Shotgun Forum banner
1 - 20 of 21 Posts

·
Banned
Joined
·
8,378 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I tried something new today. Normally I have my comb rather low so I can sight on a level line down the rib.

A VERY seasoned shooter today asked me to experiment. As I have had shooting problems with my back up gun. I just have never shot it as well. The only real difference is it has a different rib which is wider. (8mm versus 12 by 8mm) He asked me to raise my comb a great deal(a LOT) so I was looking well up above the rib. I thought I wouldn`t hit 5. I missed 2 and both were on fast shots at high 2 and low 6. I worked on those some and got the feel for those.

Anyone use this method for setting up thier gun? It felt radical but I have to admit I could see the clay so much easier. Your head was so much more erect and not nearly as much ...how can I say it...just less tense in my gun hold. I felt less tired and more relaxed. I`ve never really questioned people how they exactly have thier gun set up but I have always thought a figure 8 or close setup to be appropiate. I had extremely hard breaks and we actually raised it some more when I shot the bottom off several clays. His advice was set your gun up on the field not a pattern board. Just use a pattern board to check for a balanced load not impact.

Well.......there is is. Comments?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,643 Posts
Hi Chris - I prefer to use drop at toe (adjustable butt plate) to position the gun so my head is upright...there is probably not a single gun made with a factory stock that will allow anybody with an actual neck to do this.

Once my head is erect with the pad in my shoulder pocket, I then adjust the comb so that with my eye tooth against the comb my on eye is behind the beads and they are stacked BB's. For me that means usually raising the comb (a parallel comb for me) and moving it to the right (rather than cast off). No rolling the head over the gun...this is bad mojo.

Can you shoot with a much higher comb setting...yes, of course. You can also mount the gun so the comb is by your jaw hinge and still hit targets. A shotgun is a proximity weapon. Keeping the gun low and out of the eyes is a good way to get a new shooter to look at the bird and not the end of the barrel...but, in my view once you have developed the habit and feel for looking at nothing but bird, then I want that rib lined up with my eye, not my lower lip.

Cheers
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,773 Posts
Chris, I was under the impression that the comb was set at the patern board. I thought it was the hight of the comb that gave you the percent you want... 50/50... 60/40. I was thinking the heal gives you the heads up position that is better for vision and ballance.

Well, the question was, "How do I set up my gun.'' So, I set the ramp angle with the comb, to give me, or try to give me the pattern I'm looking for, which is, 50/50. I drop and twist the butt to allow me to keep my head straight up on the stock, and set the L-R of the comb to keep my eye at the center of the rib with my head placed firmly down on the comb.

I have a problem keeping my head the same distance from breach lever. Being a rifle shooter, I'm use to the rear site/scope fixing placement of my cheek on the stock. Without knowing it, my head can move back and forth on the comb from mount to mount as much as 2 inches. This creats all kinds of problems... but I'm working on it. I'm going to try putting down a little piece of mole skin to put my cheek on so I know my head is in the correct place fore and aft.

Along with these things to set, there is also the ballace, LOP, Trigger "feel". I'm still working on these along with trying to lower the POI another 4" or so because I'm still floating the birds, and I"m not real good at that.

When I got the tubes the gun felt very nose heavy to me, so I added a lot of wt to the butt. As I got use to the wt of the tubes I have removed wt until I now have none in the aft of the gun.

I'm still trying to figure out the LOP, and think the best solution for me is a Graco butt plate so I can experiment some. Its amazing how litte of a change in LOP can make a huge difference in the "feel" and "speed" of the gun.

bd
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
8,378 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Baron23 said:
Hi Chris - I prefer to use drop at toe (adjustable butt plate) to position the gun so my head is upright...there is probably not a single gun made with a factory stock that will allow anybody with an actual neck to do this.

Once my head is erect with the pad in my shoulder pocket, I then adjust the comb so that with my eye tooth against the comb my on eye is behind the beads and they are stacked BB's. For me that means usually raising the comb (a parallel comb for me) and moving it to the right (rather than cast off). No rolling the head over the gun...this is bad mojo.

Can you shoot with a much higher comb setting...yes, of course. You can also mount the gun so the comb is by your jaw hinge and still hit targets. A shotgun is a proximity weapon. Keeping the gun low and out of the eyes is a good way to get a new shooter to look at the bird and not the end of the barrel...but, in my view once you have developed the habit and feel for looking at nothing but bird, then I want that rib lined up with my eye, not my lower lip.

