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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2014 9:40 pm 
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Location: Hemingway, S.C. 29554
Well, a bear expert I ain't. All I know is what I read. I have been in bear territory, however. What I understand from what bear experts write is most bear (grizzly/ brown bear) attacks occur when a hunter returns to a kill to pack out the meat. The bear finds the kill & then, as far as the bear is concerned, it is his. He attacks to defend his meat. I don't know the statistics, but bears attack. Another scenario is when a female with cubs is surprised by a hiker. Black bears, I understand are more likely to kill than the larger brown bears. It is said that a brown may leave you alone if you play dead & stop fighting. Not something I want to prove. A black bear will reportedly make sure you are dead. I read an article in the "American Rifleman" years ago written by a Canadian bear guide. He used some monstrous cannon that must have been designed for Godzilla or Tyrannosaurus Rex. He was talking about really big brown bears that weigh 1,600 pounds or more. He was asked about certain outdoor writers recommendations for a bear rifle. His comment was, how would they know? He said " I seriously doubt that any of them ever even saw a 1,600 lb. bear, let alone shot one". Personally, unless attacked or if I were to hunt them, I would leave Mr. Bear alone. If I anticipated shooting one, I would carry the biggest cannon I could shoot. 1,600 lbs. is as much as a big Cape Buffalo weighs & .458 Winchesters & larger rifles are pretty standard for them beasts.




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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2014 11:19 pm 
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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 12:19 pm 
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Location: Hemingway, S.C. 29554
Nice video. I saw he killed it with a 300 grain bullet in something but it went by so fast I couldn't read what kind of rifle it was. How much did it weigh? I hope they had a track vehicle & front end loader to get it to the boat.


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Sat Jan 27, 2018 6:44 pm 
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Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2011 3:56 pm
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Rifle


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:54 am 
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Joined: Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:48 am
Posts: 3
What i do with my slugs for bear hunting is.....
I cut off the heads with about 1/2 inch of the nail of 16 penny spikes..
I drill into my foster slug so the nail stem fits in.....
I then superglue it in place so everything is nice n flat.
Now u have some real penitration....
Its a very easy thing to do to ur ammo....


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2018 8:24 pm 
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Joined: Tue Oct 21, 2014 9:46 pm
Posts: 480
I was actually charged by a grizzly while on a hunt. I was carrying a 338x8mmremmag, basically a 340weatherby, and I fired at about 30 yards. The bear stopped, and bit at it's rear hip, and my second shot broke both shoulders. The first shot penetrated from the throat to the rear hip, and I would not have traded my rifle for a shotgun with slugs. Contrary to what some people believe, unless your first shot stops the charge, you aren't going to get off several aimed shots as it charges, so I prefer a bolt action rifle with a powerful cartridge, and a well constructed bullet.
As for the people that have never been charged by a grizzly, carry on speculating.


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Mon Aug 13, 2018 10:16 am 
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Joined: Sat Nov 16, 2013 6:17 pm
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I can't imagine carrying a shotgun hunting in grizzly country unless your hunting grouse! Then it flls on a load of bird shot to stop a bear? Don't think so! If I was hunting grizzly country, ha have a bunch in Montana and Alaska, I carried a suitable rifle. I've carried a 7mm mag, 338 win mag and a 308 180gr bullet, but today I'd carry my 30-06 with 200gr bullet. I cannot imagine intentionally hunting a grizzly bear with a shotgun, even with slugs. But then I can't imagine hunting them with a bow either! Most effective in my opinion is a rifle with a suitable bullet.


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 12:48 am 
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Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 3:05 pm
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Location: Canyon Country, CA
As to those who are putting down the 12 ga, slug I would remind you the original post was "what will take that beast down quicker when it suddenly decides to turn nasty within 100 yards? a 30 cal bullet or 12 gauge slug? "

When I hunted in grizzly country I carried my .375 H&H just in case but that was not the question asked. My answer to the question asked is it depends on the .30 caliber bullet as in A-frame, Barnes TSX, Nosler Partition, or another premium controlled expansion bullet or premium 12 gauge heat treated and controlled expansion slugs like the Dixie Slugs 3" IXL-DGS (Dangerous Game Slug), Lightfield's 3" Commander IDS PLUS 600gr. 1700FPS controlled expansion slug round and lastly but not least of all Brenneke's Magnum Crush 656 grs 1600FPS slug. There is even a solid steel slug form 12ga. DDupleks Monolit 32 blunk faced solid. These are NOT your old Foster slugs but real THUMPERS the last two slugs above have over 3800ft/lbs at the barrel! The Dixie IXL-DGS slug has 2782ft/lbs at the muzzle however the 870 gr. 73cal. heat treated slug has amazing momentom and is meant as a 50 yards and under stopping round. Which do you shoot the best most accurately under stress and fastest is my answer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Kiwq95oT0zQ


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 8:01 am 
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paparockcal wrote:
As to those who are putting down the 12 ga, slug I would remind you the original post was


from 8-1/2 years ago.

