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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
This 525 is relatively new(8mths) and I've put around 4000 rounds put through it so far. In the last 2 months, it has become more and more common for the bottom barrels firing pin to not strike the primer hard enough to ignite it. I've taken the stock off and blown the action out(looked clean) and have sprayed it with WD40, but still about 1 time per 2 lines or so of skeet it misfires. Most times, I can just open the action and close it again and it will fire fine.

Looking for opinions of what to do??? Never had it happen the first 3000 rounds or so.
 

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gmaxson said:
This 525 is relatively new(8mths) and I've put around 4000 rounds put through it so far. In the last 2 months, it has become more and more common for the bottom barrels firing pin to not strike the primer hard enough to ignite it. I've taken the stock off and blown the action out(looked clean) and have sprayed it with WD40, but still about 1 time per 2 lines or so of skeet it misfires. Most times, I can just open the action and close it again and it will fire fine.

Looking for opinions of what to do??? Never had it happen the first 3000 rounds or so.
First, I wouldn't use WD40 as a long term lubricant. Try something else such as Breakfree CLP....... although I doubt that lubrication (or the lack thereof) is the real problem.

Second, I would strongly suspect it is the ammo...... or more specifically the primers. I have heard some complaints recently about Winchester AA ammo and/or Winchester primers. By any chance are you using Win AA's?

Third, inspect the firing pin tip with a magnifying glass. It should be round and smooth. If it's pitted, then it's likely due to the use of certain ammo or primers. In this event, replacement of the firing pin should cure the problem.

Let us know what you determine the problem to be. Thanks.
 

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I have to agree that WD-40 is a poor choice as a lubricant. It is an excellent rust preventative and it displaces moisture, but it tends to harden as it dries and will gum things up as that happens. On the subject of Winchester AA's, I must disagree; a modern shotgun should be able to function with any modern ammunition! If AA's will not work, fix the gun so that they do. Changing that firing pin is a good idea, but while the stock is off, change the mainspring as well. They are both inexpensive parts and it is a good guess that your problem is the result of one of them being worn.
 

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I had the same problem with the Winchester 101 Pigeon recently bought, however I only had trouble with Remington Gun Clubs and Game Loads. Factory AA's, and my reloads with any of four different primers were no trouble.

I cut 2 coils from the firing pin return springs, and that seemed to cut the problem in half. I then replaced the pitted factory firing pins with aftermarket titanium pins, which solved it completely.
 

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What shells are you shooting? The reason I ask is because I have a friend whose gun will do the same thing. If he shoots AA's it will do it about 2-3 times a round. If he shoots something like Rio's, NO PROBLEM. I'm guessing that the Rio's have a softer primer than the AA's.

Something to think about, trying a different shell.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I'm shooting AA reloads. Never had a problem with them then all of a sudden 1 every 2 or so rounds. Started thinking that maybe my primer was being seated a fraction to deep, but if I take the shell and switch it to the top barrel it is fine and quite often I can just open and close the action leaving it in the bottom barrel and it will go off the second try.

Someone offered me a $50 gift certificate off labor at my gunsmith, so I'll probably take it in and have the replace the firing pins.

BTW, the primer looks to me to be dimpled enough to cause an ignition. If it happens tonight, I'll have to compare it to a fired hull to compare.

Is something like this typically the pin not hitting hard enough, the pin not traveling forward enough? Just curious.

Seems odd to me that with the loads staying the same that it just started happening regularly, so I'm guessing it is mechanical.
 

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gmaxson said:
This 525 is relatively new(8mths) and I've put around 4000 rounds put through it so far. In the last 2 months, it has become more and more common for the bottom barrels firing pin to not strike the primer hard enough to ignite it. I've taken the stock off and blown the action out(looked clean) and have sprayed it with WD40, but still about 1 time per 2 lines or so of skeet it misfires. Most times, I can just open the action and close it again and it will fire fine.

Looking for opinions of what to do??? Never had it happen the first 3000 rounds or so.
I have had the same problem with my new 525 also.
#1 what shells are you using? AA hs reloads?
#2 when the gun is unloaded and disassembled dry fire it.
#3 look and see how far the firing pin sticks out of the hole.
it should protrude quite a bit.
#4 your hammer springs may be weak
with the aa reloads I had (hs hull) the brass or base wad moved up in the hull causing the primer to seat a little too deep. This coupled with short firing pins was not firing everytime. I know the pins were short because when I took the wood off it was readily apparent to me that they would go too deep into the firing pin "tunnel" and not getting a good long strike by the hammer. When I was at the Grand last summer they changed both pins and springs and the problem has dissapeared no matter what ammo I am shooting. It took them less than an hour and there was no charge. if I wasn't at the Grand I was going to order the parts and do it myself, they really don't cost too much and I didn't want to be w/o the gun for weeks.

