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21 - 40 of 42 Posts
VTHokiesDuckHunter said:
Clink54 said:
I have an old Citori with fixed chokes (F/M). I broke my first 25 straight shooting the modified barrel. I had read numerous articles that stated switching to a full choke would improve my confidence and accuracy. So, I made the switch and my scores declined about two or three birds per 25. I was averaging about 22.

After a month of shooting nothing but full choke my scores began to return to their old average. In another 6 weeks, the scores began a slow crawl upwards. Yesterday, I shot 49/50 with 42 straight.

Anecdotal evidence with a low statistical sample size shouldn't convince anyone to change their shooting style, but it seems to be working for me. My brain expects to see smoke, and my eyes move my hands to achieve that expectation.
Yes - but you didn't change GUNS and CHokes! The OP did!

Like I said. It could be some factor related to confidence. It almost certainly wasn't the difference in CONSTRICTION between IM and FULL.

However; since these were both fixed choke guns, the actual construction may be quite different when shot compared to how it's marked.

But the OP went from a Browning to a Remington.

From a Field Gun set up to a Trap gun set up.he said it was a BPS trap GUN

Surely you guys, considering those facts, aren't going to keep arguing that a FULL choke in the Remington caused more ink balls causing more confidence leading to higher scores ........than the mediocre breaks from an Improved Mod choke.....

That would be crazy.
 
Jim Miller said:
Do you believe that the full choke caused you to hit more birds or the fact that you were shooting regularly?
No, because I didn't increase my number of visits to the club, nor did I shoot more rounds.

In my opinion, shooting a tighter pattern requires the shooter to concentrate a little more. It's certainly not magic.

Consistent ink balls confirms that you're performing the fundamentals, plus gives you more confidence in your skills. We all know that this game is won by the shooter with the most confidence, skills, and consistency.
 
Clink54 said:
I have an old Citori with fixed chokes (F/M). I broke my first 25 straight shooting the modified barrel. I had read numerous articles that stated switching to a full choke would improve my confidence and accuracy. So, I made the switch and my scores declined about two or three birds per 25. I was averaging about 22. After a month of shooting nothing but full choke my scores began to return to their old average. In another 6 weeks, the scores began a slow crawl upwards. Yesterday, I shot 49/50 with 42 straight.
Jim Miller said:
The more you shoot, the better you get,.....
I think Jim has it right.
Clink, try this: go back to using the Modified barrel and see what your scores do. I'd bet money they don't drop....which would indicate your scores improved because you were just shooting better because of more targets under your belt....not because of the choke change.
 
Clink

You have learned how to focus, creating the discipline to center the targets better. The key to your improvement has been spending more point time at the target not just more target experience. Those shooting with poor form, poor handling, poor focus only creates bad habits and usual suspect for a lifetime of low to mid-range scores.

Your on the right path brother.

Those that don't get the choke message or figure how to shoot well are not your competition. Their massage create a need for lower classes and short yardage. You beat them just with your confidence. Having learned how to consistently mount the gun, move it properly and see the shot before triggering will make for a lifetime of top scores.

Don't pay any attention to those shoot like crap experts. They are just too smart to get it. :wink:

Maltz
 
High Lakes said:
Don't pay any attention to those shoot like crap experts. They are just too smart to get it. Their massage create a need for lower classes and short yardage.
Maltz
....says the trapshooter from Iowa who once wrote this:
maltzahn said:
I respect all those in clay target shooting sports that participate. Doesn't matter at what level. Maltz
:lol:
I guess he meant he respects all those in clay target shooting sports that agree with him. Those that have a different opinion; not so much.
 
mudpack said:
Clink54 said:
I have an old Citori with fixed chokes (F/M). I broke my first 25 straight shooting the modified barrel. I had read numerous articles that stated switching to a full choke would improve my confidence and accuracy. So, I made the switch and my scores declined about two or three birds per 25. I was averaging about 22. After a month of shooting nothing but full choke my scores began to return to their old average. In another 6 weeks, the scores began a slow crawl upwards. Yesterday, I shot 49/50 with 42 straight.
Jim Miller said:
The more you shoot, the better you get,.....
I think Jim has it right.
Clink, try this: go back to using the Modified barrel and see what your scores do. I'd bet money they don't drop....which would indicate your scores improved because you were just shooting better because of more targets under your belt....not because of the choke change.
Once again; he was not changing just chokes; but guns.

If the OP wants to shoot the same gun, but with a different barrel (since he said it was a fixed choke bbl); than one could make some kind of determination.

Otherwise it's like saying my Corvette with 20" tires goes faster than your Malibu with 18" tires; so 20"'tires make you go faster.
 
Respect those that actually shoot trap, more respect to those that have accomplishments. No respect or regard for those self-appointed internet experts that hide behind user names, shooting off their mouth more than 12 ga ammo. likely an arrogant skeet shooter with a troubled attitude.

Maltz
 
maltzahn said:
Respect those that actually shoot trap, more respect to those that have accomplishments. No respect or regard for those self-appointed internet experts that hide behind user names, shooting off their mouth more than 12 ga ammo. likely an arrogant skeet shooter with a troubled attitude. Maltz
So, you don't actually "respect all"?

I'm also reminded of this post:
maltzahn said:
Its the arrogance of thinking that (your) area is the heart of the sport and all others in the game are second class citizens.
Ironic, no?

