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You're a newbie! Congrats!

I've hunted wild pheasants every single year since 1967. I started with a cut-down Crescent SxS .410. Killing a Wild Pheasant with a Shotgun . Over the years, I've used (in the lead dept.) #7-1/2, 6, 5, and 4s.

Dad and Great-Grandpa were very, very close and after our pheasant and rabbit hunting, we would always settle in for good visit with Great-Grandpa; George Chamberlain Wakeman. Those were some wonderful, memorable days. A .410 generally sucks for upland hunting, but a shotgun that doesn't fit sucks even more. It was back then that I learned that if a shotgun doesn't fit you, the best you can do is take it behind the barn and shoot it, meaning at it, or use diesel fuel and matches. The misery of a poor-fitting shotgun needs to be eradicated, and it can't be too soon.

Though many shotguns and ammo combinations can take a wild pheasant, far fewer are ideal for the task. Ideal is one shot and a wild rooster that falls dead, anything less is somewhat less than ideal. Back in those days, we didn't use dogs and often hunted standing corn. With beautiful, ratty, wide fence rows and thick grass covered ditches, the hunting was quite good. For the standing corn hunting, back then the row crops were not planted close together, so walking it was not a problem. The rule of thumb in standing corn was hit him once on the way up and once again on the way down, for if he doesn't drop dead sans dogs there will be a lot of time spent trying to find him-- which was far from a certainty.

I have a tremendous disdain for #6 shot-- too many runners. What other people use is up to them: I could not care less, not my business, not my concern. My great-grandfather, grandfather, father, and myself all came to the same conclusion based on experience. That's three lifetimes of experience and counting. #4 shot is outstandingly good: it requires a bit heavier payload than I care to use, with the exception of the 12 gauge only 1-1/4 oz. Rooster XR load.
Then I guess you need to learn how to shoot.
 
You're a newbie! Congrats!

I've hunted wild pheasants every single year since 1967. I started with a cut-down Crescent SxS .410. Killing a Wild Pheasant with a Shotgun . Over the years, I've used (in the lead dept.) #7-1/2, 6, 5, and 4s.

Dad and Great-Grandpa were very, very close and after our pheasant and rabbit hunting, we would always settle in for good visit with Great-Grandpa; George Chamberlain Wakeman. Those were some wonderful, memorable days. A .410 generally sucks for upland hunting, but a shotgun that doesn't fit sucks even more. It was back then that I learned that if a shotgun doesn't fit you, the best you can do is take it behind the barn and shoot it, meaning at it, or use diesel fuel and matches. The misery of a poor-fitting shotgun needs to be eradicated, and it can't be too soon.

Though many shotguns and ammo combinations can take a wild pheasant, far fewer are ideal for the task. Ideal is one shot and a wild rooster that falls dead, anything less is somewhat less than ideal. Back in those days, we didn't use dogs and often hunted standing corn. With beautiful, ratty, wide fence rows and thick grass covered ditches, the hunting was quite good. For the standing corn hunting, back then the row crops were not planted close together, so walking it was not a problem. The rule of thumb in standing corn was hit him once on the way up and once again on the way down, for if he doesn't drop dead sans dogs there will be a lot of time spent trying to find him-- which was far from a certainty.

I have a tremendous disdain for #6 shot-- too many runners. What other people use is up to them: I could not care less, not my business, not my concern. My great-grandfather, grandfather, father, and myself all came to the same conclusion based on experience. That's three lifetimes of experience and counting. #4 shot is outstandingly good: it requires a bit heavier payload than I care to use, with the exception of the 12 gauge only 1-1/4 oz. Rooster XR load.
If #6 is so poor, why is everything I shoot dead before they hit the ground? Yesterday we had a solid 15-20mph wind, still anchored birds cleanly.
 
If #6 is so poor, why is everything I shoot dead before they hit the ground? Yesterday we had a solid 15-20mph wind, still anchored birds cleanly.
You are either fortunate or a much, much better shot than most. Back in the day I murdered plenty of white tails with a little .222 and would have responded the same way if someone suggested .30-something was better for both Bambi and me.
 