Cheers
I have adj butt plates on both my guns. Both are set a good inch or so down to help me with a more erect head. Both are #6 parallel stocks with adj combs also.

I`m at that stage where I`m wanting to experiment some. This kind of took me by suprise(REALLY HOW MUCH I LIKED IT) although I know this veteran shooter has done this for many years. I had always just resisted the urge to try it. I`m actually going to give it a try. Its winter and several months before another tourney.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,506 Posts
Ditto on the high road...I want the gun down and out of my way. This goes back to rule #1....eye on the target. If you can't see the target good while you're low down on a gun, you will lift head and in so doing break rule #2...head on the stock.

In my opinion, if you see a level rib, you are way low and I bet you see a good bit of the back of the receiver too....the gun is actually in your line of sight ( great way for the off eye to take over and cross shoot).

The adjustable butt pads really add comfort as they allow for more pad to shoulder contact and spread out the recoil over more area. And as mentioned can be used to take the tilt out of your head....read this as "get your eyes level". It's nice to shoot a gun like you walk around...with your head up, eyes level, and nothing in your line of sight....see it, shoot it.

I can think of no good reason to be low on a shotgun, so I think you're on the right track. There really is something to this gun fit stuff!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
8,378 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Mismost said:
Ditto on the high road...I want the gun down and out of my way. This goes back to rule #1....eye on the target. If you can't see the target good while you're low down on a gun, you will lift head and in so doing break rule #2...head on the stock.

In my opinion, if you see a level rib, you are way low and I bet you see a good bit of the back of the receiver too....the gun is actually in your line of sight ( great way for the off eye to take over and cross shoot).

The adjustable butt pads really add comfort as they allow for more pad to shoulder contact and spread out the recoil over more area. And as mentioned can be used to take the tilt out of your head....read this as "get your eyes level". It's nice to shoot a gun like you walk around...with your head up, eyes level, and nothing in your line of sight....see it, shoot it.

I can think of no good reason to be low on a shotgun, so I think you're on the right track. There really is something to this gun fit stuff!
You really hit in on the head there with seeing the reciever. The 12 by 8 rib is so much larger it seemed to obstruct my view. With the way I tried it today it was almost non existant. And surely much less of a problem.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
311 Posts
So, I just have to ask if you are premounting the gun or shooting Low Gun where you call for the bird with out the gun in your shoulder?

I find my fluidity is much better when I shoot low gun and, my accuracy is better when I shoot mounted.

I like to switch guns a lot (bad habit) but, with my Browning BPS 20ga I find I shoot too high because I don't get my face low enough on the stock due to gun fit being off a bit so, I see a ramped rib when I mount wrong thus shooting over the bird. When I shoot it premounted I don't tend to shoot over the bird as much.

When it comes to my Benelli Nova it feels really good to shoot lowgun as it shoulders much more naturally for me.

My Benelli Supersport has shims that I can use but, I haven't tried yet. After reading this I want to try to play with it a bit but, I am not sure If I need to lower the heel and buy the raised comb or raise the comb?

Most of the time I like to shoot Low Gun because it doesn't give me time to think about any of this stuff. I see the bird, gun touches cheek and bang - dead bird.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
8,378 Posts
Discussion Starter · #10 ·
With the way many of us have our adj butt pads set up it makes pre mount a almost have to. Not saying you positvely can`t shoot low gun but its seldom done. For what its worth I also have a benelli SS. I can assure you its not set up anywhere close to what I`m trying now. I went down that road for seveal years shooting a WIDE variety of guns. It was FUN. And as you had the same results. Skeet is a one gun game.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
311 Posts
cbxchris said:
With the way many of us have our adj butt pads set up it makes pre mount a almost have to. Not saying you positvely can`t shoot low gun but its seldom done. For what its worth I also have a benelli SS. I can assure you its not set up anywhere close to what I`m trying now. I went down that road for seveal years shooting a WIDE variety of guns. It was FUN. And as you had the same results. Skeet is a one gun game.
I have been using my Lanber O/U 20ga with 9 shot for skeet. Works great and it fits pretty good. The lighter weight puts me on the targets real quick.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
311 Posts
MRPOWER said:
And the heavier weight of my Blaser and Perazzi allows me a much smoother move to and with the target, as well as reducing felt recoil.
I use 7/8 oz loads at 1100 fps = really low recoil even in a light gun. And, my low gun approach works great for me on follow through.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,773 Posts
Aiken, have you heard the expression, p**'n into the wind?