Wondering who is really the one with the troubled attitude....
 
Feeling sorry for you, mudpack....bad intention blather will not help you hit a targets. Following my lead could. Until proven to those reading that you can shoot better scores applying contrarian theory. Petty jealousy will remain an ugly thing. Conversation is about contribution. Having positive and proven answers more enlightening than mean spirited posting.

This is not just my way, it is about those that shoot in the top 2% of all trap shooters. What I post is what has been learned by the trapshooting elite. Those that you pay for advise from. All Americans, offering books, clinics and or videos. If you have studied a little, applied what was learned to your shooting. This nasty attitude business would be forgotten.

Maltz
 
mudpack said:
Clink54 said:
I have an old Citori with fixed chokes (F/M). I broke my first 25 straight shooting the modified barrel. I had read numerous articles that stated switching to a full choke would improve my confidence and accuracy. So, I made the switch and my scores declined about two or three birds per 25. I was averaging about 22. After a month of shooting nothing but full choke my scores began to return to their old average. In another 6 weeks, the scores began a slow crawl upwards. Yesterday, I shot 49/50 with 42 straight.
Jim Miller said:
The more you shoot, the better you get,.....
I think Jim has it right.
Clink, try this: go back to using the Modified barrel and see what your scores do. I'd bet money they don't drop....which would indicate your scores improved because you were just shooting better because of more targets under your belt....not because of the choke change.
I'll go back to a modified choke on Saturday and see what happens. If my theory is true then I should see a slight increase in scores over a hundred targets. Either way, I'll continue to practice with a tighter choke. Thanks for your suggestions.
 
High Lakes said:
Clink

You have learned how to focus, creating the discipline to center the targets better. The key to your improvement has been spending more point time at the target not just more target experience. Those shooting with poor form, poor handling, poor focus only creates bad habits and usual suspect for a lifetime of low to mid-range scores.

Your on the right path brother.

Those that don't get the choke message or figure how to shoot well are not your competition. Their massage create a need for lower classes and short yardage. You beat them just with your confidence. Having learned how to consistently mount the gun, move it properly and see the shot before triggering will make for a lifetime of top scores.

Don't pay any attention to those shoot like crap experts. They are just too smart to get it. :wink:

Maltz
Thanks Maltz.
 
[/quote] I'll go back to a modified choke on Saturday and see what happens. If my theory is true then I should see a slight increase in scores over a hundred targets. [/quote]

100 targets won't prove anything. If you look at Neil Winston's extensive choke testing you will discover that the difference between a full and a modified choke at 35 yards is that the modified pattern limits are increased a couple of inches but the number of pellets in those 2 inches are so sparse that the likelihood of one of them being a "magic" pellet that breaks a target is minuscule. What does happen is that about 10-15 pellets move out of the hot center into the 10"-20" ring which again is a very tiny improvement in pellets per square inch available for a slightly off center hit. However, the reduction in pellets in the hot 10"center is reduced so you may not smoke as many targets with your centered hits.

Now, what all this means is that there really is no material improvement in breaking more targets with a M or IM choke but if you like smoke, a full has a better chance of providing that with centered hits.

In short, if you want to break more targets, put more lead down the barrel regardless of what choke is stuck in the end of it.
 
So once again I will ask this - how ARE you going to go back to a MOD choke? A new barrel on the Wingmaster TB with an identical bbl except choked MOD vs the one on it now? Or do you plan to shoot the BPS?

You really can't shoot two different brands of guns and make any kind of statistically valid determination whatsoever.
 
VTHokiesDuckHunter said:
So once again I will ask this - how ARE you going to go back to a MOD choke? A new barrel on the Wingmaster TB with an identical bbl except choked MOD vs the one on it now? Or do you plan to shoot the BPS?

You really can't shoot two different brands of guns and make any kind of statistically valid determination whatsoever.
Good point....

The title of this thread could just as well have read: "I improved my average with....practice."
 
I'm in the full choke camp. I tried a modified choke and found that my scores dropped so back to full and I am here to stay. I hear the other sides argument but it didn't work out that way for me when I tried it. I respect Big Leo and Maltz when they say full choke! Full choke forces me to focus and concentrate on the shot and gives me real time feedback that reinforces my sight picture at the point of firing.

Mud, how about sharing your ATA number with us so we can see if your a shooter or something else?
 
This is an endless debate, open vs tight choke in trapshooting.

What I see from coaching young shooters. This choke decision is based on confidence. Those short on confidence see the more open choke as a way to gain advantage through bigger patterns delivered to a target. That percentage is based on equipment.

Those that have confidence have gained it through proof of improved technique and focus. They then look for ways to continue confidence. To prove what they have confidence in is sound. Thereto extend confidence.

To those that look at how the target breaks as proof become relaxed and more certain. They also recognize when effort is short or failing buy the same measure.....How the target breaks. Chips and chunks are a warning to get up to speed with effort and focus. Fewer lost targets just based on being able to measure your work.

With new shooters its always about creating confidence. First with their equipment choices, then in their technique. Experienced shooters either decide they will never be great or make an effort every shot to get to great and try to stay there.

Anytime I talk to a shooter about choke selection it is easy to understand at what level of skill they are at. Skill is related to confidence, confidence is related to measure. Around and around we go. :roll:

Maltz
 
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