Thanks for the link, being one who lives in this crazy state I think I should read up on this stuff :?
California Home Defense Law
Since much of the discussions on this forum centers around what constitutes justifiable force, I thought it would be a good idea if the various users would look up their states penal or criminal codes on the standards of home defense and post them here.
California Penal Code 198.5. Any person using force intended or likely to cause death or great bodily injury within his or her residence shall be presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily injury to self, family, or a member of the household when that force is used against another person, not a member of the family or household, who unlawfully and forcibly enters or has unlawfully and forcibly entered the residence and the person using the force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry occurred.
As used in this section, great bodily injury means a significant or substantial physical injury.
I find it interesting that Calfornia presumes that if someone has broken into your home you have reason to fear "imminent peril of death". That seems like a pretty reasonable fear to me.
Penal code sections 195-199 deal with justifiable homicide. You can find them at http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/calaw.html
California Penal Code 198.5. Any person using force intended or likely to cause death or great bodily injury within his or her residence shall be presumed to have held a reasonable fear of imminent peril of death or great bodily injury to self, family, or a member of the household when that force is used against another person, not a member of the family or household, who unlawfully and forcibly enters or has unlawfully and forcibly entered the residence and the person using the force knew or had reason to believe that an unlawful and forcible entry occurred.
As used in this section, great bodily injury means a significant or substantial physical injury.
I find it interesting that Calfornia presumes that if someone has broken into your home you have reason to fear "imminent peril of death". That seems like a pretty reasonable fear to me.
Penal code sections 195-199 deal with justifiable homicide. You can find them at http://www.leginfo.ca.gov/calaw.html
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I want to bring this post back from the dead, because I think it would be a very interesting study to see the different home invasion laws of different states. California sucks A$$ when it comes to home invasion.
bobbfwed said:I want to bring this post back from the dead, because I think it would be a very interesting study to see the different home invasion laws of different states. quote]
Well, I'll fill you in on the Great State of Florida, and it's very simple- If you are fearfull for your life or bodily harm-shoot to kill. No need to even attempt to retreat. The "Stand Your Ground" or "Meet Force with Force" law is the same for your home, car, or any public place in which you are lawfully allowed to be. You are sheilded from ANY criminal OR CIVIL action against you. They cannot even detain you unless there is probable cause to the contrary of the above guidelines.
I am sure both comifornia senators and bad guys alike are stunned that good red blooded americans are allowed to defend therselves in other parts of the country.
Yeah people in CA don't have rights.
My favorite home defense law in other states is the 'Make my day law'.
My favorite home defense law in other states is the 'Make my day law'.
What? California law is very similar to almost every other state in the union. As the excerpt above shows, deadly force is justifed whenever you have a reasonable fear of death or serious injury. Almost every other state in the union has pretty much the same law.bobbfwed said:I want to bring this post back from the dead, because I think it would be a very interesting study to see the different home invasion laws of different states. California sucks A$$ when it comes to home invasion.
so what is the difference between that example and the castle doctorine laws and whatever florida passed.. Does it go beyond the residence rule?
BTW, CA also has a provision for protecting property against felony acts, but don't expect the DA to be as forgiving as a justifiable homicide due to a home intruder scenario. Maybe during a riot, but other than that...but it is on the books.
Lastly, get the book "How to Own a Gun in CA and stay out of Jail"
really clarifies the legal speak.
BTW, CA also has a provision for protecting property against felony acts, but don't expect the DA to be as forgiving as a justifiable homicide due to a home intruder scenario. Maybe during a riot, but other than that...but it is on the books.
Lastly, get the book "How to Own a Gun in CA and stay out of Jail"
really clarifies the legal speak.
I just ordered the book off Amazon. I really want to read up on this. Not that I'm too paranoid, but I like knowing when I am breaking the law 8)
you might be surprised on how many transporting laws you are violating. Do it right, and you can damn near keep the gun in your car, but you need to be going to a range or on the way to a "camping trip".
I have a couple of gun range member ship cards on my person which always helps. an empty mag is a gun according to CA law, so those need to be locked away, or in plain sight unloaded (you can have an unloaded gun in sight in CA , but I wouldn't recommend it). It's a good read, do it wrong and the cops can legally take your gun easily.
