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Paul_vang

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Are the stories I hear form every true about massive recoil that will know you back 5 feet true of shotguns? In particular, a 12 gauge pump action. I'm looking ot get a nice home defense weapon first, but I don't want something I can't handle. Too bad nobody is willing to lend me their shotgun(or the range do not have one for rent)so I can try it out myself.

How bad is it really? Is it just like getting punched in the shoulder? more or less?

I've heard that semis are way better recoil-wise, which was my first coice. But all the autos I have seen are way too long for home defense. I want something with minimum barrel length(which is 18" right)? For now, my hunting needs will be filled with a rifle in the near future. Gotta think about home defense right now as hunting season is long gone.
 
Paul, there is a lot of factors as to how much a gun will kick. It would be pretty rare for a person to be shoved back five feet, unless they are off balance.

The weight of the firearm, the type of shell one is using, and the type of firearm, will all play a role. Semi's do tend to kick less than many pumps, or single/double barrels, as the recoil is partially "used up" in the cycling of the action. A big heavy pump will kick, less than a lighter one. You shouldn't be afraid of the recoil, but if it is a real fear for you buy a small gauge gun, like a .410. They will still do a lot of damage to an intruder, at close range, if defense is what you are mainly interested in.
 
Paul,

Relax! Shotguns don't recoil that badly :) . Also you will be so full of adrenaline in both hunting and defence you won't feel a thing! My advise is to buy a pump with a short barrel and relax.
 
Hi Paul, and welcome to the forum. There's nothing that intimidating about shotgun recoil if you're of average size and strength. I'd suggest you try reading through the stickies at the top of our index, particularly the one by Rollin Oswald. But the other posters are right-- you can do awesome home defense with a 20-ga and just medium loads. For hunting, recoil usually isn't a problem unless the stock fits you very poorly or you are using magnum loads out of an extra light gun. (Generally, heavier guns have less felt recoil). Most of us are so pumped up shooting at a bird that we never even notice the recoil.

On the clays range, recoil is much more important-- there you're shooting way more rounds, and the cumulative effect can alter your score.

Finally, everyone reacts to recoil a bit differently. If you turn out to be extra sensitive to it, there are lots of solutions, including recoil devices like Limbsaver, careful stockfitting, and picking loads that aren't so punishing.

A great tactic is to start off with an NRA safety course and / or a lesson at the range. An instructor who's standing right there with you can assess your situation personally. And gun safety is everyone's first concern :)

Come back and let us know how things are working out!

All the best,

Jeff23
 
I shoot a Browning XS Skeet and am not aware of recoil (compared to my Weatherby) sure it is there, but with a correct mount, a correct fitting stock and correct technique recoil should not be an issue.
I believe that aprehension is what puts people off, get a few thousand rounds through that sucker and you wont even notice the recoil anymore.

Mack
 
I have a 12 ga Nova and I don't even notice the recoil on it. Last weekend, while hunt training, I ran out of shells so one of the guys let me use his 20 ga Onyx. That thing is so light I was shocked at how much it kicked. Not bad, mind you, just significantly more than my 12 ga Nova. That just goes to show you that the weight of the gun makes alot of difference.

Bottom line, don't worry about the recoil. It's no big deal unless you have brittle bones!
 
Paul, For home defense a 20 ga should be fine. Even a 12ga pump short barrel won't kick that much. It's not like you are going to be firing turkey or goose loads. Slugs kick pretty good too. Personally, I kind of like a little kick, the power is good feeling. But for home defense, lighter loads are appropriate especially since your target will be at a closer range. Good luck and keep us informed.
 
Shotgun kick is as follows:

single shot shotgun: kicks the most - $110.00 approx price
pump action shotgun: moderate kick - $ 175.00- 300.00 price
semi-auto shotgun: least kick - $400.00 -1000.00 price
 
Newbie, Here are the actual numbers for recoil energy from Chuck Hawks very informative site (url below.)