Most around these parts (cyber parts that is) are American skeet shooters. American skeet is shot most often, with a pre mount gun. If you are a "fun" shooter, hunter or international skeet shooter, by all means, shoot a light gun from the hip. If you wish to shoot American skeet and have high scores, join the fun and shoot premount with a heavy gun.

There is little sense in debating the issue. There are people on this forum who have shot more than 1000 birds in reg tournaments without a miss... There are many who shoot 100 straight with out even a thought. If you believe you can do it better with low mount and light gun, please, join us at the spring reg shoots, and show how it is done.

High gun is fun too. I started low gun as my family when I was a small boy were low gun shooters, but in Rome, and today's game in most parts of America is American skeet. It soon became apparent that I was missing birds because of mount trouble... so I learned to shoot high gun. Even after eliminating the misses from low gun, I still have 47 other excuses, my favorite of which is, "The sun was on my barrel." Better known as good ol'# 11 but that is another story.

It's a free country, or use to be... I'm getting a bit concerned... but anyway, if you wish to shoot low gun, by all means, have at it, and have fun. You will be out shot on occasion by a preteen shooting high gun... but what the heck. :lol: However, if you want to shoot higher scores... learn to shoot high gun, and a heavy gun will help.

bd
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
661 Posts
CBXChris,
I set up my gun so that my eye is well above the rib; probably a quarter inch. This is because when I have my head lower, I raise my head to see the target better.
A bit of math will convince you that if your line of sight is parallel to the bbl, it does not matter how high your eye is above the rib, within reason. With your eye about an eighth or quarter inch above the rib, you will break the target, even when you tilt the gun up to be parallel with the line of the target. An eight of an inch at 1 yard is 22 eights or less than 3 inches at 22 yards; also a quarter at one yard is just 5 or 6 inches at 22 yards; if you float the target a bit, which keeps it well in view at all times, your eye can be an eight or quarter above the rib and all will go well. Floyd in Vienna
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,453 Posts
It took me over a year to get a buddy (he's a serious shooter but "was" new to skeet) to pattern his shotgun. He, as I suspected, found out he was shooting low - about 10/90. Adjusted the shims (And added a cheek pad) to get him to 50/50 - his scores went from dismal to the low 20s.

Pattern the shotgun - it could also be off left/right.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,610 Posts
To clear up what appears to be a bit of confusion, a gun is best "set up", whether shooting premounted or low-gun, to allow mounting but butt in the shoulder pocket with the top of the heel even or nearly even with the top of the shoulder.

The head and neck should be upright with little or no forward lean of the neck and with the eyes vertically centered in their sockets. The head should not be leaned toward the stock and should be turned only slightly toward the stock.

The height of the eye relative to the gun's rib is what determines the vertical point of impact relative to the gun's point of aim.

Some disciplines are easier for most to shoot with a gun that shoots high, e.g., trap, while other disciplines are easier to shoot with a flat(ter) shooting gun, e.g., sporting clays.

It is the drop at the heel dimension that is increased to allow the neck and head to become upright, not the height of the comb (drop at the comb dimension.) This is where pad adjusters come into their own, doing an excellent job of compensating for a gun mount that is too low or a longer than average neck.

With the head and neck upright, seeing targets is much easier than it is when the head and neck are leaned and tilted forward. This is due to the eyes having to look "up" in their sockets when the head is tilted forward, which creates eye strain and difficulty seeing rising targets.

Moral: Give yourself a break. Keep your head and neck upright and don't crawl the stock. You will probably avoid raising your head, postpone neck and eye fatigue, swing more smoothly and swing more accurately, especially on long swings.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,453 Posts
I see space between my beads and it barely shoots 50/50 - at least on the pattern board. Go figure.

Once upon a time skeet was required to be shot from low gun. I shot that way in the beginning since we were hunters first and just looking for some trigger time. If you are a competator, shooting from gun mounted is the way to go. I might just try a round from low gun, to see if I still can. :shock: :D
 
1 - 20 of 21 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top