I have a couple of gun range member ship cards on my person which always helps. an empty mag is a gun according to CA law, so those need to be locked away, or in plain sight unloaded (you can have an unloaded gun in sight in CA , but I wouldn't recommend it). It's a good read, do it wrong and the cops can legally take your gun easily.
Well, that's...ehr...annoying.
I want a state where my car is an extension of my home.
I'm working on getting my concieled weapons permit..so I'll be able to carry in my car, and other places (obviously). That'll help some of the annoyance.
I want a state where my car is an extension of my home.
I'm working on getting my concieled weapons permit..so I'll be able to carry in my car, and other places (obviously). That'll help some of the annoyance.
Any lawyers here want to chime in the USSC ruling on no-knock searches? Seems to me giving the POs a green light to use their discretion when they do no-knock searches exposes them to the HD laws when they screw up and invade the wrong house.
I have some simpathy with the POs who don't want to see bad guys excused on technicalities, but being on the receiving end of a wrong address DEA raid in 1979 I'm not inclined to give them such discretion.
I'm afraid that any homeowner who is invaded by mistake is toast.
I can also see trouble ahead with mistaken identities if there is pressure to crack down on illegal immigrants. There are a lot of identical names around.
Combine that with the nightmare scenario of greedy developers and the USSC's eminent domain ruling and I can see somebody setting up a middle of the night SWAT team visit to force a HD disaster and acquire land for cheap. Ah, maybe farfetched, but after Fidel consolidated power in Cuba he set up neighborhood commie informants to keep an eye on subversives. All you had to do if you wanted your neighbor's house was to drop a dime on him with the neighborhood commie and he would disappear. You would then move in. With POs looking to cash in on drug industry cars, guns, etc., I can see how somebody may want to sick em into an innocent house.
I have some simpathy with the POs who don't want to see bad guys excused on technicalities, but being on the receiving end of a wrong address DEA raid in 1979 I'm not inclined to give them such discretion.
I'm afraid that any homeowner who is invaded by mistake is toast.
I can also see trouble ahead with mistaken identities if there is pressure to crack down on illegal immigrants. There are a lot of identical names around.
Combine that with the nightmare scenario of greedy developers and the USSC's eminent domain ruling and I can see somebody setting up a middle of the night SWAT team visit to force a HD disaster and acquire land for cheap. Ah, maybe farfetched, but after Fidel consolidated power in Cuba he set up neighborhood commie informants to keep an eye on subversives. All you had to do if you wanted your neighbor's house was to drop a dime on him with the neighborhood commie and he would disappear. You would then move in. With POs looking to cash in on drug industry cars, guns, etc., I can see how somebody may want to sick em into an innocent house.
I agree with battlecry..
This "no-knock" thing is gonna be BAD.
All it takes, is one of us to piss-off some gun-hating resident of our community, and a phone call is made, stating we're dealing drugs, child porn, etc... and guess what? a late-nite or early morning 'raid' on our home. 2 dead police officers, probably a few wounded persons, and the primary resident shot dead.
So, exactly how, as gun-toting, law-abideing citizens aupposed to handle a home invaision scenario now? We don't know *WHO* is coming thru that door, and personally, if the lead guy has a gun, he's getting 2rounds of 00 thrown at him. BAD IDEA all around....
My police buddies are saying it could get to the point (in the interest of safety) to have to register yourself, and your firearms with your local PD. Just to make sure nothing like this happens. (the thinking is, that if they know there's guns present, they WILL knock and announce themselves first)
I guess we'll see....
This "no-knock" thing is gonna be BAD.
All it takes, is one of us to piss-off some gun-hating resident of our community, and a phone call is made, stating we're dealing drugs, child porn, etc... and guess what? a late-nite or early morning 'raid' on our home. 2 dead police officers, probably a few wounded persons, and the primary resident shot dead.
So, exactly how, as gun-toting, law-abideing citizens aupposed to handle a home invaision scenario now? We don't know *WHO* is coming thru that door, and personally, if the lead guy has a gun, he's getting 2rounds of 00 thrown at him. BAD IDEA all around....
My police buddies are saying it could get to the point (in the interest of safety) to have to register yourself, and your firearms with your local PD. Just to make sure nothing like this happens. (the thinking is, that if they know there's guns present, they WILL knock and announce themselves first)
I guess we'll see....