Gauge, length (oz. shot@MV) Gun weight Recoil energy ft. lbs.

.410 bore, 2.50" (1/2 at 1200) 5.5# shotgun 7.1# recoil
.410 bore, 3.00" (11/16 at 1135) 5.5# shotgun 10.5# recoil
28 gauge, 2.75" (3/4 at 1200) 6.0# shotgun 12.8# recoil

20 gauge, 2.75" (7/8 at 1200) 6.5# shotgun 16.1# recoil
20 gauge, 2.75" (1 at 1220) 6.5# shotgun 21.0# recoil
20 gauge, 2.75" (1 1/8 at 1175) 6.5# shotgun 25.0# recoil
20 gauge, 3" (1 1/4 at 1185) 6.5# shotgun 31.0# recoil

16 gauge, 2.75" (1 at 1220) 7.0# shotgun 21.5# recoil
16 gauge, 2.75" (1 1/8 at 1240) 7.0# shotgun 27.6# recoil

12 gauge, 2.75" (1 at 1180) 7.5# shotgun 17.3# recoil
12 gauge, 2.75" (1 1/8 at 1200) 7.5# shotgun 23.0# recoil
12 gauge, 2.75" (1 1/4 at 1330) 7.5# shotgun 32.0# recoil
12 gauge, 2.75" (1 1/2 at 1260) 7.5# shotgun 45.0# recoil
12 gauge, 3" (1 5/8 at 1280) 7.5# shotgun 52.0# recoil
12 gauge, 3" (1 7/8 at 1210) 8.75# shotgun 54.0# recoil

10 gauge, 3.5" (2 1/4 at 1210) 10.5# shotgun 62.9# recoil

DATA Table SOURCE=
http://www.chuckhawks.com/shotgun_recoil_table.htm

Maybe you have shot centerfire rifles; if so, here are the comparable numbers for some common calibers so you can compare the shotgun recoils ft-pounds seen above with something you already know.

I would suspect that different shooters have different notions of how much recoil is too much, just as different people have very different pain thresholds. Some of it has to do with your body mass/ build, some of it is your nervous system. For me personally, anything over about 50# recoil starts the flinching

* 6mm Rem. (100gr, MV 3100 fps) 8# rifle = 10.0 ft. lbs.
* .270 Win. (140 gr, MV 3000 fps) 8# rifle = 17.1 ft. lbs.
* .30-06 (180 gr, MV 2700 fps) 8# rifle = 20.3 ft. lbs.
* .35 Whelen (250 gr, MV 2400 fps) 8# rifle = 26.1 ft. lbs.
* .450 Marlin (350 gr, MV 2100 fps) 8# rifle = 35.7 ft. lbs
* .458 Win. Mag.(500 gr, MV 2050 fps) 8# rifle = 68.9 ft. lbs.

Continuing with quotes from Chuck H.:
"Rifle weight plays an important role in determining the amount of recoil delivered to the shooter's shoulder. For any given caliber and load, a lighter rifle kicks more than a heavier rifle. Which is why I avoid ultra-light hunting rifles. Here are a couple of examples showing the effect rifle weight has on recoil energy and velocity when shooting the exact same load.

* .300 WSM (180 grain, MV 2950 fps), 6.5 lb. rifle = 30.8 ft. lbs.
* .300 WSM (180 grain, MV 2950 fps), 8.5 lb. rifle = 23.6 ft. lbs.

AND

* .45-70 (300 grain, MV 1900 fps), 7.0 lb. rifle = 26.6 ft. lbs.
* .45-70 (300 grain, MV 1900 fps), 8.5 lb. rifle = 21.9 ft. lbs. "

And as regards the tall tales you may have heard around the campfire about ole Grandpap's shotgun that knocked the snot out of so-in-so, keep what Mark Twain said over 100 years ago:

"There was never a story so good that it could not be improved upon…"

Just as those fish that get away gain inches and pounds with the retelling, the recoil of Grandpap's shotgun / Civil War muzzleloader / safari bigbore [check one of the above] may have become -shall we say - augmented with the fond passage of time.