I could not agree more. You fifty year record of never losing a flushed wild pheasant most likely makes you the most bestess pheasant shooter in the world.

Although my late grandmother, too the best of my knowledge, never did either.
You were the one that started this thread.

If you are going to quote what I stated and make comments, that is fine. But don't lie about what I stated. Anyone who hunts birds has had misses and has had birds that need a dog to run it down, which I have already stated.

Maybe you also need to brush up on your reading skills.
 
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......Butif you ever care to kill pheasants and can accommodate a pricey "lodge" hunt in SD they generally chase wild birds and do it right..........
Hard to best mowed paths, rectangular patches of cover, school buses and a nice dinner, eh?
Predictability tho may be the real draw for many folks re a 'lodge' shoot.

Personally, I do not think that they, the pricey lodges, "do it right" at all....I think they, and so the customers, often miss, by reviews, the finest reasons for being there.......well beyond pictures at a tailgate/lodge sign or belches and smoke rings post bellying up to a groaning table of fine food well prepared.

'Course that requires that one put every lodge in the same bucket....just as everyone loves to put all days at pheasant, or whatever bird, in the same bucket of how it is done, what shots one takes, difficulties of many measures, reactions of birds...not to mention all gun and load stuff being reduced to gauge or load, 3" or action....old school or new(expensive but proportionally small) death blows.
Yikes, how boring....and how wrong the generalizations.

It just seems a shame, to me, that success or shooting equations are more and more a hub upon which the hunt or shoot spins.

I just returned from 5 too short days in an area familiar to me for 25+ years and 35 years or so for a buddy.
The farms again varied in cover quality and birds but the people who live there never varied in other than age and health and life blows....any success or failure on the day simply falling as a point on a curve best relegated to the worth of a used hull...12, 20, 16 or that wunderkind, the 28.
Fwliw, I missed upon ocassion...failed to limit out on dead pheasants...with 12 and a 16.....in deep cold or high winds or swell 40s being no excuse just realities.

However, I never missed seeing my own birddog's eyes with a young and buried but pointed pheasant inches from his nose when deep in a protected waterway.
Nor did I miss a buddy's 12 year old setter's success on short hunts befitting her own reality of being near kidney shut down but a few months before.
I did not miss ground owls lumbering aloft, a newly met but older farmer lady named Mary Kay who said "sure, just stay away from the cows" or boot-legged rye whiskey.
I learned about foursquare houses, red clover, sadness, joy, better days ahead and the predictability of good people when well respected.
I laughed, groaned and shed a tear through it all....at the beauty of place and wind, of being there and, especially, of watching dogs of several ages and personalities lead the way in true effort and real reward....as but a start of a long list.

Gun & load....tailgate or bagged birds....just do not cut it as defining any day over many decades for me, as appears to be oh, so popular on the 'Net.
It is good, or appears so to me, to look beyond high fives or "this is best" to the more meaningful and longer lasting............"I understand".
 
What a combination, 26 posts, choke question about pheasants, Mr. Wakeman is involved.......what was I thinking??? Not much I guess.
 
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Hard to best mowed paths, rectangular patches of cover, school buses and a nice dinner, eh?
Predictability tho may be the real draw for many folks re a 'lodge' shoot.

Personally, I do not think that they, the pricey lodges, "do it right" at all....I think they, and so the customers, often miss, by reviews, the finest reasons for being there.......well beyond pictures at a tailgate/lodge sign or belches and smoke rings post bellying up to a groaning table of fine food well prepared.

'Course that requires that one put every lodge in the same bucket....just as everyone loves to put all days at pheasant, or whatever bird, in the same bucket of how it is done, what shots one takes, difficulties of many measures, reactions of birds...not to mention all gun and load stuff being reduced to gauge or load, 3" or action....old school or new(expensive but proportionally small) death blows.
Yikes, how boring....and how wrong the generalizations.

It just seems a shame, to me, that success or shooting equations are more and more a hub upon which the hunt or shoot spins.

