Shotgun Forum banner
1 - 20 of 38 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
637 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
First off, I have been loading 410 skeet loads for 25 years so not a nubbbie. However I've only used AA hulls, Claybuster AA HS clone wads. Recently came into thousands of Rem hulls. 1200 fps load with Lilgun (all I've got currently) has a stack heights issue. Obviously the rem hull has a larger hull volume. The finished she'll has a dished crimp that results in leakers. Not really interested in adjusting the tool head at this time as the AA hulls are great. My question, is there a little taller 410 wad that would fill out the stack height a little more. My shot drop is a little over a 1/2oz but under the max shot load.
 

·
Super Moderator
Joined
·
7,931 Posts
Not to my knowledge, as none of the 410 wads have legs for a crush zone.
Steve
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
194 Posts
Lil Gun is not a good choice of powder in those hulls to begin with. Switch to H110 or 296, it'll take care of your volume issue and your hulls will last much longer. Also factory 410 target loads have about 225gr of shot, so you might try getting as close to that as you can.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
You cannot switch between the Winchester HS and Remington STS .410 hulls without making a few loader adjustments.

This is irrespective of what powder and wads you are using.

The HS hull is shorter than the STS hull and the pre-crimp station will close an STS hull too much to get a good crimp.

Also, the crimp itself may be too deep and there might be too much taper at the final station, causing the hull to buckle and crush.

It doesn't take much to make the adjustments and then write down what you changed so you can easily reverse when moving back to loading HS hull.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
194 Posts
I agree. You can also add Alliant 300MP to that list of powders and get even more hull life due to lower chamber pressures.
Yep. I use both. On paper it seemed you should get more hull life, but I see no difference. 300MP is prone to migrate more. It is cheaper, at least it used to be. H110 or 296 is still my first choice.

btw, I shoot about 10k rounds of 410 a year.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
537 Posts
If you can find the Federal 410 wad it will take up a little room. I use them in my Rem hulls. The CB wad takes up the least space of any of the 410 wads in my experience. Agree that LilGun is not best choice. Enough to fill the hull the same as 296/H110, 300MP will put you way over pressure.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,779 Posts
1200 fps load with Lilgun (all I've got currently) has a stack heights issue
This is the problem, since the factory STS loads are factory loaded with 232Grs of shot, to 1350fps (even thought the box states 1200fps).

So if you make sure that your shot bushing is dropping around 228grs of shot, and use the remaining room left in the hull with either 296/H110, or 300-Mp with Win209 primer and CB HS wad, can duplicate the factory load pretty close, still be under max working pressures, and have a not shot rattle crimped load.

As for Lil gun, has a burn rate of a little under 294, so can not be used to acheive the 1350fps rate without it going over max working pressures (either in the STS or HS loads standard 1/2oz loads).

So if you want to stick with the 1200fps load in the STS hull with your current shot and powder drops, then will need to use a shot cup filler before shot drop, to get the required top shot height line in hull before crimping isntead.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
388 Posts
Lil Gun with the CB wad in the .410 Rem STS hull is not a good combination. Lil Gun fits well using the CB wad in the AAHS hull, but the Rem hull has quite a bit more capacity than the AAHS. Even with adjustments of your reloader, you will have very dished crimps and reloads that are prone to shot leakage. I've tried breaking a Cheerio into pieces to fill the hull, but this is a pain, and it doesn't work all that well to boot.

Both the Federal and Rem wads improve the fit a little, but good luck finding any of these. As others have suggested, 296/H110 produces a good fit.

Everyone talks about Lil Gun being hard on hulls, but in my experience this is not much of an issue with AAHS hulls. With the Rem hulls hull life is pretty limited regardless of the powder - but H110 will be better than Lil Gun.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
33 Posts
Break out the scale and the tools when you change to the Remington hulls they are taller. With more case volume to fill you are left with only a few choice's. 1 time a year when I go from my 2 1/2 AA Winchester hulls to Remington I dread it but then when they are all loaded up I'm happy again. I try to then shoot the shells that the loader is set for first then go back to the others but it is a pain. You are going to probably need to bump your powder to 13grn,. load with a WAA41 type wad not or Remington sp410. I'm not a big fan of Lil Gun but have done this dance with it before. Good luck with your endeavor.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
416 Posts
Take a look at the 410 wads that Ballistic has. They might be too tall for what you are looking for.
Beat me to it. (y)
The Stretch or the MG410 wad may Work
Problem is finding published loading data for that combination
You could call them to see if they have data for that
It also is taking over 2 weeks for them just to ship
Fluid Communication Device Font Home appliance Gadget


Product Font Screenshot Liquid Rectangle
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
Enough to fill the hull the same as 296/H110, 300MP will put you way over pressure.
I disagree. I use the same bushing size for 300MP as I do for 296/H110. After sending out for pressure and velocity testing so that I could verify using the same components with 300MP as I do for 296/H110, the results came back 300 psi lower on average than the Hodgdon manual shows for the 296/H110 load.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
194 Posts
I disagree. I use the same bushing size for 300MP as I do for 296/H110. After sending out for pressure and velocity testing so that I could verify using the same components with 300MP as I do for 296/H110, the results came back 300 psi lower on average than the Hodgdon manual shows for the 296/H110 load.
I think you're misunderstanding his point. He's saying the amount of Lil Gun it would take to fill up the volume that H110/ 296 or 300MP would fill will cause these pressure issues. IMO, anybody that would even consider trying to take up volume by adding powder should not be reloading and needs to have their head examined.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Skeet69

·
Registered
Joined
·
141 Posts
Sorry, I saw a comma instead of and/or and misread what was being compared! Thanks for pointing me in the right direction! (y)

With that said, I totally agree with everything said by Flyn'dutchman.

Just a topic-related side note... I used to know a guy who would add extra powder if a particular 12 gauge wad/hull combination was too dished in.

He justified by saying the extra powder was cheaper than adding extra shot.

Needless to say I never shot practice on the same field with him!
 
1 - 20 of 38 Posts
Top