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jcchartboy said:
txgolfer45 said:
OneInchGroup said:

"The smoothbore shotgun for use in deer hunting is by definition obsolete...there is no debating that. "

Sounds like you are to slug guns what Al Gore is to Global Warming!

No debate wanted!
Txgolfer45,

As you can see this guy is a complete joke. He somehow believes that he can come on here and benefit himself by making ridiculous statements and then attributing them to others.

To date he is the only one here that has made the suggestion that a smoothbore is not an acceptable means to harvest deer.

Where he gets off making the suggestion that others would agree with him..who knows? But then again, seeing as he has regularly proven himself not to be a man of his word, nothing surprises me about him any longer. :roll:

JC
It's times like these I'm glad we DON'T have the edit function back.

JC, why did you point out that OIG "can come on here and benefit himself by making ridiculous statements and then attributing them to others." and not point out to txgolfer45 that the words he quoted were... yours. YOU clearly posted that. YOU drew first blood.

Pretty hypocritical, don't you think?
 

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OneInchGroup said:
Kind of a shame to write off a whole category of weapons as obsolete just because there is a more modern, more accurate, faster, higher energy, and lots more expensive new alternative available. Guess this means I've got to throw both my crossbows and my blackpowder guns in the dumpster, them being all obsolete, and unethical, and all.
Rangeball,

Which part of the above statement made by OIG don't you understand???

He is clearly attempting to equate the term the "obsolete" with the implication that something is therefore useless. An implication being made by him and him alone.

No one else here ever equated "obsolete" with the term "dumpster" or for that matter "throw" away....except One'r.

If that is the way he thinks...fine. Let him think that way.

However, he is going to get called out everytime he tries to attempts to paint his fugazzi picasso's by attributing false statements to other members in an attempt to benefit hismself.

This isn't the first time he has pulled this type of B.S. and given his nature I am sure it won't be the last... :w

JC
 

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JC,

Sorry to break the flow of the posts, but I have a question to ask.

What the hell does "fugazzi picasso" mean? :?

I even tried looking it up and can't figure out what it means. :w

Care to clarify?

Jim
 

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jjas said:
What the hell does "fugazzi picasso" mean? :?

Jim
Painting a fake picture...

(....like OIG was doing by equating the dictionairy definition of the word obsolete...with the words "dumpster" and "throw" away...An equation that is not only factually incorrect, but also an equation he was falsely attempting to attribute to me when in reality the facts show I never made any such statement...)

JC
 

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jcchartboy said:
ob·so·lete (ŏb'sə-lēt', ŏb'sə-lēt')

Outmoded in design, style, or construction:
The smoothbore shotgun for use in deer hunting is by definition obsolete...there is no debating that.

The only question is...does the cost savings associated with shooting smoothbore guns at the range justify using them while hunting...?

The obvious answer is...it all depends on what is more important to a person, saving less than a few hundred dollars a year...or increasing their odds of ethically harvesting an animal... :wink:

JC
JC, better go back and read your posts. You're starting to make an *** out of yourself.
 

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old ammo said:
JC, better go back and read your posts.
Old ammo,

I am well aware of what I have stated. It is your post that does not seem to make any sense...?

Please explain your statement. It makes no sense whatseoever... Are you trying to argue that smoothbore shotguns for deer hunting are not "Outmoded in design, style, or construction"?

Unless that is your belief...then your comment makes zero sense whatsoever... :roll:

JC
 

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As usual I think everyone is actually agreeing in this discussions point but arguing over mis-understood definition of terms. My take is that JC is saying the smoothbores are obsolete, as in not state of the art, cutting edge, tip of the sword technology. He is NOT saying that they are not useful and still the best tool for certain types of hunting.

JC...correct me if I mis-represented your intentions.
 

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TH said:
He is NOT saying that they are not useful and still the best tool for certain types of hunting.

JC...correct me if I mis-represented your intentions.
TH,

As you could see...that was clear as day my statement.

(However, based on the last 3 pages of posts from the "ASSA" crew they felt it to their advantage to paint the picture otherwise... :?)

JC
 

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TH said:
As usual I think everyone is actually agreeing in this discussions point but arguing over mis-understood definition of terms. My take is that JC is saying the smoothbores are obsolete, as in not state of the art, cutting edge, tip of the sword technology. He is NOT saying that they are not useful and still the best tool for certain types of hunting.

JC...correct me if I mis-represented your intentions.
Sounds like they aren't obsolete then! :lol:
 

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jcchartboy wrote:
Quote:
ob·so·lete (ŏb'sə-lēt', ŏb'sə-lēt')

Outmoded in design, style, or construction:

The smoothbore shotgun for use in deer hunting is by definition obsolete...there is no debating that.
The only question is...does the cost savings associated with shooting smoothbore guns at the range justify using them while hunting...?

