Shotgun Forum banner
1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
196 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I stopped by my local lgs and they had the above gun for $225.00? What's it worth? Is it worth buying and can one find parts if needed. It's choked F,M. It says exc disribution- outdoor sports made in Italy . Help a guy out looking for a gun for my daughter? Maybe not worth the trouble?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,107 Posts
Might depend upon when it was made. I had one about 20 years ago that was made in italy and it was not a poorly made gun. F/M is not a generally useful choke for me. I expect parts will be hard to come by. Many different guns have been imported under ;the Charles Daly name and I do not know if all the Italian guns were as good as the one I had. It worked well and held up well for the time I had it. The era of mine they were about 500 or so new with fixed chokes and a bit more with screw in chokes. You could maybe look at some older Gun Bibles and find one like it.

Mine was a 20 gauge and was the lightest, hardest kicking, tightest shooting, 20 gauge I have seen except for my Win 37 single shot. After a dove hunt with some Texas dove loads I sold the CD to a rabbit hunter who wanted a light gun to carry and only shot it a couple times a day.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20,543 Posts
deadeye8 said:
I stopped by my local lgs and they had the above gun for $225.00? What's it worth? Is it worth buying and can one find parts if needed. It's choked F,M. It says exc disribution- outdoor sports made in Italy . Help a guy out looking for a gun for my daughter? Maybe not worth the trouble?
You don't say anything about the condition, but you probably won't find an O/U shotgun that actually works for any cheaper price. Any chance that the lgs would let you try it out for functioning? Or perhaps give you a 7 day money back guarantee if it doesn't work?

If so, it might be worth the gamble to buy it. However, the bigger question is what does your daughter intend to use the gun for and how serious is she about using it. If she intends to get into skeet or sporting clays, even on a fairly casual basis, it might not be worth the risk of disappointing her.

But, if it's just something for her to play around with and no big deal if it turns out to be a dud, then I'd probably gamble $225 (or thereabouts) on it. Just keep in mind that you could lose most if not all your investment if the gun turns out to be a dud.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
196 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
For my daughter it would be used for hunting upland game, occasionally for ducks and geese. Maybe 50-100 a season for clays, mild use. The wood is good it needs a good cleaning and its on consignment to this shop. I asked if there was room on the price but was shot down. The bores are clean no pitting and the blue is 95%. I didn't ask about a 7 day return if it doesn't work..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20,543 Posts
deadeye8 said:
For my daughter it would be used for hunting upland game, occasionally for ducks and geese. Maybe 50-100 a season for clays, mild use. The wood is good it needs a good cleaning and its on consignment to this shop. I asked if there was room on the price but was shot down. The bores are clean no pitting and the blue is 95%. I didn't ask about a 7 day return if it doesn't work..
Well, for those uses, if the gun shoots when you pull the trigger and the shot goes somewhere near to where the gun was aimed/pointed, then I'd think that it's worth $225. I'd just tell the lgs that if the gun doesn't function or if it shoots WAY off from the point of aim, then I want my money back immediately since I don't want to buy someone's broken junk. If he is unwilling to give you a 7 day "functioning" guarantee, then look elsewhere.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
196 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Ulysses any idea if these are with anything or a piece of crap like some of the other cheap guns?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,107 Posts
If it is the same model CD that I had it is a well made gun. Way better than Turkish guns that CD imported later. Not quite as good as the Japanese guns they imported before the Italian guns. Not sure I think you can get a "trial" period. If you can use a gun in that configuration get it. It is heads and shoulders better than some of the other cheap O/U's out there. Price sounds good to me. Not sure about shooting steel in the fixed full choke though.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20,543 Posts
Deadeye8,

I have no personal experience with these guns, but everything I've read leads me to believe that they are acceptable/decent field guns. As already mentioned, parts replacement might be a problem if something breaks, but with the occasional use that you mentioned, the chances of breaking a critical part are slim, IMO.

Bill M. makes some good points and he has experience with this type manufacture gun.

Bottom line, I'd buy the gun in a minute if the lgs would give me a 24 hour functioning guarantee (assuming I could test the gun within 24 hours). As I said, based on your description, if it goes bang when you pull the trigger, it's worth $225 and possibly considerably more.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,624 Posts
deadeye8,

Remove the barrels from the frame and look at the proof marks on the monobloc and frame. Are the proof marks Italian or Turkish? Regardless of the Charles Daly name on the barrels, there may be a makers mark amongst the proof marks.

Look closely at the standing breechface. Have cartridge heads scored the breechface? I've seen some low price point Brescia made O/U's (not necessarily Daly) that had headspace/chamber issues that resulted in vicious recoil. IIRC, these were all earlier low end crossbolted actions, not the later underbolted Brescia actions.

Depending on condition and maker, an Italian made Daly at that price may be a good deal. I would hesitate if its early Turkish production. JMO.

