[Jim Tyner]

Billions of pixels have been burned and hundreds of trees have died so that people could write about eye dominance in shooting sports. That’s quite amazing when you consider that most of these writings have started with the simplicity of holding your thumb up and looking through it with each eye.

However, with sophisticated eye tracking technology we can see, (no pun intended) that our eyes are playing all types of tricks on us at lightning speed. Then it is left to our brains to try to figure out which eye is telling the truth and which eye is lying at any particular millisecond in time.

Eye tracking metrics are segmented into three main areas. Fixation refers to the ability to focus, (gaze) with either one eye or both eyes simultaneously on a fixed point. Saccades, (suh cods) refers to the ability to change focus between two different points and Pursuits refers to the ability to track a moving object through space such as a clay target.

Using the RightEye System, which is the gold standard in vision tracking analytics, I have produced the two images below, one measuring vertical pursuits which test the ability of following an object up and down in a vertical and horizontal pursuits which test the ability to follow an object in a horizontal plane. The lines are produced by the RightEye System sampling each eye's gaze position in relationship to a moving target 90 times per second.

The two metrics you see below each present two scores. The first, SP “%”, is the percentage of the time that the eye is tracking within 1 mm of the centerline. The Efficiency score is in millimeters which is the distance that the eyes’ gaze, (focus point) is from the track of the target. For reference, 10 mm is approximately four tenths of an inch. In that these tests are done with the eyes approximately 2 feet from the screen, you can calculate how far off the eyes might be at 35 yards. Obviously, our brains have a lot of averaging to do. It’s reasonable to assume that on some targets this process of averaging breaks down and can interfere with the correct pointing of the gun. This is not a dominant eye issue, it is a sight data interpretation issue caused by eye tracking errors.

Our eyes’ ability to track either singularly or as a pair, is controlled by the six muscles of each eye and how closely they can work in unison to coordinate the eyes. Fortunately, often when there are deficiencies in these muscles, there are eye exercises that can be undertaken to correct these muscle deficiencies. Failing that, there are adjustments to eyeglass prescriptions that can compensate. However, like all muscles in the body, an individual’s eye muscles can only be trained a to a certain level of performance.

I have also attached a PDF that explains these concepts and more in a more detailed manner so if you have an interest in this, download the PDF for your own review. After reading it, I am confident that you will realize that there is a lot more to how we “see” a target than a simple eye dominance test can ever reveal. Further, that trying to “fix” cross-firing is far more complex a challenge than some would like to lead you to believe and that certainly shooting with two eyes, if they are sending bad data to the brain, is not always the best method to pursue.

 

[thor_sen]

…. with sophisticated eye tracking technology we can see, (no pun intended) that our eyes are playing all types of tricks on us at lightning speed. Then it is left to our brains to try to figure out which eye is telling the truth and which eye is lying at any particular millisecond in time.…

Gil & Vicki Ash approve of this ^post^

 

[Vette Jockey2]

Gil & Vicki Ash approve of this ^post^

Well, boy, howdy! With that endorsement and 3 bucks, you can get a cup of coffee anywhere in town.
I'm sorry. I'm mistaken; you can't get a cup of coffee at Starbucks for $3.

 

[Drew Hause]

re: Gil Ash, these statements are factually in error
Center Vision and Weak Eye Dominance
When you close an eye you do lose depth perception but more importantly your perceived lead will double or even triple.
A two eyed lead is as much as half or more LESS than a one eyed lead.
When we take shooters from one eyed to two once they understand the sight picture and can replicate it we tell them to cut their lead in half and they are instantly successful!!
The targets seem 1/3 smaller and 35% faster with one eye than with two eyes.
Dominance shifts are most often caused by shooters trying to be perfect in the set up by double checking the muzzle placement in the hold point.


Binocular summation refers to the improved visual performance of binocular vision compared to that of monocular vision.
Improvement has been well established in brightness perception, flicker perception, contrast sensitivity, peripheral visual field, response time, and visual acuity - by about 11%
Some people may perceive a difference in size and speed of a moving object two vs. one eye; but like visual acuity from binocular summation, the difference is no more than about 10%.

 

[dogchaser37]

I am missing something.....I understand what Drew Hause has explained.....but what does the OP's post have to do with eye dominance?

You shouldn't be moving your eyes only when you shoot, because then the shotgun isn't where it's supposed to be.

