[sgtdw]

I have a IZH-27 shotgun in 20 ga. I love the gun but after extended firing sessions my cheek bone is brusied. I'm 5'10 and weigh 250 lbs. When shooting I'm having to tilt by head down so that I can see right down the rib if not I'm looking down on the front bead. I have heard that my comb could be too high and this can be fixed by sanding the top of the stock down until the correct sight picture can be established. I'm a little apprehensive in doing this my self because once it's gone you can't put it back. Does any one have any suggestions. I live around the Beaumont area of Texas.

 

[Guest]

I've seen a few times, where it's tollerable, just extending the length of pull, by adding a recoil pad without cutting off the stock will make all the difference in the world. It gets your cheek farther back so when the gun recoils it doesn't pop back against your cheekbone with that shearing action. IF this helps but you don't like the length, it is a fairly safe bet that triming the comb down a bit and going back to the original length of pull will help considerably.

BP

 

[javven]

I suggest allowing your rear sight guide to drop somewhat. Make sure you get a good roll of cheek (if you're 250 you either bench buicks or you've got em same as me) on the stock.

This means you'll have to 'float' your birds / clays somewhat. Its not hard and you might even like it better.

 

[sgtdw]

Well I don't lift Buicks but I have lifted a small Yugo in my younger days. I'm now content with lifting the remote and drinking ice tea. Javven you stated that I should get a good roll on my stock puzzles me. I have various shotguns and none of them cause this type of pain except my Browning O/U and my recently purchased IZH-27. What did you mean when you stated to float the birds. I'm sure that something can be done to the stock to allow the reciever to come up so that I don't have to lean my head so far over onto the stock. Any suggestions are appreciated.

 

[Burnt Powder]

sgtdw;

If you keep your head up higher on the stock, which will take your cheek out of harms way, you will see more of the rib on the barrel. This will in effect have your shotgun pointing up from where you are used to having it point. Maybe 1/2 a pattern or more. If you in fact shoot your gun with this sight picture/barrel position you will indeed miss high the shots you are currently making by having your cheek down tight against the stock and looling directly over a flat rib picture. "Floating" the rock is a term for having an air gap bwetween the tip of your barrel and the rock rather than having the rock either right above or covered with the barrel. Seeing daylight between your barrel and the rock is called "floating the rock"! There are various stick on or strap on pads and comb extensions available to get your face up higher and still allow for something solid for your cheek to fit against allowing a consistant eye/cheek placement on your shotgun from shot to shot. Getting you face farther back from the front/higher part of the comb helps too and you won't need to float the rock either. Either way I'd suggest you give something a try. Either the comb pad or strap on /slip on recoil pad and see if it helps. I have a Charles Daly that will beat hell out of my cheek after about 75 rounds if I try to stay down on the stock. Rather than do either of the things I mentioned, I bought a different shotgun with a totaly different stock configuration so it doesn't recoil back and whack my cheek any more. It doesn't take much of that to get one to loose interest in shooting does it?? I know I really didn't care if I never shot the danged thing again. In the field is one thing, but shooting trap or the like is another altogether!

BP

 

[Tal/IL]

It sounds like you may need a little more drop. Another option that will accomplish the same thing as lowering the stock is to raise the rib. And, unlike cutting on the stock, it can be undone. You can experiment with different thickness balsa wood strips available at hobby shops - 1/8, 3/16, 1/4, etc. Just spray paint it black and attach it to the top of your rib with couble sided tape. When you find the correct thickness you can get an add-on rib, such as an easy-hit, and install it.

 

[Ulysses]

Sgtdw,

From your description, it sounds like the gun may need more cast off and more drop. Contrary to your statement about not being able to add the wood back after it's removed, you can easily add rubber cheek pieces or moleskin to increase the comb height or decrease cast off. This may be BETTER than putting the wood back since it's softer but durable.

With an unloaded gun, try mounting the gun with your head in a comfortable position. Look at the front bead. Now WHERE is your eye looking in relation to the center-rear of the receiver? Is your eye too high? If so, you need more drop. Is your eye to the left side of the center of the receiver. If so, you need more cast off. You obtain cast off by sanding off the left side of the buttstock comb. Of course, you obtain more drop by sanding the top of the comb.

