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21 - 38 of 38 Posts
Honestly I don't want a cheap plastic case, I'd rather them send the gun in a cardboard box and cut the price by $50. I will then go buy the case I want which usually costs a lot more then $50 anyway. In fact my O/Us that do come in a case usually collect dust until I throw them away. I'll use one of my Americases to transport my guns not the crap they send me.

If you're wanting features of a clay gun (trap, sporting, skeet) try looking at a clay sports gun. A Browning Citori Feather isn't one, it's a field gun and the butt plate you described is what I want on a field gun and what I have on all my field guns. You're asking for features of a skeet/sporting gun but on a lightweight field gun. This doesn't exist. Furthermore a decent clay gun is north of the $1800-2000 price range. Brownings and Beretta clay guns are usually $2500-3500+

The same is also true for the right/left handed guns. Often field guns are "ambidextrous" but the clay guns aren't. Neither my Browning Citori or Beretta sporting/skeet guns would be fun for a left handed shooter.

I don't know what a "popcorn choke tube" is. Never heard of it. Can't picture it, and I don't have a damn clue what you expect a choke tube to look like. They have one function and I don't know what more you're expecting from them? Are you wanting your new gun to come with Muller or Briley chokes? Do you not like flush fit or extended choke tubes? I don't know how to answer your question or complaint because it makes no sense to me.

Your problem with at least some of your issues is you're looking at the wrong guns. If you want a field gun buy one, but don't expect it to have the features a clay gun will. It's not what it's intended purpose is. It's suppose to be light, without the bells and whistles that just add weight. A clay gun is typically heavy, and has the features you want. Guess what, they cost more. I know it's crazy they would charge more for a gun with more features but so does EVERY manufacturer of really any product. A base model Ford work truck is cheaper then Ford King Ranch for a reason I guess.

Browning discontinued O/Us??? You have to be specific! Are you speaking of the older Citoris like the 425 as an example? If you are they're discontinued because they have new models available. Ford doesn't make a 1997 Mustang with the 2V 4.6L V8 today for a reason. Same goes for older Browning/Beretta models.

I Shoot skeet and honestly shoot factory choke tubes, and use factory butt pads (at least until they wear out). I've run 100s and have done well in at least some registered shoots. I primarily shoot through Briley sub gauge tubes but I don't see a real advantage in upgrading the items you listed. However I don't shoot skeet with a field gun and unless I'm brushing up for hunting season never will.

Hope this helps.
 
Discussion starter · #22 ·
Multiflora said:
What is a "popcorn choke tube"?

Who would purchase a $4000 plastic gun case?

Why does a caged bird sing?
Nobody said anything about a $4000 gun case, honestly, you misread the post.

OK; The term "Popcorn choke tubes" came about in the mid-1970's Winchester introduced the Win-choke that were pure crap. Then came Browning's short invector tubes followed by Remington. All were made by jobbers pumping them out like popcorn on a worn out lathe in some guys poll barn. The same went for the Winchester AA plastic wads molded in pole barns. Haven't you ever asked yourself how the massive, so called, higher quality choke tube industry got started? Briley saw a big bucks industry very early in the game.

Just like Hollywood, that bird in a cage sings for it's supper or starves to death.
 
Scatergun71 said:
OK; The term "Popcorn choke tubes" came about in the mid-1970's Winchester introduced the Win-choke that were pure crap. Then came Browning's short invector tubes followed by Remington. All were made by jobbers pumping them out like popcorn on a worn out lathe in some guys poll barn. The same went for the Winchester AA plastic wads molded in pole barns.
You just don't have any clue whatsoever, and your "cheap opportunist" remark has no basis in reality. Are pole barns your specialty, or just your Mossberg 930?
 
OK. Well my Beretta 686 Onyx Pro Trap came with one of those cheap blue plastic cases.
If it raised the price $50 then it was still a good deal. I bought a $12 gun sock to help protect the gun in said case while transporting the gun in the trunk of my car and the protection offered by both sock and cheap hard plastic is more than adequate.
 
OK. Well my Beretta 686 Onyx Pro Trap came with one of those cheap blue plastic cases.
If it raised the price $50 then it was still a good deal. I bought a $12 gun sock to help protect the gun in said case while transporting the gun in the trunk of my car and the protection offered by both sock and cheap hard plastic is more than adequate.
I have owned 3 Beretta's with those cheap blue cases and all in all they did a fine job of protection and lightweight,slender transport.
And just for the record mine came with 4 extended Optima tubes that if purchased separately would drive the cost up $200.
The Browning CX comes with 3 extended Midas Inv.+ tubes in spite of the low cost of the gun.
I doubt Briley or any other expensive aftermarket choke tube offers any noticeable improvement over those tubes.
 
Scatergun71 said:
Nobody said anything about a $4000 gun case, honestly, you misread the post.

OK; The term "Popcorn choke tubes" came about in the mid-1970's Winchester introduced the Win-choke that were pure crap. Then came Browning's short invector tubes followed by Remington. All were made by jobbers pumping them out like popcorn on a worn out lathe in some guys poll barn. The same went for the Winchester AA plastic wads molded in pole barns. Haven't you ever asked yourself how the massive, so called, higher quality choke tube industry got started? Briley saw a big bucks industry very early in the game.