I just returned from 5 too short days in an area familiar to me for 25+ years and 35 years or so for a buddy.
The farms again varied in cover quality and birds but the people who live there never varied in other than age and health and life blows....any success or failure on the day simply falling as a point on a curve best relegated to the worth of a used hull...12, 20, 16 or that wunderkind, the 28.
Fwliw, I missed upon ocassion...failed to limit out on dead pheasants...with 12 and a 16.....in deep cold or high winds or swell 40s being no excuse just realities.

However, I never missed seeing my own birddog's eyes with a young and buried but pointed pheasant inches from his nose when deep in a protected waterway.
Nor did I miss a buddy's 12 year old setter's success on short hunts befitting her own reality of being near kidney shut down but a few months before.
I did not miss ground owls lumbering aloft, a newly met but older farmer lady named Mary Kay who said "sure, just stay away from the cows" or boot-legged rye whiskey.
I learned about foursquare houses, red clover, sadness, joy, better days ahead and the predictability of good people when well respected.
I laughed, groaned and shed a tear through it all....at the beauty of place and wind, of being there and, especially, of watching dogs of several ages and personalities lead the way in true effort and real reward....as but a start of a long list.

Gun & load....tailgate or bagged birds....just do not cut it as defining any day over many decades for me, as appears to be oh, so popular on the 'Net.
It is good, or appears so to me, to look beyond high fives or "this is best" to the more meaningful and longer lasting............"I understand".
No offense intended towards wild-bird hunting the Hard Way. My correspondent had general pheasant questions that I hope were addressed with some accuracy. I don't know him and didn't invite him to my next pheasant hunt. Please note my free advice included a money-back warranty.

While there are probably good pheasant guides for a Back East hunter to engage I personally don't know a competent bird hunter with no pheasant experience would find one, much less a real bird hunt as you eloquently describe. I know plenty of well-heeled gunners with skill sets across the spectrum with no dogs or places to hunt that have used SD lodges and had "fair chase" hunts to the best available degree, with hunters and blockers shooting wild birds off true agricultural lands. The hunts are expensive, but the infrastructure costs are, too. I count myself as fortunate as my Kansas circle mostly hunts junkyard pheasant (the meanest type) on small patches of cover within a large geographical area. Until AirBnb made life easier we stayed in pretty seedy motels, the only ones that allow valuable hunting dogs to sleep (safely) indoors, and pheasants cleaned in the bathtubs during too-cold nights with our promise to hotel management that we would clean the tubs out.

What I do know is that hunting pen-raised birds (in those mowed blocks of short grass that you reference) is just as sporting and challenging as hunting high-fence, pen raised Colorado elk or caged South African leopards. It's not much of an exaggeration to compare those hunts to shooting barnyard chickens; not a bad dog-training exercise if the hunt is only for the dogs, and sadly the best a lot of hunters without your experience can find online at a reasonable cost. My correspondent presented himself as a real hunter and I am as as happy to suggest a high-dollar fair chase hunt as I am to discourage the less expensive slaughter of domestic fowl.



But I know a little bout planted game farm birds and certainly discourage hunting fresh pen-raised birds. Those locations have the manicured fields
 
Then I guess you need to learn how to shoot.
Randy Wakeman and Chuck Hawks are the most respected pheasant (and shotgun) influencers/internet writers of the past twenty years of the internet. Since your arrogance and vitriol has damaged your nom de guerre on this site, and since I like you, I checked. You can use "Jesus Christ, Superstar.com" going forward and no one will ever know...
 
Mean "junkyard pheasants"...caged leopards and cleaning pheasants in bathtubs?

Ime, birddogs are often happier in their good boxes, given reasonable weather conditions, water and food.

A 'guide' can lower a learning curve but many average folks, like me, can take advantage of wiha-type programs where haying/grazing has not been the need ....and do ok+.
Seldom is anything reduced to an either-or situation for any particular.

"pen-raised" are not only found in blocks....or larger set-asides....or Preserves....and not all of them mimic barnyard fowl.
Generalities...lead nowhere good or helpful, imo.