Sand a little at a time and keep rechecking the fit. Once your eye is comfortably behind the middle of the receiver and looking just slightly over the top of the rib, that's about all you can do in the fit department. Oh, of course, I forgot to ask about the Length of Pull (LOP). The length should be adjusted first before any changes are made to drop or cast. I like to have my nose about 1 1/2" from the knuckle at the base of my thumb when the gun is mounted in the shooting position. If it's farther than that, shorten the stock length. If it's less than that, increase the stock length. Minor variations are acceptable if it's comfortable to you.

There is also stock "pitch", but do the above first and we can deal with pitch later, if necessary.

 

[Waterglide]

I am 6'2'' and 330 lbs. and had the same problem, not enough drop and cheek slap. I fixed the drop porblem with a Morgan Butt plate. It fits on the end of the stock, replaces the recoil pad and allows you to put the recoil bad lower relative to the stock, thereby adding more drop at the heel. This gets the entire gun higher and straightens out your head. This also reduces the angle or slope of the top of the stock, almost makes it a parallel stock. With a parallel stock, as the recoils straight back, the stock sort of slides along your cheek. With a sloping stock, higher in the front than the back, as it comes back it the rise hits you harder in the cheek. In my case the recoil pad toe was contacting my chest first instead of the entire length. This causes even more cheek slap as the gun wants to rotate up instead of merely back. After I relieved, sanded, the toe end, the cheep slap is mostly gone.

 

[sgtdw]

Thanks to Ulysses and Waterglide for the suggestions. I measure the LOP and it measured 14 3/8" and the mesurement from my thumb knuckle to the end of my nose is very close to 1 1/2" which Ulysses stated was his preference. I went into my shop and began to sand down the top comb and after removing 1/16" it is starting to come into sight. I am going to return to the range in the next day or two to check it out. It may need additional adjustment, but time will tell. Standing in front of the mirror my eye seems to be in line with the receiver just fine. Why is pitch inportant and what are the results of pitch change.
Waterglide
After reading you comments I am interested in the Mogan Butt Plate. I was holding my shotgun to my shoulder and experimenting with the gun being held up higher on my shoulder which I assume will happen if the adjustable butt plate was installed . Wouldn't you have to increase the cast off to get a proper eye and rib relationship.

Thanks for all the help and suggestions. Darrell

 

[Guest]

Pitch is the vertical angle of the butt end. Lots of shotguns have an almost vertical butt . This assumes you shoulder pocket is verticle, "Large" chested people have chests that stick out. Therefore, the butt must be "pitched" forward at the toe, the bottom part. The toe of the butt should not contact the chest or lower shoulder first. This will cause more barrel rise upon recoil than if the butt pad contacts properly. Either the pitch can be changed by cutting or sanding the rubber on the butt plate or cutting the wood. You can add washers under the top of the recoil plate to give that a try.
Also, the crease in your shoulder is not vertical, usually slopes from left to right , going top to bottom. Stick the gun in your shoulder and wiggle it till it is stabilized in your shoulder pocket, chances are, the barrel rib will be canted to the left. The Morgan butt plates goes up and down , you can rotate it but the teeth don't engage but the screw will hold it. I eventually installed a Jones Butt plate that can be moved up and down and rotated to match the crease in you shoulder pocket. Search on Jones butt plate, there is a picture of it in one of the posts. I think it is the post about "Tall Shooters".

 

[Jag]

Sorry to hear that your having problems Sgtdw! Really I am. There is nothing worse than bringing home a new shotgun, taking it out to shoot it , and it kicks the hell out of you, or it just isn't comfortable to shoot. I know your working out your "fit" problem, and I hope it works out. For all those doubters about the "GUNFIT" argument, This is testimony that if the gun doesn't fit you either leave it on the rack, or take it to a competent gunsmith to fit it properly for you. Good luck SgtDW, I hope it works out for you.

 

[sgtdw]

Just a little note to everyone who was good enough to send their suggestions to me in reference to the cheek bone bruising.
I trimmed down my comb to lessen the overall angle and am very pleased with it's result. I refinished the portion of the stock altered by using Olympic Interior Oil Base Stain in their Special Walnut color then placed three coats of Truoil over the entire stock. Once dried I buffed it with 000 steel wool to remove the excess shine and now the stock looks barnd new again.
Thanks to everyone for their suggestions it has been a great help.
May the sun be always at your back on the range [/quote]

 

[Ulysses]

Thanks for posting a followup to let us know your results. :lol:

 

[Jag]

Good Deal sgtdw! Love to hear happy endings!!!!