DF

Montani Semper Liberi
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
196 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Explain cross bolt vs under bolt? Do you mean Greener style this one has a standard monoblock..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,624 Posts
Yes, in this case, crossbolt refers to a modified Greener wedge-type bolt having a flat underside. The crossbolt engages dual Purdey extensions which protrude from the breech end of the monobloc and nest into slots in the standing breech. A number of Italian makers employed this type of lock-up together with a low profile frame in which the barrels pivoted on trunnions rather than a hinge pin. A current example of this crossbolted action is the Beretta DT-11.

The type of action currently in favor with a number of the Gardone gunmakers is the so-called Brescia action. The barrels of this action also pivot on trunnions but, the barrels are secured to the standing breech by means of a sliding underbolt which engages a bite in a divided underlug at the bottom rear of the monobloc. This lock-up is similar to the Browning B-25 and Miroku B-725 although the latter two makes have barrels pivoting on a hinge pin and have somewhat higher frames.

From your description, the gun in question appears to employ the current "Brescia" action.

DF

Montani Semper Liberi
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
196 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
By looking at it again it's a Brescia action From what you guys describe above. My question should I need parts in the future am I SOL? The gun isn't perfect it has some blueing wear the breechface is clean, the gun needs a good cleaning. The lever is close to center if that should be of worry the mono bloc and breech are tight no gap or wiggle when closed? The wood is in good shape.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,624 Posts
What importer's name and city appears on the gun? Is it Kassnar or just Charles Daly? The Charles Daly Field II O/U's were built by Sabatti SpA in Italy. I'm not sure as to who made the Field III. All guns imported into the States must have the country of origin stamped on the barrel(s) or frame. If "made in Italy" appears on the gun, it was most likely built by Sabatti. Another possible Italian source for Field III could FAIR, SpA. Both firms are active and may be able to supply parts. You may want to send Sabatti and FAIR an e-mail ([email protected]) ([email protected]) with the serial number and enquire regarding parts availability. Also, check with Numrich Gun Parts as they purchased many of the Italian made CD parts when Kassnar went under.

The Sabatti maker's mark is a muzzle end view of a rifled barrel with crosshairs and a stylized letter "S" all within a circle. FAIR's trademark is their company name within an oval with two geese at bottom center although, sometimes only the name "FAIR" appears on the frame sides.

Again, if the gun is Italian made and in decent condition, it should be worth the price.

If the gun was made in Turkey, perhaps someone on the SGW Turkish Gun forum may be able to help.

DF

Montani Semper Liberi
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
196 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Dopple....The gun says made in Italy. I see +Sgf+ plus on the frame side, the mono block has the following proof mark looks like crossed guns inside a shield? With psf finito with a star inside a circle I also see "an" inside of a box? Thanks for the help it buy the gun tonight FYI but it would be nice to get more info...thanks for your help..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
196 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Dopple....The gun says made in Italy. I see +Sgf+ plus on the frame side, the mono block has the following proof mark looks like crossed guns inside a shield? With psf finito with a star inside a circle I also see "an" inside of a box? Thanks for the help it buy the gun tonight FYI but it would be nice to get more info...thanks for your help..it says Charles Daly made in Italy on one side the other side says Exc-distributer outdoor sports HQ Dayton, oh
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,624 Posts
The PSF Finito and a star inside a circle is the Gardone V.T. final smokeless powder proof. The letters "AN" within a box is the proof date code for 1985.

Sloans Sporting Goods in New York had imported the Miroku made Dalys until Browning cut a deal with Miroku to produce the Citori ( I used to have a Miroku made Charles Daly Model 90 single barrel trap which was the predecessor to the Miroku-Browning BT-99 ). Sloans continued to import guns from Italy and Spain. Outdoor Sports HQ in Dayton, OH acquired the rights to the Daly name in 1976. Unable to import Miroku, OSHQ sourced their guns from Italy but, I don't know from which maker. The Daly name was later sold to Jerry's Sport Center in Pennsylvania then (1996) to KBI (Kassnar) in Harrisburg, PA. who sourced O/U's from Sabatti. I believe the Daly name has changed hands twice since then.

Sorry, I can't tell you for sure which Italian maker built the gun in question.

DF

Montani Semper Liberi
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
196 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Well I finally had a chance to take the new gun for a spin on some trap and hit 20 out of 25. Not bad for 26 in barrels it swings lively and quick I lost one bird just blew right past it and lost one trying the top barrel just checking for function...for $225 not a bad deal...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20,543 Posts
deadeye8 said:
Well I finally had a chance to take the new gun for a spin on some trap and hit 20 out of 25. Not bad for 26 in barrels it swings lively and quick I lost one bird just blew right past it and lost one trying the top barrel just checking for function...for $225 not a bad deal...
Thanks for letting us know what you decided. I think you made a good purchase. I was wondering if you were going to buy it or just think about it until someone else bought it. :)
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,204 Posts
Be advised that the duck loads with nontoxic steel shot shot should NOT be used in a full choke. (Bismuth shot is OK, as are some other "nontox" alternatives.)

Chokes should be no tighter than Mod for steel, as they won't compress enough through a tighter choke and will bulge barrels near the choke. For steel, they pattern much tighter than lead shot, and most guys use IC for decoying ducks, and Mod for longer range pass shooting.
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top