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Curly N

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Discussion starter · #1 ·
Sticking Mec Collet? Press binds on the upstroke? Primers pop out of their hole in the plate? Worse, your primers flip upside down?
Here is a list of possible causes, direct from MEC. You will notice that they suggest Anti-Seize. I disagree with that, but the facts are still important.


The press may catch on the upstroke for the following reasons;
1- The collet may need to be relubed with a non-migrating grease.
Factory lube works its way out of the friction zone.
Suggested lube hang in there much better, see pictures below.
2- The collet closure may be set too high and resizing too tight/small.
This should then be lowered slightly.
Usually indicated by a Ka-lunk as the handle is raised
3- The main center column may be dry and needs to be lubed with a light
coat of oil.
4- The linkage on the back side of the press may be too tight. All the
link bolts on the top of the press should be loose enough to turn by
hand.


Here is a little photo help for you. If you have the old style collet closer, it makes little difference on this info. It just looks a bit different.

All of this requires no change in the collet adjustment nor removal of the collet!

Links below pictures are big versions of the picture!

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Next step remove primer post stuff

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http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3437/340 ... 9226_o.jpg
Remove the Chain link and the E ring that retains the pin through the Collet closer Rocker arm

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Remove/slide out the Rocker Arm retaining pin enough to slip the rocker arm from the press.
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This will allow the collet closer to drop.

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http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3285/340 ... c809_o.jpg
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Now clean and lube the collet and the closer.
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On the newer models, avoid causing the collet closer nut to turn, thus altering the sizer setting.
White-Out is your friend!
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Good lubes to use!
My New favorite is the Rock and Roll Super Web Grease, get it from Amazon.
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This is the Clickable link for that grease from Amazon, a seller that I trust.

http://www.amazon.com/Rock-Roll-Super-W ... web+grease

I also Like The CMD , but their website has been down for some time. The company is still ticking along though.
#2 in my thoughts is Tri-Flow Synthetic grease, suggested by Winders, some time ago.

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This is a Clickable Amazon link for the Tri-Flow, but I prefer that you use the Super-Web

This a clickable link for the Tri-Flow grease from Amazon.Com also

Mec sold lube Not so good :cry:
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This is a link to get the MEC lube from Gamaliel
Now put it all back together without losing the hardened bushing or the parts to the chain link.
Takes about as much time as you invested in reading this.
Hope this is an assist to those with a sticking collet, hopping primers and primers flipping over after they are dropped.

Install the chain link clip with pliers
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Another trick for stopping hopping primers!
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http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3465/340 ... c98a_o.jpg
Another view:
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If you are absolutely determined that you must remove the collet, this tool that is sold by:
Ebay Seller
bumstead8269 (MEC Collet Removal Tool)
is a worthy purchase. Here is his photo of that tool.

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Here is how to use that tool:
I guess I should have explained how that tool works.
As to the EZ-out, I don't have the right one so I bought the tool. Here is how it is used.

Remove the shell lifter.
You remove the nut from the bottom of the collet.
Then you remove the nut from the threaded part of that tool.
Drop the threaded part into the collet.
Start the nut back onto the tool that is now protruding out of the bottom of the collet.
Place a wrench on the top part of the tool that is hex shaped.
Tighten the nut on the bottom of the tool tightly against the collet bottom with your other wrench.
Turn the tool and the collet with the top wrench and crank the whole mess up and out of the press through that hole that seems too small to allow the collet to pass.
After the collet is unscrewed and out of the press, you move the tool to the new collet.
But before installing the new collet you clean and lubricate the collet closer while you can do it easily.
Install the collet with the tool and adjust for proper sizing, not according to the Mec Hull checker tool but 0.005" greater than a new hull or some minimal size that works in all your guns that gauge.
Easier done than typed.

Any comments for improvement, drop a line or put a note in the thread.
Thanks


Thanks to Kosmo for this addendum to this post.
kosmo said:
A couple weeks ago, I was gifted with a MEC 9000 in 20ga that had not been used in nearly 10 years. The fellow that gave it to me told me it needed to be rebuilt. He wasn't kidding. The press was so stiff that the handle was very difficult to push down, and the gas cylinder took forever to cycle the press back up.

Needless to say, this thing was a giant ball of rust. I tore the whole thing apart down to its bits. The only thing I didn't disassemble was the turret itself. I left all of the punches and bits on it.

I cleaned the entire machine with kerosene and green scotch brite pad. I was able to get all of the rust off without many problems. I sprayed all the relevant parts down with brake clean, blew them dry with an air gun, then wiped all of the parts down with CLP to prevent future rusting. The next day, I wiped all of those parts down again with a dry rag to remove CLP residue from places that powder might collect.

I thoroughly lubricated and reassembled the press. I was quite impressed with how well everything looked and worked, given how stiff it was when I got it. That is, until I actually tried to use it.

When I went to actually reload shells, I noticed that the collet was SNAPPING open when the handle is raised, frequently causing the primers to jump out of the shell carrier plate, or flip upside down. This CANNOT be good.