What often matters most is the state and their requirements...or blessings.....combined with the attitude of the birdhunter.

Fwiw, dogchaser37 knows his subject.
No one needs to agree with 100% of any post-----with....few....posters looking for followers.
 
You are either fortunate or a much, much better shot than most. Back in the day I murdered plenty of white tails with a little .222 and would have responded the same way if someone suggested .30-something was better for both Bambi and me.
I do consider myself a rather good shot, however I can generally gauge distance better than most as well which probably has a lot to do with it. I'm also blessed with two very steady German Pointers. But I am still awaiting Randals usual rambling response that is going to include some data from the 70's to prove 6's are garbage and will bounce off birds.
 
Mean "junkyard pheasants"...caged leopards and cleaning pheasants in bathtubs?





A 'guide' can lower a learning curve but many folks can take advantage of wiha-type programs where haying/grazing has not been the need ....and do ok+. Since pheasant are so different from bobwhites I would be surprised if an otherwise competent nimrod walked for three days of daylight by himself and put up a rooster within shooting range. OK-. YMMV. I dislike the idea of paying $3K to kill 9 SD roosters less than I dislike the idea of making a trip-of-a-lifetime a total washoutl



"pen-raised" are not only found in blocks....or larger set-asides....or Preserves....and not all mimic barnyard fowl.
Generalities...lead nowhere good or helpful, imo.
What often matters most is the state and their requirements...or blessings.....combined with the attitude of the birdhunter. Pen raised pheasants (and chuckars) fed daily by humans will actually walk towards hunters late in the day. If you have spotted any acting wild I am happy for you. Most that survive the days' hunts become coyote buffet offerings.

Mean "junkyard pheasants"...caged leopards A wealthy friend who hunts SA swears that shooting caged animals is an option and cleaning pheasants in bathtubs? A fun question. The owner of a small town, struggling motel survives with the sure of fall and winter pheasant hunters. She understands dogs will sleep in the rooms, pheasants will be cleaned (on a Harbor Freight tarp) in the rooms, and niceties dispensed with as necessary.
We leave generous tips for Housekeeping, of course! And make sure the drains do not become clogged.

"junkyard pheasants". As you certainly know "wild" pheasants gravitate to abandoned barns, irrigation and farm equipment. If my farmer trusts me to hunt structure I will kill more of these long-tailed agricultural pests for him. Pheasants need "structure" like a largemouth bass in a vast lake and hunting around building and equipment is always prudent. A biologist explained to me that birds pick such locations so they can rendezvous and regroup in otherwise identical fields and pasture land!

Ime, birddogs are often happier in their good boxes, given reasonable weather conditions, water and food.

In Bad Neighborhoods specific citizenry will steal dogs from dog boxes to train fighting pit bulls with. A poor choice for a finished bird dog, and a possibility I wish to avoid.
 
I do consider myself a rather good shot, however I can generally gauge distance better than most as well which probably has a lot to do with it. I'm also blessed with two very steady German Pointers. But I am still awaiting Randals usual rambling response that is going to include some data from the 70's to prove 6's are garbage and will bounce off birds.
6's hardly "bounce", but physics (which have not recently changed) easily indicate the limitations of smaller vs. larger lead or plated lead shot. Anyone willing to hunt within those limits will have success. But I'm not aware of a reasonable way to increase pellet velocity or hardness enough to make up for the difference in pellet energy granted with increased shot size. Steel 2's have been more scientifically analyzed, oddly. I have enough personal experience to agree "size matters" with lead shot and would be unwilling to hunt with 6's if an alternative was available.
 
"junkyard pheasants". As you certainly know "wild" pheasants gravitate to abandoned barns, irrigation and farm equipment. If my farmer trusts me to hunt structure I will kill more of these long-tailed agricultural pests for him. Pheasants need "structure" like a largemouth bass in a vast lake and hunting around building and equipment is always prudent. A biologist explained to me that birds pick such locations so they can rendezvous and regroup in otherwise identical fields and pasture land!