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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:51 am 
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Quote:
from 8-1/2 years ago.


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 3:00 pm 
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Location: Canyon Country, CA
RandyWakeman wrote:
paparockcal wrote:
As to those who are putting down the 12 ga, slug I would remind you the original post was


from 8-1/2 years ago.



Just answering the original post and as I said when I hunted grizzly country I carried my .375 H&H. However around camp I would not hesitate to pick up a properly loaded 12ga as they have and do take down grizzly and polar bears on a consistent basis via game control officers.


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 3:15 pm 
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Consistent?
Quote:
The town that hosts the most polar bears in the world, Churchill, Manitoba, has had two people killed by polar bears in almost 300 years [source: Polar Bears International]. The first attack took place after several teenagers came upon a bear and started throwing rocks at it. The second attack was on a man who had meat in his pockets and happened to come upon a hungry bear.

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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 6:33 pm 
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Joined: Tue Aug 20, 2013 3:05 pm
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Location: Canyon Country, CA
I had a friend that lived in Colorado that was killed and fed on by a Black Bear. Are Black Bear harmless? Cherry picking does not equal proof. Game and Fish Wardens as I have read are often issued Brenneke slugs for their 12 gauge shotguns that they are some times called upon to dispatch problem bears with. If you want to nit pick about words then we can fight about it if you are that type of person Randy. Just because I have a few posts does not mean I have not been shooting and hunting for most of my 69 years from Wyoming to Pennsylvania.

Rocky

List of fatal bear attacks in North America - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_fatal_bear_attacks_in_North_America


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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 9:24 pm 
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RandyWakeman wrote:
paparockcal wrote:
As to those who are putting down the 12 ga, slug I would remind you the original post was


from 8-1/2 years ago.


But the bears haven't changed much.

FWIW, I agree with Randy. Stopping a charge involves damaging something in the central nervous system. No amount of energy transfer, caliber, blood loss or tissue damage will stop the animal before it can get you. Only central nervous system damage will bring things to a halt and the best way to accomplish that is through penetration.

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 Post subject: Re: grizzly vs slug or grizzly vs bullet
PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2019 11:10 pm 
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Location: Canyon Country, CA
Zbigniew wrote:
RandyWakeman wrote:
paparockcal wrote:
As to those who are putting down the 12 ga, slug I would remind you the original post was


from 8-1/2 years ago.


But the bears haven't changed much.

FWIW, I agree with Randy. Stopping a charge involves damaging something in the central nervous system. No amount of energy transfer, caliber, blood loss or tissue damage will stop the animal before it can get you. Only central nervous system damage will bring things to a halt and the best way to accomplish that is through penetration.


Stopping a charge also involves braking bones like shoulders, spine, and pelvis as a controlled expansion or hard cast heat treated semi-solid slug/bullet travels the length of an animal to hopefully exit allowing for more rounds to follow the first. That is why the Montana Wardens went to carrying Randy Garrett 330gr .44 mag Hammerheads in their .44 Ruger handguns. It is why I carried my custom .375 H&H Magnum rifle with Nosler Partition or A-frame bullets when hunting the blow down timber of Western Wyoming and those same Randy Garrett rounds in my Ruger Super RedHawk. But I would not feel under gunned carrying an 8 shot pump 12 gauge to my friend's cabin out house loaded with 870gr. heat treated slugs either. We all have our own opinions.

As to the bears, the grizzlies where I used to hunt and where a Wyoming hunting guide was killed not long ago are the younger grizzlies that have been driven out of Yellowstone Park by the larger and more dominate males so some seem to have a mad on perhaps for having their rears whipped by those same more dominate bores. Anyway, I like seeing bears but I don't trust them as they are so unpredictable. As an old sourdough once said the only thing predictable about bears is their unpredictability. That and the Wyoming Game Dept. goes by if you shoot one you better have scratches on you or you are in DEEP TROUBLE!


[youtube] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EoOBVGWPvPQ [/youtube]




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