timing issue but i think without the rule the there would be alot of no bird claims.

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 Post subject: Re: 2020 Southeast Regionals
PostPosted: Wed Dec 16, 2020 11:59 am 
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Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2020 1:44 pm
Posts: 18
687shooter,

That is my thought too. I really don't understand how Kidd could claim delay when the targets appeared well within this 3 seconds after his call for target.

Maybe this rule needs to be worded differently.




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