Spin it any way you want.
Your statement was clear as a bell to me.
 

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I have been keeping up on this obsolete smooth barrel post for 4 pages now. Here is my feeling on the subject. Back in 1972 I started hunting deer using a smooth barrel with BB site. I went to sabots last year using a Winchester sx3 with slug barrel. I have been reloading my own slugs so the cost is not as high. However I have two sons that hunt too. One uses a mossberg with slug barrel the other one uses my old smooth barrel. There is a place in the hunting world for both. I have found this board and the different subjects very useful at times and sometimes entertaining. Even though I am new to this forum some of the posts I have read on this subject are just insulting to each other so maybe it is time to give this a rest and move on.
 

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logankelly said:
Even though I am new to this forum some of the posts I have read on this subject are just insulting to each other so maybe it is time to give this a rest and move on.
Logan,

This has beeen going on since One'r showed up for the first time late last year...he has an agenda, and no voice that you, I, or any other member here, may state will have any affect on his spam...

JC
 

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good to see you post again, Jaeger, I really enjoy your posts on the success you have had with your mossy smoothie. I must say that as far as I am concerned you have exposed a dirty little secret regarding the actual lack of consistency with sabots at ranges deer are normally hunting at in the NE.

Based on reading some of your posts last summer, I bought a buck special slug barrel for my browning bps, to use as a backup to my fully rifled deerslayer II. What amazed me most was the tight groups that I could shoot with brennekes or federal truballs--consistent five shot 1.5" groups @ 50 yards with open sights--a little over 2" at 75 yards. I could no better with the deerslayer equipped with a 4x scope --in fact, when you considered "fliers" I was doing considerably worse. I used to think that the fliers I shot with sabots were the result of my poor technique, but seeing the consistency I achieve with fullbore rifled slugs I am now convinced the fliers were caused by problems inherent in the sabot's design.

I will say that if I knew then what I know now, I would never have invested in the deerslayer--I can just imagine how good my browning would shoot if I pinned the barrel and installed a scope--souping up my smooth bore slugger would have been a much better expenditure of $$$$$$ than going the rifled barrel route.

Great posts and great post, sorry to rehijack this thread. the rest of you may go own insulting each other now.
 

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My two cents- I have hunted with both kinds of slugs and shot many brands I never hunted with. My observations are as follows;
1- Fosters are certainly useful and effective at "woods" ranges, and finding the slug that your gun likes best usually produces better accuracy than you would expect providing you keep the gun barrel clean(every three shots works for me) and control the variables in your gun and shooting form.
2-Most sabot slugs that I have tried are subject to fliers, no matter how hard you work at the fundamentals. If you find a brand that does not produce fliers, you will probably be amazed at the results. I use the same protocol of good form and three shot groups, then clean.
3- The results from formats 1&2 seem identical to me in the hunting field out to "woods " ranges of 75-85 yds.I feel that the concept of obsolete has little meaning inside these ranges.
4-If you have the opportunity for longer shooting where you hunt it is probably worth your time and money to find a rifled gun /sabot that works for you. That is what I did.Happy hunting.
 

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Smoothbores with the right stuff can hold their own.
I'm building a 8ga one, Soon I'll be taking Brenneke KO
1 oz slugs and doing our slow powder testing in
a smoothbore, longer, heavier, barrel replacement
for a short 20" piece of crap, barrel.Many others
shooting KOs have real good groups, we will also have
about 2500 fps plus...Ed
 

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Rangeball said:
Smoothbores are the future. They just need an ammo update.

For proof look at the M1a3 abrams 120mm smoothbore canon and the accuracy it's capable of at range.
In all seriousness, with the fed truball and the "rackmaster" and reduced recoil law enforcement slug from Remington, I wonder what kind of accuracy a person could get from a smoothie with a pinned barrel and good optics and recoil reduction?

Might be a good winter project.
 

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My 12g 870 will center punch a paint can at 125 yards with regular winchester fosters. I've often wished I could have all the money back I've wasted looking for more...

And I am serious. With the proper projectile design, a smoothbore could be just as accurate as a rifled bore at the same ranges, and even have the edge when really pushing the envelope. There's a reason the 120mm canon is a smoothbore shooting... a saboted load :)

Give it 30 years :)
 

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I don't think you'll ever see a version of 120mm APFSDS or APFSDSDU fired in a shotshell.

Closest thing Im can think of is that french slug with the plastic rocket fins attached to the base. The Balle Fleche Sauvestre Sledgehammer.

I've seen one box of 5 at a shop and they wanted $30 for it.

http://www.sauvestre.com/index_us.htm

Besides the dart in the center of the 120mm projectile has angled fins to spin the dart. I don't think it would work the same with a slow shotgun slug.
 
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