Bryan
 

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mike orlen said:
a modern shotgun should be able to function with any modern ammunition! If AA's will not work, fix the gun so that they do.
Amen!

I'm no gunsmith, but I have been saying the same thing for years. We often hear people blaming Failure To Fire (FTF) on the brand of ammo, hard primers, deep primers, the color of your underwear, or whatever. Granted, there are some differences between the brands of shells, and that is why some guns will shoot brand X OK but not brand Y. But a gun of any decent quality that is in good condition should be able to fire any brand of ammo.

Right now my car ('98 Jeep Cherokee w/ 186,000 miles) has a little shimmy in the front end right around 55 MPH. Should I just avoid driving at 55 MPH? Nonsense! I'm going to get it fixed, because it should be able to drive at any legal speed (and then some) with no shimmy. Avoiding a brand of ammo because your gun won't fire it reliably doesn't make any more sense than that.

If your gun won't shoot your preferred brand of ammo, get the gun fixed!
 

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I don't see where anyone advocated avoiding a particular brand of ammo because the
gun won't fire it reliably, or recommended anything other than fixing the gun.
 

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ShootingStar said:
I just re-read all the posts here. I don't see where anyone advocated avoiding a particular brand of ammo because the gun won't fire it reliably, or recommended anything other than fixing the gun.
I would strongly suspect it is the ammo
Something to think about, trying a different shell.
what shells are you using? AA hs reloads?
...with the aa reloads I had (hs hull) the brass or base wad moved up in the hull causing the primer to seat a little too deep.
In this thread, most (not all) of the responses correctly mentioned firing pin problems, in addition to questioning the ammo used. I must have read a thousand other threads in which people blamed it solely on the ammo.

I have a friend who fretted for months over the misfires he got with his reloads. He simply would not listen when I told him it was the gun, not the shells. He was convinced that if the gun fired one brand of ammo it was OK, and therefore the problem had to be in the ammo. He finally broke down and took the gun to a gunsmith, who fixed it.

BTW, I have seen or read of a lot of cases like this, and most (not all) of them were Brownings. It must have something to do with the angle of the firing pins and/or the metal used in the pins. I did have a similar problem with a Beretta, and it turned out to be a completely different cause.
 

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The reason I mentioned Win AA's as a possible source of the problem is because a friend of mine recently had a similar problem with his Citori when firing some Win AA's. He had new firing pins and new hammer springs installed into his gun. He still has the same problem from time to time with the Win AA's.

Is that conclusive proof that the ammo is the problem? No, but when other people have almost identical problems with the AA ammo in their new Citori's, we have to wonder. Maybe it's a gun problem. Maybe it's an ammo problem. Maybe it's a combination of the two. :?
 

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Is replacing the firing pins in a Citori (425) a do-it yourself job, or a gunsmith-only proposition? I also have one that doesn't like to fire the bottom barrel occasionally.
Firing pin does appear a little damaged, not sure if it might be the pin, weak hammer spring, or gunk behind the firing pin. Just haven't gotten around to trying it yet-
Any online Citori dis-assembly guides?
Thanks, Adam
 

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Hawkdriver75 said:
Is replacing the firing pins in a Citori (425) a do-it yourself job, or a gunsmith-only proposition?

Any online Citori dis-assembly guides?
None that I know of, but somebody else may chime in. VERY easy on a Winchester 101. Remove stock, and with the hammers cocked, partially knock out the retaining pins with a pin punch and hammer. The top firing pin angles up and the bottom one angles down, so they'll easily clear the cocked hammers without removal. Maybe 30 minutes tops, and almost idiot proof.

You should be able to figure it out by just pulling the stock off.

EDIT: Although I don't know which series Citori yours is, all the schematics on the Midwest GunWorks site ( http://www.midwestgunworks.com/page/mgw ... -gun-parts ) look similar to the 101.
 

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The firing pins are easy to change. Drive out the retaining pins with the right size pin punch and I believe the pins are slightly tapered and only go in one direction. As you remove them, mark one end with a lead pencil so that you know which way they go back in. Remove the old firing pins. The bottom one only will have a spring around it, so replace that, too. Clean out the firing pin holes, and put everything back together. Before you start, you might want to check the end of the firing pins with a magnifying glass. The bottom one will generally have some erosion on it from piercing primers.
 
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