Try out a friend's small bore with a light load and work your way down the table gradually until you find the break point where it is truly uncomfortable for you. Good luck and enjoy the sport! AH
[/u]
 
If recoil is a real concern for you I'd suggest buying a hand gun.....( oh no, not a hand gun here on a shot gun forum.) Really the recoil isn't that bad. Myself and several friends started sporting clays 2 years ago. ( we're still newbies since we have only gone about 15 times). The first time we all went out ( we all owned some kind of shot guns or another). From pumps to semi automatics to double barrels. We just brought what we owned regardless of type, weight, etc. What did we know.....all we knew was we were gonna shoot clay targets. The first day we shot 100 rounds. The next day the topic of discussion was who had the best bruises.......after the 3rd time recoil wasn't even mentioned and believe it or not afterwards we didn't even bruise afterwards. maybe it was how we held the guns or maybe our shoulders responded to the recoil. The jest is to shoot a shot gun and worry about recoil esp. for self defense is not even a factor. I can see how recoil can be a factor for the better shooters for accuracy though. I myself used a pump for sporting clays and I was more concerned about concentrating on pumping the gun and aiming at my second target than recoil.....I didn't know any better. I just bought a Browning O/U sporting which should reduce recoil but I didn't buy it to reduce recoil...I bought it to save some time between shots. There just wasn't enough times on some shots with a pump. The course we go to sometimes don't seem to trim the trees and bushes much and the windows get pretty small........I'd say pick a gun that benefits your other needs first.recoil second. One thought though. I was told a pump is one of the best defence for intruders.......just hearing that click....click a pump makes when loading a shell is enough to let them REALLY know you do have a gun and not just saying it. The second reason to me is that a pump can be safer. When the adrenaline pumps.....the extra time and open chamber may just save someone elses life. If you were ever in the position to actually need to use the gun in an emergency...you won't even feel the recoil. Good luck

dave
 
i remember the first time i ever used a shotgun i was told that if i didnt have a proper stance, i would be knocked down. this of course wasnt true. ive never had a problem with recoil of any sort. i can rapidly fire 9 shots out of my mossy 12 gauge without losing control or getting of target. this might have something to do with me being a big person, but either way, i dont think you'd have a problem with recoil unless you weighed about 100 pounds
 
The first time I shot a shotgun the people at the range were saying how much a shotgun kicks and to really brace yourself when shooting it. So we went and shot it but it really was not anything special and this was after getting all pumped up for some serious recoil. Don't get me wrong it does kick but it's not really anything to worry about. Besides, you'll be having so much fun shooting it, you won't even notice.
 
An adult male in fair or better physical condition with good legs and no pronounced shoulder or back problems should not have any trouble restraining 12ga recoil.

Cases you might really need some help with recoil?

If you're not in the condition listed above or better.

SMALLER women -sometimes- complain of recoil issues. My 5'2" signifigant other does well enough with a light 20 or a big 12.

If you shoot more than a case of shells (10 boxes of 25) a week.

If you're shooting more than 3" shells.

If you're shooting more than 2 3/4" slugs.

If you're shooting any gauge heavier than 12.
 
I agree with everyone about the recoil issue. You won't even notice it while you are hunting or shooting clays because you are having so much fun! I would recommend a pump as a home defense weapon simply for the fact that you get multiple shots, you don't have to worry about a shell jam like you do with autos, and you don't have to worry about your aim as much as you do with a pistol. I like the idea of a shotgun as a home defense weapon because you can stop an intruder without worrying about shooting through a wall and killing someone else. Besides, all an intruder needs to hear is that very distinctive sound of a pump chambering a round and he is sure to head the other way! :eek:
 
Rogmatt said:
Shotgun kick is as follows:

single shot shotgun: kicks the most - $110.00 approx price
pump action shotgun: moderate kick - $ 175.00- 300.00 price
semi-auto shotgun: least kick - $400.00 -1000.00 price
We should clarify this statement, before some people get confused.