Ime, birddogs are often happier in their good boxes, given reasonable weather conditions, water and food.

In Bad Neighborhoods specific citizenry will steal dogs from dog boxes to train fighting pit bulls with. A poor choice for a finished bird dog, and a possibility I wish to avoid.
While I have found a pheasant next to an abandoned combine, old Buick or warshing machine, I do not believe they are drawn there as habitat.
I do suspect they can be pushed many places or use many areas for one use or another tho....often temporary or of the moment.
However, a fine perch for a raptor such as a combine would have me questioning a pheasant's life wish should they see human stuff the same as a bass desires an ambush point....different deal entire, imo.

Plus, variances come automatically with Ma Nature.....even a half section of set-aside is seldom like a blanket spread on a basketball court.
I'll remain questioning of such generalities and follow my bird dog's nose.

Security can be an issue, I agree👍.......but, I may simply be bird hunting or staying in areas beyond Compton too.
Stay safe!
 
While I have found a pheasant next to an abandoned combine, old Buick or warshing machine, I do not believe they are drawn there as habitat.
I do suspect they can be pushed many places or use many areas for one use or another tho....often temporary or of the moment.
However, a fine perch for a raptor such as a combine would have me questioning a pheasant's life wish should they see human stuff the same as a bass desires an ambush point....different deal entire, imo.

Plus, variances come automatically with Ma Nature.....even a half section of set-aside is seldom like a blanket spread on a basketball court.
I'll remain questioning of such generalities and follow my bird dog's nose.

Security can be an issue, I agree👍.......but, I may simply be bird hunting or staying in areas beyond Compton too.
Stay safe!
Thanks for your response. A wildlife biologist who explained why desert quail predictably return to sheltering abandoned homesites said it has less to do with physical shelter and more as a way to reliably and repeatedly pinpoint "home" territory in their tiny bird-brains. I haven't read the same about pheasants but suspect some correlation.

Given a choice between open grasslands and a discarded Maytag I'll put the dogs on the washing machine first.
 
Thanks for your response. A wildlife biologist who explained why desert quail predictably return to sheltering abandoned homesites said it has less to do with physical shelter and more as a way to reliably and repeatedly pinpoint "home" territory in their tiny bird-brains. I haven't read the same about pheasants but suspect some correlation.

Given a choice between open grasslands and a discarded Maytag I'll put the dogs on the washing machine first.
Desert quail may not mirror a pheasant....I would tho say that huns often like homestead areas.....but, truly, not all biologists are equal....nor all game birds, on every level.

Given the choice, I'll take the set-asides over a Maytag for pheasants......if for no other reason than to better the odds for a bird dog's paws.
Then, I will trust the dog or my own read of habitat coupled with experience, wind and all the remainder.

It is true that in deep waterways, farmers can dump trash or broken concrete to stem erosion...but pheasants can enjoy relief from the wind in that waterway, regardless.
Trash...often just comes with the situation and does not draw birds to itself, ime.
 
To think the big outfitters can raise enough wild birds to fit cliental needs is naive. There is a game bird propagator here in Ohio with huge flight pens and wary birds who sends semi loads of birds to said western lodges. Not all die from being thrown in the air 🤣 🤣 and add to the native gene pool. It's very likely some posting here have shot such birds.
 
Desert quail may not mirror a pheasant....I would tho say that huns often like homestead areas.....but, truly, not all biologists are equal....nor all game birds, on every level.

Given the choice, I'll take the set-asides over a Maytag for pheasants......if for no other reason than to better the odds for a bird dog's paws.
Then, I will trust the dog or my own read of habitat coupled with experience, wind and all the remainder.

It is true that in deep waterways, farmers can dump trash or broken concrete to stem erosion...but pheasants can enjoy relief from the wind in that waterway, regardless.
Trash...often just comes with the situation and does not draw birds to itself, ime.
Odd you mention trash, Just last week I buried a Patch Hound that was pushing 15 years old. For over 10 years he carried a ugly scar on his right foreleg from trash buried deep in a brush pile. All ready miss him. Welp anyhow back to pheasants.
 
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