I examined the system compared to my existing 12 ga 9000, and the first thing I found is that the Actuator Rod (call out #30, part number 8310, inside of the main column) was raising up too early. The interesting thing is that when I disassembled the press, I found that this rod was significantly bent. I straightened it. That was not a good idea as it turns out. The actuator rod on my 12 ga had a fair amount of resistance, so I took the column back apart and re-bent that rod. Reassemble. Better, but still no dice. The collet was well lubed, the actuator rod re-bent, collet adjusted properly. I am completely flummoxed. A call to MEC is in order.

I called MEC and explained my situation. First thing he told me is "That rod is bent on purpose. It is supposed to have some drag on the inside of the column to prevent the collet from opening too quickly and causing the primer hopping problem." I told him I made it similarly as stiff as my 12 ga (which was purchased new). He said that was obviously not my problem ...

He asked about the condition of the collet, and what I did to clean it. He asked how much of the bluing was scuffed off, and I said not much. Small patches. He then told me what he solution was:

He relayed to me that when they get a press in with a sticky collet, they take the collet itself out, chuck it in their lathe, and polish the outside of the collet with crocus cloth until all of the petals have all the bluing removed and they are shiny and smooth. The same would need to be done by hand to the inside of the collet closer. Lubricate and reassemble, and that should cure my problem.

Being I have no crocus cloth or a lathe, I was able to chuck my collet into my drill press and spin it at about 950 rpm while cleaning the outside of the collet with a piece of very fine emery cloth. I followed that up by a piece of fairly fine (320 or 400?) silicon carbide wet or dry sandpaper until it was shiny and as smooth as a baby's bottom.

I also cleaned out the collet closer with the same combination of paper, though by hand. It wasn't in nearly as bad a shape as the collet itself, so this also went quickly.

I lubed it up, reassembled it, and lo and behold, the collet stopped snapping open violently. It still opens too quickly once it is partially open, so I need to put a bit more bend into that Actuator rod so it opens as smoothly as my 12 ga.

Needless to say, this is the solution to my previously posted problem with my 600jr: https://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewto ... 3&t=243183
Get a new press! The 9000 makes nicer crimps anyways.

Summary: Leave the Actuator rod bent so it has a fair amount of drag, polish the exterior of the collet until all of the bluing is gone, polish the interior of the collet closer until all the bluing is gone. Make them super shiny and smooth. This will cure a sticky collet when lubrication alone will not stop the sticky collet syndrome.

I hope others can learn from this instead of having to learn the hard way.

--Mike
Here is an addition that was posted further down the thread but should be here so here it is.

railroad said:
I posted this under the sticky for mec 9000 maintenance, but I doubt many will notice it there, so.
After getting the primers to drop in the #2 station hole of the 9000G, I had only 1 issue left, too many primers flipping. Naturally this was caused by the collet ring snapping. I went through all the cleaning and lube points, maybe less one. Still too much snap. I finally put a drop of 90 wt gear oil on the actuating rod inside the main post. Bingo, I loaded 200 straight and did not have to turn or pick up a single primer. I think this lube point is overlooked as a cure to the snap, flip problem. It worked for me.
One thing to add, with the handle in the down position, you can put a couple of drops on the top of the actuating rod and or channel. This is located in the back of the main post of the loader. This really made a big difference for me. I hope it helps, if you are dealing with this issue.
Here is another possible problem to look for that was posted by SongDog in this thread.

https://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/viewto ... 2&start=20

song dog said:
After trying different cures for primers to jump around on a MEC 9000 GN such as collet needing cleaned and greased, rod that runs down the column needs lube, I tried all those things and it just did not seem to work on my loader ( MEC 9000 GN 20 Ga.). So I was bored today and decided to investigate my loader thoroughly. First I turned my loader 180 degs. and remounted on my bench so I could watch the actuator rod (MEC #30), the rocker arm (MEC #92) and the collet closer (MEC #95). It was easy to see that there was not enough clearance on the top fork of the rocker arm to let the roller bearing on the actuator rod pass without putting pressure on the rocker arm and collet, and causing the actuator rod to twist inside the column. Once the bearing snapped past the top fork, it would cause the collet to jump which in turn caused the primer to jump.

I figure if mine has this problem there would be others out there with the same binding problem. So I thought I would post this in hopes it might help others. This might not be a fix for all but it sure made the primers stop jumping on mine.

Here is a picture of when the problem occurs on the upstroke.
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(Picture taken with shell slide removed for clarity.)

The cure for my loader was to take the rocker arm off and file a small amount off the top fork. It took very little to get the clearance needed for the bearing to get by on the way up without snapping by.

First I had to remove chain link from collet.
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Then remove C-clip from pin holding rocker arm, remove pin and rocker arm.

Picture of rocker arm before filing.
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After filing
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After filing clearance, reassemble in reverse order and relube.

Note: This process is easier done if you remove the shell slide first ( Ramp).
 