I get it, eyes before gun movement, but once you see the target the gun has to be moving with the eyes or you aren't going to be shooting where you are looking. To make the gun and eyes move together, the gun, eyes, head, shoulders etc. all have to be locked together. You aren't moving your eyeballs around, at least you better not be.

 

[dogchaser37]

FWIW if you are having trouble moving your eyes, you can see all the different problems that incorrect eye movements cause.

 

[25straightmisses]

I am missing something.....I understand what Drew Hause has explained.....but what does the OP's post have to do with eye dominance?

You shouldn't be moving your eyes only when you shoot, because then the shotgun isn't where it's supposed to be.

I get it, eyes before gun movement, but once you see the target the gun has to be moving with the eyes or you aren't going to be shooting where you are looking. To make the gun and eyes move together, the gun, eyes, head, shoulders etc. all have to be locked together.

You will still be using smooth pursuit eye movement even when you are moving your head, body, shotgun, etc. with the target. Therefore I would assume that the eyes would be subject to the scenario described in the OP.

 

[dogchaser37]

The issues that the OP has addressed, have a pile of side effects. The documents he posted tell you that. Do you have any of those side effects?

You can listen to that nonsense if you want, but to me you are heading down a bad road.

I think I'll stick with my eye doc.

 

[25straightmisses]

The issues that the OP has addressed, have a pile of side effects. The documents he posted tell you that. Do you have any of those side effects?

You can listen to that nonsense if you want, but to me you are heading down a bad road.

I think I'll stick with my eye doc.

Oh I believe the original post is a top-tier form of over complication. I’m here for the entertainment.

 

[Notch15]

re: Gil Ash, these statements are factually in error
Center Vision and Weak Eye Dominance
When you close an eye you do lose depth perception but more importantly your perceived lead will double or even triple.
A two eyed lead is as much as half or more LESS than a one eyed lead.
When we take shooters from one eyed to two once they understand the sight picture and can replicate it we tell them to cut their lead in half and they are instantly successful!!
The targets seem 1/3 smaller and 35% faster with one eye than with two eyes.
Dominance shifts are most often caused by shooters trying to be perfect in the set up by double checking the muzzle placement in the hold point.


Binocular summation refers to the improved visual performance of binocular vision compared to that of monocular vision.
Improvement has been well established in brightness perception, flicker perception, contrast sensitivity, peripheral visual field, response time, and visual acuity - by about 11%
Some people may perceive a difference in size and speed of a moving object two vs. one eye; but like visual acuity from binocular summation, the difference is no more than about 10%.

"The targets seem 1/3 smaller and 35% faster with one eye than with two eyes."

Source?

 

[Notch15]

I am missing something.....I understand what Drew Hause has explained.....but what does the OP's post have to do with eye dominance?

You shouldn't be moving your eyes only when you shoot, because then the shotgun isn't where it's supposed to be.

I get it, eyes before gun movement, but once you see the target the gun has to be moving with the eyes or you aren't going to be shooting where you are looking. To make the gun and eyes move together, the gun, eyes, head, shoulders etc. all have to be locked together. You aren't moving your eyeballs around, at least you better not be.

"...but once you see the target the gun has to be moving with the eyes or you aren't going to be shooting where you are looking."

The gun shoots where it is pointed. If you focus on a target that requires lead then the gun isn't shooting where you're looking.

 

[Jim Tyner]

You can listen to that nonsense if you want, but to me you are heading down a bad road.

Nonsense? Virtually every Major League Baseball team uses the RightEye System for continuing vision analysis of their players. The MLB player combines run all the potential draft choices through it. Because of the large assessment database, it can tell a team how each player compares to the average A, AA, AAA , major and elite major league players in their ball tracking ability. They then can have vision therapy regimens created to improve the deficiencies that are presented in the assessments.

I had a chat with the vision therapist for the Cincy Reds. He relayed an anecdote about a top rated prospect in their farm system who could hit every pitch except the ones over the middle of the plate. Using the RightEye System they were able to identify the deficiency causing that and correct it. His batting average went from .192 to .307. That bad road turned out extremely well for him.

 

[Jim Tyner]

The gun shoots where it is pointed. If you focus on a target that requires lead then the gun isn't shooting where you're looking.