I assume you selected only the very cheapest, WalMart grade guns for your list, since this started as a "home defense" thread.

There have been some outstanding single barrel competition trap shotguns produced that have very little "felt" recoil, and are worth several thousand dollars. My Italian Gamba single barrel trap is one example, and the Ithaca 4E is another. The current Browning BT-99 is going for around $1300, I think.

Unfortunately, many shooters forget about such competition grade single barrel trap guns, and only think of the $99 outside hammer H&R Pardner type firearms.

I feel like Rodney Dangerfield. :roll:

I agree with you that gas operated semi-auto shotguns tend to have lower recoil since some of the "exhaust" is used to cycle the action. The old single shot Remington 870 Competition Trap used such a gas system (where the mag tube would be in a regular 870 pump) to reduce recoil.

"Felt recoil" is often a function of gun weight, stock fit and mounting/stance. A 6.5 pound gun will have more "kick" than a 8.5 pound gun - all other things being equal.

Of course, if the original poster is only looking for a home defense gun, "felt" recoil isn't really an issue. Depending, of course, on where he lives :wink:
 
Paul,

If the above references haven't sunk in for you then I'll give another. I'm 38 years old, 6'1", 210 lb and in good to better physical condition. I have a 12 ga Rem 870 Express Home Defense shotgun with a pistol grip that I routinely take fishing in case of Bears. I fired five 3" Black Magic Bear Slugs with one hand holding the pistol grip in the crease of my hip and the other on the fore stock to pump the shotgun. I fired all five of these as fast as I could pump and suffered no ill effects. These are some of the heaviest/hottest shots available for a 12 ga shotgun. It has a steel 18" barrel and reciever with composite fore stock and grip. Not sure how much it weighs but it isn't much compared to a full size 870 with a full stock. Sure there was recoil and the shotgun kicked but it wasn't anything that I couldn't handle in about the poorest shooting posture imaginable while using both hands. IMO Unless you have heard from a doctor that you should avoid firearms then I expect that you could handle the recoil of most any 20 ga shotgun.

As a home defense weapon I have a 20 ga Remington Youth Model 870 Express that I keep loaded with 00 Buck Shot. For me this is about the best home defense weapon that I have ever seen. I have tried some tactical shotguns but for simple home defense I don't think it is worth the extra $$$$ as compared to the Youth 870 20ga that can be found almost anywhere for around $200. The Youth model is short and has a small frame. This makes it very manuverable in close quarters. I have other shotguns and hand guns that I could use for home defense but this is my first choice. Besides, if you ever need a home defense weapon just the unmistakable sound of a pump will send 99% of would be intruders away.

Hope this helps.

Dan
 
Maybe slightly off subject - but I've always wondered about the old "sound of a pump chambering a round will scare them off" gambit. That sound will tell the bad guy 2 things about you: 1 - he knows you're armed. And 2 - he knows where you are. Seems like more information than I would want him to have.
 
McKie said:
Maybe slightly off subject - but I've always wondered about the old "sound of a pump chambering a round will scare them off" gambit. That sound will tell the bad guy 2 things about you: 1 - he knows you're armed. And 2 - he knows where you are. Seems like more information than I would want him to have.
So he knows there will be a fight if he carries on and he knows which way to go to get away from you.

Do you really want to wait for the guy to get real close so you can suprise each other and see who has the best reactions?

Remember that CPL courses teach to shout like crazy at the fool that you are armed and will shoot him if he comes anywhere near you while calling 911 at the same time.

Surely the idea here is to SURVIVE, not just to kill someone.
 
I have a 12 ga Nova and I don't even notice the recoil on it.
Is this your only shotgun? A buddy of mine has one as well and that baby kicks like h=ll compared to any of my Mossbergs or my IZH27 12 gauge for that matter. 3/12" magnums scare me with his Nova. He's looking into an aftermarket recoil pad to leesen the recoil.
 
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