Discussion starter · #3 ·
regularjoeinga said:
Great pics and how to. One question, what do you use to clean the collet?
Most any good solvent, really depends on where your reloader is and who else in the area is going to smell the solvent. You can also use Rags and WD-40. You should insure that any solvent is dry to reduce dilution of the grease. The real issue with the greases is to find one that hangs on without being wiped away by the action of the collet closer.
 
Discussion starter · #5 ·
regularjoeinga said:
Hey Curly, where do I purchase Tri-Flow Synthetic grease?
Tri-Flow grease

Bitty size:
http://www.amazon.com/Tri-Flow-Tri-Flow ... 962&sr=8-9

Inbetweener:
http://www.amazon.com/TriFlow-Lube-Tri- ... 034&sr=8-1

Also search here:
http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=n ... low+grease

Gunslick grease:
http://www.amazon.com/Gunslick-83012-GU ... 156&sr=1-5

Rock and Roll Super Web Grease:
https://www.amazon.com/Rock-Roll-Super- ... web+grease

Super Lube Grease:
http://www.amazon.com/SYNCO-CHEMICAL-CO ... 383&sr=8-1

Your turn :lol: Go buy something!
 
Discussion starter · #8 ·
regularjoeinga said:
Thanks Curly. Looks like a bike shop product, I'll try some local shops. Checked out the rock and roll site you like. I may order some of that nipple cream....
You will be ahead to just buy on line, unlikely that most bike shops will stock it.
 
You're tutorial just gave my Grabber a new lease on life. I bought it used after many thousands of rounds and didn't know any better - The primers flipped in the tray and once they dropped, the handle stuck on the upstroke, and every motion was dramatic. I assumed this was normal.

After the clean and lube, none of those problems exist. I couldn't believe how smooth everything was! The primers all drop in place and I can load 100 at a time with no problems. Even the charge bar seems to move much more smoothly. I loaded 8 boxes tonight in no time flat.

Many thanks!

Tim
 
Discussion starter · #10 ·
tmmiller57 said:
You're tutorial just gave my Grabber a new lease on life. I bought it used after many thousands of rounds and didn't know any better - The primers flipped in the tray and once they dropped, the handle stuck on the upstroke, and every motion was dramatic. I assumed this was normal.

After the clean and lube, none of those problems exist. I couldn't believe how smooth everything was! The primers all drop in place and I can load 100 at a time with no problems. Even the charge bar seems to move much more smoothly. I loaded 8 boxes tonight in no time flat.

Many thanks!

Tim
That's why I did it! Anything missing that I need to add? I had no clue until asked, that someone might not be familiar with a chain link dis-assembly.
Are you using the chain pull primer feeder or the new 200 primer model?
 
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Discussion starter · #13 ·
Rastoff said:
Thanks again Curly! I also just got a used Grabber and this will help tremendously.
Yes, but I cannot do anything to help you remember to:
Watch the primer! No primer, find out why!
watch the powder, when you add primers, fill the bottles, both of them!
Insert the wad
Turn the shell carrier.
Segregate the 6 and 8 point hulls.
Inspect for loaded shell quality with the shell carrier full, it can make a difference.
Use your scale.
Use a PC powder baffle, the red plastic one.
Place 3 flat washers under the bar return spring clip to increase return spring strength, and increases the sound of the bar working
 
Curly-Nohair said:
Rastoff said:
Thanks again Curly! I also just got a used Grabber and this will help tremendously.
Yes, but I cannot do anything to help you remember to:
Watch the primer! No primer, find out why!
watch the powder, when you add primers, fill the bottles, both of them!
Insert the wad
Turn the shell carrier.
Segregate the 6 and 8 point hulls.
Inspect for loaded shell quality with the shell carrier full, it can make a difference.
Use your scale.
Use a PC powder baffle, the red plastic one.
All good points and I'm on the learning curve.

Even with the 600 Jr, I developed a habit of loading both shot and powder containers at the same time. I mean, I'm standing up, I might as well do both, right? :wink:

I only have the 8 point hulls so, that's not an issue. Even though my loader did come with a 6 point crimp set up as well, I don't see myself using it in the near future.

I have a powder baffle, but it's the metal one. So far it's delivering very consistent drops (+/-2 grains).

Curly-Nohair said:
Place 3 flat washers under the bar return spring clip to increase return spring strength, and increases the sound of the bar working
I'm not sure where you mean to insert the washers. This sounds like another good idea, but I don't have a "clip" on my return spring. There is a hook on the loader and a flat thingy bolted to the end of the charge bar. The spring I think you are referring to is attached to both of those.
 
Discussion starter · #15 ·
Take the flat thingy off, put 3 washers between it and the bar.
 
I assume that you lubricated the outside of the collet only or was there more? Just squeeze it from the tube or use an applicator? I have a supersizer that sticks and what I tried (oils) didnt work

thanks for the effort it took to put this together!
 
Discussion starter · #18 ·
Rastoff said:
Curly-Nohair said:
Take the flat thingy off, put 3 washers between it and the bar.
OK, I get it now.
Duz it look like this?
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This is not my idea, I read something that Case wrote, did it, took the picture. I ain't stealing this from nobody.
 
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