The SC's decision make me question the wisdom of relying on a forend light (e.g., surefire) to identify an intruder. If you point your SG barrel at a police officer to see who it is with your forend light, he could justifiably shoot you. Maybe we should all wear helmet lights instead.leftlaneguy said:I agree with battlecry..
This "no-knock" thing is gonna be BAD.
All it takes, is one of us to piss-off some gun-hating resident of our community, and a phone call is made, stating we're dealing drugs, child porn, etc... and guess what? a late-nite or early morning 'raid' on our home. 2 dead police officers, probably a few wounded persons, and the primary resident shot dead.
So, exactly how, as gun-toting, law-abideing citizens aupposed to handle a home invaision scenario now? We don't know *WHO* is coming thru that door, and personally, if the lead guy has a gun, he's getting 2rounds of 00 thrown at him. BAD IDEA all around....
My police buddies are saying it could get to the point (in the interest of safety) to have to register yourself, and your firearms with your local PD. Just to make sure nothing like this happens. (the thinking is, that if they know there's guns present, they WILL knock and announce themselves first)
I guess we'll see....
Unless you are in NOLA, where it just makes it easier for the POs to locate the guns when it rains on their way to Las Vegas...leftlaneguy said:(the thinking is, that if they know there's guns present, they WILL knock and announce themselves first)
Well, I believe another USSC ruling said that since bad guys can dress up as POs, even if you ID them with a light, you are not required to believe they are POs. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but that is the way I read that.The SC's decision make me question the wisdom of relying on a forend light (e.g., surefire) to identify an intruder. If you point your SG barrel at a police officer to see who it is with your forend light, he could justifiably shoot you. Maybe we should all wear helmet lights instead.
Is that a setup or what?
concelaed carry laws are funny things having a permit i was told means that the gun has to be onyour person in your car not on the seat or under the seat glove box etc
On your person or on the seat next to you is better than in your trunk, locked up, with ammo separate, and also locked up. It is also, in general more convenient, as when I go shooting, I don't have to be so carefull about make sure every gun box is unloaded and the ammo isn't with the guns (as I usually have setup when I go shooting).
More cali laws (from Wikipedia):
EDITS: Fixed formatting
All...fun stuff.California has some of the strictest gun control laws of the United States. The Roberti-Roos Assault Weapons Control Act of 1989, its subsequent augmentation in 1999, and the .50 Caliber BMG Regulation Act of 2004 has led to many restrictions on semi-automatic firearms. In addition to a lengthy list of specific firearms that are banned by name, the following firearms are banned by characteristic:
(1) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
* (A) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon.
* (B) A thumbhole stock.
* (C) A folding or telescoping stock.
* (D) A grenade launcher or flare launcher.
* (E) A flash suppressor.
* (F) A forward pistol grip.
(2) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has a fixed magazine with the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(3) A semiautomatic, centerfire rifle that has an overall length of less than 30 inches.
(4) A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
* (A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.
* (B) A second handgrip.
* (C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning his or her hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
* (D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.
(5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
(6) A semiautomatic shotgun that has both of the following:
* (A) A folding or telescoping stock.
* (B) A pistol grip that protrudes conspicuously beneath the action of the weapon, thumbhole stock, or vertical handgrip.
(7) A semiautomatic shotgun that has the ability to accept a detachable magazine.
(8) Any shotgun with a revolving cylinder.
There are also numerous other laws, such as prohibition on possession of tracer ammunition, handgun armor piercing ammunition, .50 BMG rifles, and the sale or transfer of magazines with a capacity of over 10 rounds. All rifles are normally exempt for the original owner if properly registered at the time of the acts which prohibited them.
EDITS: Fixed formatting
I saw nothing in there about having a shotgun with a grenade launcher :twisted:
hehe....I need it for hunting officer! :twisted: 8)
hehe....I need it for hunting officer! :twisted: 8)
Just a quick question, maybe someone knows off hand (it wasn't specifically listed in that list).
In California, are pump shotguns allowed to have a telescoping stock and a pistol grip (how 'bout a side saddle too)?
I thought I read at some point (a while back) that you are only allowed to have one of those...but I could be wrong.
In California, are pump shotguns allowed to have a telescoping stock and a pistol grip (how 'bout a side saddle too)?
I thought I read at some point (a while back) that you are only allowed to have one of those...but I could be wrong.
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
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