Just like Hollywood, that bird in a cage sings for it's supper or starves to death.
I see you have never owned a bird.
The overblown silliness and contrived rant re choke tubes and wads indicates that you should consider purchasing one.
Or, a fish might be better.
 
Haven't you ever asked yourself how the massive, so called, higher quality choke tube industry got started? Briley saw a big bucks industry very early in the game.
There are, and will always be, people who believe, whether they are right or they are wrong, that almost anything 'aftermarket' is always better than almost anything OEM.
Also most (probably 99%) of those people have no way in the world of testing their 'belief' to see if it is true or B.S.

That behavior drives a heck of a lot more "markets" than just choke tubes..............
 
OldStufferA5#1911 said:
Haven't you ever asked yourself how the massive, so called, higher quality choke tube industry got started? Briley saw a big bucks industry very early in the game.
There are, and will always be, people who believe, whether they are right or they are wrong, that almost anything 'aftermarket' is always better than almost anything OEM.
Also most (probably 99%) of those people have no way in the world of testing their 'belief' to see if it is true or B.S.

That behavior drives a heck of a lot more "markets" than just choke tubes..............
+1

And 99% of those who rant over those subjects have a grand total of ZERO manufacturing experience.
 
Discussion starter · #30 ·
RandyWakeman said:
Scatergun71 said:
OK; The term "Popcorn choke tubes" came about in the mid-1970's Winchester introduced the Win-choke that were pure crap. Then came Browning's short invector tubes followed by Remington. All were made by jobbers pumping them out like popcorn on a worn out lathe in some guys poll barn. The same went for the Winchester AA plastic wads molded in pole barns.
You just don't have any clue whatsoever, and your "cheap opportunist" remark has no basis in reality. Are pole barns your specialty, or just your Mossberg 930?
I don't understand this guy Randy at all. He just sounds so angry and sarcastic. The Mossberg 930 is my grandsons gun and it has been sold! I shoot nothing but the best target guns for 35 years but I can't lift the heavy guns anymore. And I you want to dispute my claims of poorly made choke tubes and plastic wads, that's fine, but at least do some research first. It really was a jobber industry and still is today.
There have been many post on a multitude of forums that I would disagree with. But, I would never write on them with condescension or condemnation.
 
Scatergun71 said:
But, I would never write on them with condescension or condemnation.
You have already done just that. What is this peculiar theory of "cheap opportunist"? Is that a compliment in some alternative universe?

Where would you get the strange idea that choke tubes and shotshell wads come from "some guy's polebarn"? Nothing could be further from the truth. Yet, you have chosen to spout the cheap opportunist and pole barn nonsense, anyway, clearly not only baseless and divorced from reality, but ripe with condescension and condemnation.
 
I have a couple of Beretta O/U's that came in those "cheap plastic cases". And just bought a LNIC Browning Gold Fusion that comes in one.

In the competitive marketplace I don't think it adds much at all if any to the price of the gun compared to one that comes in a cardboard box.

Personally I like them. I store my guns in a safe; and normally transport them in Boyt Harness Canvas type Gun Case or one of their breakdown cases. But from time to time I'll use the plastic case the gun came in. I find them well made, rugged and practical.

As for the popcorn chokes statements, I'm not sure where to start. Except it's generally ludicrous. Do I think Trulock and Briley make great chokes? And Muller? Absolutely. And there's times I'll buy them.

But most all of my factory Remington; Beretta; and Browning chokes have been well made and work well.

I haven't been to anywhere near as many gun factories as Wakeman has. But I've been in a couple of Remington factories and the new Ithaca plant in Ohio. And spent much of my career as a mechanical engineer in manufacturing or in plant design and construction. I can assure you these guys don't make a Wingmaster, Citori, or M37 and then shop out the chokes to guys "in pole barns".
 
The pattern board tells no lies. I've patterned all the choke tubes I own from Briley/Muller to OEM. I honestly don't know why you think OEM chokes are garbage. The upper end aftermarket did pattern better but the OEM did well too. By far not garbage.
 
I don't know were your coming from scat. I had a Winchester in the mid 70's and a Mossi shotgun. The Wini accounted for a lot of dead game with the Wini chokes I'm 67 and have hunted since 12 years old and have never heard of Popcorn chokes. Mossi was a fixed choke. Did you have a Winchester in the 70's or is it something you read. I wouldn't use a Factory hunting choke for clay's any way.
 
Another thing is the included plastic cases are really designed more as a shipping container with very tight compartments. Need to increase the length of pull on your gun to make it fit you? At least in my case the guns do not fit back in their plastic cases. Running long extended chokes for turkey or waterfowl? Will the barrel fit back it into its slot? Maybe. Maybe not. Like to use your plastic case to hold a gun from a different manufacturer? Good luck! If the included plastic "shipping container" works for you fantastic. For me it's a dust collector that sits in the corner until I sell the gun that came in it while I use general purpose better shotgun cases that multiple shotguns can fit into depending on what I'm shooting that day.
 
it's funny to me that people call chokes "crap" who cannot and will never shoot well enough to know.

Chokes are so low tech that it's ALWAYS silly when we spend page after page defending which ones to use.

Only rule : Use enough.
 
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