Ya know, the brain is a marvelous computer. Think about an outfielder. The batter hits the ball and the outfielder almost immediately starts running to the point where that ball is going to come down. While he is running and tracking the ball with his eyes, the brain is calculating the ball's trajectory and modifying the running path to intercept the ball's trajectory when it will be about 6 feet of the ground. This is al based on the brain learning from past experiences of the thousand's of fly balls that player has caught over the year and then applying that to the data coming from the player's eyes for the one in the air.

Our eyes do the same thing with a clay target. While our brain can recognize a particular target presentation, it still has to get correct tacking data from the eyes to correctly apply that learned knowledge to that particular target.

 

[Notch15]

Ya know, the brain is a marvelous computer. Think about an outfielder. The batter hits the ball and the outfielder almost immediately starts running to the point where that ball is going to come down. While he is running and tracking the ball with his eyes, the brain is calculating the ball's trajectory and modifying the running path to intercept the ball's trajectory when it will be about 6 feet of the ground. This is al based on the brain learning from past experiences of the thousand's of fly balls that player has caught over the year and then applying that to the data coming from the player's eyes for the one in the air.

Our eyes do the same thing with a clay target. While our brain can recognize a particular target presentation, it still has to get correct tacking data from the eyes to correctly apply that learned knowledge to that particular target.

Oh, I know that accurate tracking data is imperative. That's why accurate peripheral vision is important.

My comment on "shoots where you look" is simply clarifying reality.

 

[Frank12us]

Personal experience from a left eye dominant /right handed shooter. Results are roughly equivalent, but Option 1 is a lot more stressful.

Option 1: Go down the rabbit hole.
Option 2: KISS... look at the bird with both eyes open, mount the gun, shoot the bird.

 

[Coach Super-X]

And how many hundreds of dollars do you charge for this "tracking analysis," Jim?

And so what if your "analysis" says a tester has "defective" tracking ability? We are not major league ball clubs trying to decide on who to offer a $5M signing bonus to. We are just people trying to have fun.

Sorry, but I get sick of the hucksters.

 

[Drew Hause]

Frank: your options seem so easy, but what if Option 2 isn't working for a 60 year old man who has enjoyed shooting much of his adult life and suddenly can't hit a target because he has shifted dominance? Try harder? Give up and play golf?
An interesting poll
Poll: Corrective measures that have resolved my...

I believe those interested in the complicated issues of visual processing are genuinely trying to help.
Phil Kiner, Peter Blakeley and Ed Solomons would be examples
Worried about closing an eye? Don’t be 😉 | Shotgun Forum (shotgunworld.com)

 

[Jim Tyner]

And how many hundreds of dollars do you charge for this "tracking analysis," Jim?

Most RightEye providers using the system for sports vision charge $40 to $100 depending on the number of tests they include in the assessment, the type of sport involved and whether the athlete will be entering a structured vision training program or work through online training exercises on their own. In that the RightEye System is an FDA approved device, the assessment can be covered by Medicare and most vision insurance policies.

As for your huskster comment, The RightEye System is used by several of the most prestigious vision research institutions such as the Cleveland Clinic, Duke University and MIT. It is being used for brain injury therapy and monitoring, early Parkinson diagnosis and even long term affects to the brain like caused by Lyme disease. It utilizes the worldwide patented eye tracking technology developed by Tobii in Sweden(Google them) by taking that data feed and applying proprietary algorithms to generate the reports which constructed by comparing an individuals results to a database of of similar demographic subjects drawn from its master database of over 5,000,000 previous assessments.

The RightEye System is what's called a scientific instrument. It samples what your eyes are actually doing at a rate of 90 time per second. Looking over the shoulders of a bunch of kids trying to learn to shoot and then writing a book full of uniformed and untested opinions to sell to the gullible is I think closer to most peoples definition of hucksterism.

 

[F*W*F]

I believe those interested in the complicated issues of visual processing are genuinely trying to help.
Phil Kiner, Peter Blakeley and Ed Solomons would be examples
Worried about closing an eye? Don’t be 😉 | Shotgun Forum (shotgunworld.com)

How the heck did I miss that discussion? I guess you gotta keep both eyes open around here!

 

[joe kuhn]

Found a provider down the street who might do this test for me. Find a Provider | RightEye I think I'll stop by and see what it costs and if they can help me as a trap shooter. And I see the mfr will do a virtual demo, but I think that's for providers. Request a Demo - RightEye, LLC